Just a question about turnouts.

[Grassyfield]

Hey sorry for this noob question. But just want to ask, is there any sort of particular point motor i should get for n gauge, or is this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et3vuedbZ98 hes using ( PL10E ) good, or should i get a different type. I was just thinking to get what hes using there but want to make sure its ok etc.


Thank you.

[jpendle]

Hi,

So first of all ignore almost everything in that video. The mods that are recommended for Peco OO gauge points are not necessary for Peco N Gauge points regardless of whether you are using DC or DCC.

If you want to switch the frog polarity, rather than relying on blade contact, then I would recommend buying point motors with built in switches such as Tortoise, Cobalt, or MTB. These 3 are also slow acting motor driven as opposed to the Peco which are solenoid activated and snap over very quickly.

I built my first layout with Peco point motors, but after many a frustrating hour trying to get them to work with additional micro switches on a single slip I removed them all and replaced them with Tortoise motors which IMO are much easier to install.

If I were starting again I would probably go for the MTB range as these are smaller than the Tortoise motors.

Regards,

John P

[Ali Smith]

There's nothing actually wrong with Peco point motors: they are cheap and reliable. They are also rather basic and old school. Whilst they don't have a switch for changing frog polarity built in, they are available as a seperate item (PL13) that piggybacks on the motor. Oddly, these don't clip on, you have to glue them in place. I don't like that idea very much, so I use a small cable tie. Although I haven't tried it, I understand that the Peco N-gauge slips don't have enough travel to operate these switches.
Other systems for changing points are servos, available from Peco or MERG, and various purely mechanical methods.
As with many things in this hobby there are several correct answers to a question; you just need to decide which one suits you best.

[Shropshire Lad]

I've been using MTB MP1 point motors and I'm really pleased with them.Easy to fit and if you do muck it up you can adjust them in situ. As John says they have built in switches for frog polarity but they also have end of travel cut out switches so they can be switched without momentary switches and don't need a CDU to help throw them. I have got some Cobalt's as well which work well but are a bit noisy!
Cheers Colin

[chrism]

There's nothing actually wrong with Peco point motors: they are cheap and reliable. They are also rather basic and old school. Whilst they don't have a switch for changing frog polarity built in, they are available as a seperate item (PL13) that piggybacks on the motor. Oddly, these don't clip on, you have to glue them in place. I don't like that idea very much, so I use a small cable tie. Although I haven't tried it, I understand that the Peco N-gauge slips don't have enough travel to operate these switches.

The SEEP PM1 solenoid point motor works the same way as the Peco one, has a built in switch and is cheaper than the Peco one.

As to n-guage points sometimes having too short a travel for the switched to operate, this can be the case, so I hang my SEEPs around an inch below the top of the baseboard (9mm baseboard plus a couple of offcuts stacked above each end of the motor) to allow a bit more flexing of the actuating rod and the switches work fine.

[martyn]

Peco point motors are basic but reliable. I also use cable ties to hold the PL13 switches in position.

The PL13 switches are OK on simple left/right points, but Peco make micro switches which are suitable for single and double slips.

I only use Peco on my layout, which has two double slips back to back, and about 80 other simple points.

As has been said on the Forum elsewhere, there is no need to modify the wiring on the Peco points before installation.

Martyn

[emjaybee]

I heartily endorse everything that's been previously said.

Don't go cutting blades etc like the video says. It's not necessary.

I use unmodified Peco points, electrofrog with Cobalts on DCC.

[Grassyfield]

Hey thank you so much every one, i am really grateful for the help.      

[ntpntpntp]

Good answers have been given above.  Here's my take:

I use Peco PL-10e motors mounted underneath the baseboard (not directly attached to the points). 

I use Code 55 live frog points. You don't have to do this but I always add a feed wire to the frog via a changeover switch to ensure reliable continuity over the long term.  I prefer the PL-13 black slide switch (glued to the bottom of the motor with epoxy).  I've tried the PL-15 twin micro switches and whilst they work they can be fiddly to adjust for N gauge and also I don't like the "back-pressure" they apply to the point rod.

An added complication is the small throw of some of the code 55 points such as the 3-way and the slips: for those I found even the PL-13 can sometimes be tricky to position so that the changeover switch works reliably.  To get round that I've developed my own 3D printed mount for the PL-13 which includes a lever action to magnify the throw seen by the switch. So far these have worked very nicely on my most recently laid trackwork.



 

[Grassyfield]

Do you guys ( for dcc even though its been said it doesnt matter ) mod your peco code 55 turn outs or just add power the frog and not do the cutting/bridging. Thank you.

[Chris Morris]

I use Peco PL10E motors mounted under the baseboard. I have used lots, have taken them from layout to layout and they are very very reliable. On my first N gauge layout I used SEEP points but I had a bad experience as a number of them failed. The most common problem being the failure of the joint between the base and the coil. I also found the switch on the SEEPs is next to useless when using N gauge. I use a latching relay working in conjunction with the point motor to switch the power where I am using Unifrog points. I am considering using the same latching relays on other points to switch polarity so I am not relying on point blade contact. Having said that I'm not sure it is worth doing it because my layout has done nine exhibitions and has had plenty of home use without any serious point blade contact issues. Using a latching relay is cheap , simple and reliable. I use Hongfa HFD3/012-L2 relays from RS Online at £4.90 for 5. Haven't had a failure yet.

[Grassyfield]

Why does this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ugukY6lcn4 and

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et3vuedbZ98 this say that if u want to not rely on the blades you have to bridge and cut the rails, but then im being told if you dont want to rely on the blades tou just have to power the frog and tyhe reason for cutting and bridging is ONLY to stop the risk of the blade touching a oversized wheel or some thing causing a short? Im confused this is irritating. Why dont these people just say power the frog then u dont have to do any thing at all, but never say any thing about the only reason you actually bridge and cut is so you dont get a short from ur wheel touching the other blade4

[Chris Morris]

I have never cut any rails or bridged anything in over 50 years of building layouts and never had a problem. I currently use code 55 electrofrog points and have used code 80 insulfrog in the past.

[Grassyfield]

Im getting conflicting infomation and its doing my head in

[Chris Morris]

If you are using electrofrog points you may well need to use a switching mechanism  but not always. It depends on your track plan. Also are you using DC or DCC?