Dapol v Bachmann GraFar Diesels

[texhorse]

I expect this topic has been tackled before, but I've only recently returned to British diesel modelling.  Who produces the better running model, Dapol or Bachmann / Graham Farish?

I have two Dapol Class 66s at the moment, and one Grafar Class 150.  The latter is far superior in running qualities to the 66s.  Is this usual?  Or perhaps I have two poor runners in the 66s and they are the exception to the rule?

As a matter of interest, if you went to the American market, Bachmann produce the poorest runners in diesel locomotives.  I have a Bachmann SD45 which is only four years old, and already I am considering scrapping it, and using it as a scenic feature, rather than a runner.

Andy

[Sprintex]

You will get plenty of opinions good and bad about both based on people's own experiences, truth is I don't think any particular manufacturer is worse than the other. It tends to be specific models from either that let them down


Paul

[Agrafarfan]

Well I'm not sure about Dapol but a couple of my last Graham Farish purchases I have been more than happy with Especialy the last one a class 101. Also there has been a huge improvement over the last couple of years mainly with Graham Farish but Dapol has improve as well.

As which is better I would say Graham Farish has the edge, as the N gauge manufacturer of the year is something like 55-45% in GF's favour.

I heard the the American Bachmann older stuff is supposed to a bit of a reputation but they have approved as well.

I think the mother company Kader is trying prove that things made in China can be of good quality and they have more or less proved that with Graham Farish in my opinion anyway.

So I say Graham Farish just has the edge over Dapol but then again I haven't got a Dapol yet and I'm no expert just my views.

Ian. 

[PLD]

Opinion seem to be divided, especially Dapol seem to split opinion - some would have you believe everything they do is perfect, other that everything is garbage.

In my experience if you get a good one (and from both 95%++ of the models that have passed through my hands fit in that category) there is little to choose in running qualities. I find that Farish Steam locos tend to need the most attention out of the box to achieve best running (mostly tweaking pick-ups), but Dapol locos seem to be a bit more sensitive to rountine maintenance (regular cleaning, lubricating etc) to maintain good running.

[EtchedPixels]

I expect this topic has been tackled before, but I've only recently returned to British diesel modelling.  Who produces the better running model, Dapol or Bachmann / Graham Farish?

I think it depends on the model and in some cases the year. Neither are perfect. Bachmann models still tend to split gears despite the problem having been there for many years. Dapol have some definite QA problems with their wiring in particular.

Generally speaking I'd say: Dapol produce the better bodywork. Bachmann have more errors on their bodyshells and some are real howlers copied from OO models despite being well known before the 'shrink' to N.

Mechanism wise it varies. Bachmann stuff is predictable. They've got the split gear problems now and then, they had trouble with pickups on a few models but basically they refine a design and stick with it. They now and then screw up in other ways (like the class 220 voyager with too low a top speed) but basically they work.

Dapol has been more variable. Some of the early Dapol was very good like the 73. The early Dapol 66 wasn't great, the later one is really good. There are ones to avoid - the Dapol class 220 voyager, and ones that are brilliant (like the 221 voyager). The newest stuff has (wiring problems aside) been a lot more consistent and standardised in design. They all now have good heavy chassis, reasonable quality power pickup and the like.

Neither of them IMHO are actually to that great a standard compared to some other countries, but UK prices are low, markets are relatively tiny, and that they can produce anything at those prices frequently surprises me.

Alan

[OwL]

I can just see the giant tin opener poised ready to open that giant can'o'worms over this subject!

Joking aside, comparing Dap vs GraFar diesels is like comparing Mercedes vs BMW.
Both have their fans & critics.

Personally i have good points and not so good points about both but their is no clear winner In my opinion.

Lets take the Class 66. Why? Because both manufacturers have released one (who could forget the 2005 arms race to be the first to produce this model!)

Early Dap 66's were inferior in my books, but they progressed the model into the trust worthy model of today.
Farish havent really modified theirs, but why would you with a good sturdy design?
Overall (and owning several models of each company) I would put later Dap models ahead when compared. Early Dapol 66's are terrible. My 2nd worse runner is a Dapol 66(216). It splutters all over the place!
I also haveba later Dapol DRS 66. Its smooth as silk.
Farish 66's are excellent, apart from suffering from the old Farish split gear syndrome.

Early Dapol diesels such as the 73 are hit'n'miss and either work or really dont.
My worst runner is a 1st batch 73 yet my other 73 is ok (being 2nd batch)

The Farish 24 is a good model and a great edition. Farish's best diesel is their Class 60. Beats the pants of Dapol stuff although lets not forget the Dap class 58. I own 2 and both excellent.

At present i feel that Farish hold a slight lead over Dapol in terms of Diesel due to their excellent Blue Pullman, Remodelled 47's, 37's and 08's and of course their blockbusting class 70.

Dapol are not finished on the diesel front yet, as we are still awaiting a class 50, 33 and 59!

At the moment it seems like Dapol 1-1 Farish. (just going into extra time!!)

Great question BTW

[Wayne 56089]

Owning both I find that it is very much 1-1, bachmann won't run as slow as my dapol 56 and 58 but I don't feel as there as fragile as my dapol locos.

[Joker56]

It's more a case of what class you wish to run, which determines Dapol or GF/ Bachmann , I have more GF/B than Dapol & have have had friday afternoon items from both, I also have two Lima class 55s which just about look like Deltics , they also sound like them , we are in a time of strong growth for N gauge as both companies appear to listen to us the customers & take constructive criticism on board , long may it continue, sometimes it's a case of the only game in town , buy what you want to run whoever makes it , as it can always be sent back if faulty, enjoy , don't forget if we don't buy ,they won't make , supply & demand rules these companies

[longbridge]

I have never owned a Dapol Diesel but have to say that the newer GF diesels run every bit as good as the American types that recieve rave reviews from US modellers.

[Newportnobby]

I think at the end of the day you pays yer money and takes yer choice.
The fact remains that by far the largest range is available from Farish and, detailing aside, I have only had one duffer out of the 35 or so I have.
I have to say that Farish have also upped their game on the detail front, and this could be down to Dapol's competition

[simonprelude]

Waiting anxiously for the Dapol 59 (no idea why it's taken so long when surely the 66 is 90% the same) but in my opinion the Dapol offerings are better than the Farish ones.

Farish class 20 split gears, Farish class 90 (yeah electric but hey not much different) split gears, Farish 56 very noisy (and how incorrect is that body).

Dapol 58, lovely model.

I would like a Farish 60 but again waiting for the price of a coal sector one to come below £60.

[Agrippa]

A pity Union Mills don't do diesels.

[Jack]

While Farish do suffer with split gears occasionally, they are easy to replace, and with those made in China you can split the drive axles to change those gears now, (I've just replaced a couple on one of my 3rd generation HST's).

Spares for Farish are easy to get your hands on which is not always the case with Dapol units. Bob at BR Lines had real problems getting spares for a Dapol Railfreight 58 of mine that he gave up and returned the loco at a reduced cost to me.

It will be interesting to see how Dapol's N Gauge will fair in the light of certain Staff changes that have happened recently, along with Dapol's push on those other over sized gauges that they are working on.

[RussellH]

While farish have traditionally been easy to repair, but spares since bachmann are becoming harder to source - seen the prices of brushes?

Meanwhile (some) dapol spares are getting easier to obtain...
http://www.dccsupplies.com/shop/index.php?cPath=731_744_735

Only time will tell where the spare parts saga goes but both dapol and farish need to know that the availability of spares has an effect on their sales - who’s going to buy stuff they cant maintain? - you wouldn’t buy a car you cant get the parts for.

Some may argue you shouldn’t need parts - ideally true but nothing is perfect - and I see a lot of both makers products in need of attention.

Regards
Russ

[EtchedPixels]

While farish have traditionally been easy to repair, but spares since bachmann are becoming harder to source - seen the prices of brushes?

That seems to have been an anomaly as they went out of stock everywhere for a while. Some Bachmann parts like axles are hard to get though. Equally silly things like Dapol loco buffers are easily damaged and hard to get replaced.

Dapol are improving here but they don't really compare to the service of Kato and friends.