Seeing all the new releases from Hornby for 2019 and all the excitement and controversy they have generated, I sometimes wish I had more money, and space. They are producing some wonderful little industrial tank engines which I would love to see in N one day.
N will always be my favourite but being a much smaller market we just don’t get the volume of new releases and they seem to take forever to be produced.
I do actually have some 00, a small collection of locos bought while I was waiting for Farish and Dapol to produce some of my favourites. I occasionally add to this collection when something irresistible is produced.
Does anyone else feel tempted to cross over to the dark side?
:NGF:
No.
Non.
Nein.
Niet.
Part of me does. I always think if I had an aircraft hanger and unlimited funds that I'd go to OO, but then I think I'd still like the long trains in N, and if I really had unlimited resources then I'd go for O.
Given I'm always likely to have practical constraints, and I've got an idea for a c20m long N gauge layout I'm not sure it's ever likely to happen! That and I've got far too much stock I've accrued!
I'm actually not that fussed by the stock so much as things like signals being better, sound provision better, slow speed running being better and so on.
Nope, but then I get most enjoyment from scratch building and model pre grouping so the RTR market doesn't have much affect on me. Also in 'OO' most pre grouping locos I'd need are readily available in either RTR or kit form so where's the fun in that :)
Quote from: Newportnobby on January 08, 2019, 04:12:55 PM
No.
Non.
Nein.
Niet.
take it you still can't make your mind up on this :smiley-laughing:
After dropping some hints, my dear wife bought me one of the Heljan Metropolitan Bo-Bo locomotives. It's a lovely thing.
No use for it, of course, but the range of things available in 00 is amazing and sometimes over-tempting.
Cheers, NeMo
It's the tank engines that tempt me Pecketts, Terriers and the Wainwright class H, I wouldn't be able to scratch build them in N to a reasonable standard.
I will always be grateful to Dapol for doing the Terrier in N though I've got half a dozen.
I did a while ago, when locos pertinent to my East Anglian interest were being announced; B17s (Sandy and Footballer), K3, B12/3, 'Claud', J15, cl15, 16, 24, Cravens and Derby DMUs, 4 wheel railbuses........and also Gresley and Thompson corridor and non-corridor stock.
But I wouldn't be able to model a 'Britannia' or English Electric type 4 with ten on, which I can in N......
Martyn
At the moment locos appearing in N I want in EM, those appearing in 00, I want in N...
OO no not really, HO maybe (more accurate scale/gauge ratio). I do have a handful of HO locos.
To be honest V, as I get older, it's only my eyesight that is considering the move up, until that position becomes untenable, I will soldier on with N
Come to think of it, I've frequently thought that 3mm was possibly the best scale; big enough to give reasonable detail, but still small enough to get an appreciable amount of railway in a given area.
Martyn
Quote from: martyn on January 08, 2019, 05:29:40 PMBut I wouldn't be able to model a 'Britannia' or English Electric type 4 with ten on, which I can in N......
That's similar to the reason that I opted for N when I decided to take up modelling again - size.
I'm making a model of the long-closed Coniston station in the Lake District which, with a little modeller's licence at the extreme ends, I can fit in pretty close to scale length on an 8' long baseboard, but only if I work in N.
Since I don't have a 20' spare room, OO was out of the question.
Nope - while there are some "gaps" I'd like to see filled, I've got plenty enough to be going on for now, and the OO/HO space penalty is not one I'd care to live with.
Now, if a manufacturer suddenly came out with a comprehensive TT range rivalling the current N range, I might be tempted, but that's never going to happen.
I do sometimes play with the idea of an O gauge shunting plank with a Dapol 08.
I suppose I do have the advantage of living in Japan and doing Japanese N gauge as well, where the challenge is to find stuff which *hasn't* been done.
I've had to build a 63ft long shed for my EM gauge layout, I wish that had been 2mm FS...
Must confess I've pre-ordered an Accurascale Deltic in OO.
Given that the scaled-down Bachmann OO effort is still a relatively recent release in N, my thinking was that the chances of a better shaped N model of this iconic beast before I pop my cloggs are pretty slim!
Quote from: silly moo on January 08, 2019, 05:27:47 PM
It's the tank engines that tempt me Pecketts, Terriers and the Wainwright class H, I wouldn't be able to scratch build them in N to a reasonable standard.
I will always be grateful to Dapol for doing the Terrier in N though I've got half a dozen.
Pecketts are also tempting for me.
Especially the class W4 0-4-0ST. :heart2:
there is just so much available in oo that I would very quickly get addicted to collecting stock and go bankrupt if i switched to it
at least in n gauge there are just a few new models each year i want to buy and the range available now is pretty good really with just a few gaps
i do have some euro ho though I confess!
Tim
And there are plenty of models available in N that aren't available in OO so I think it works both ways.
There is all the choice that I need in N, but I have doubted the wisdom of modelling a scale I can't clearly see and/or read. But, I'm finding 4' x 8' isn't enough space for my layout, so I'd have to alter my objective and take a totally different approach to build in OO or HO. So, I buy static models I can see, for display, and soldier on in the ultra-miniature world!
Leon
I've thought about it over the years, especially in HO for American stuff, but there's something about the size of N that just has always appealed to me. I have O-Scale for under the tree at Christmas, and if I was rich with unlimited space I might go that route, but N really is the gauge for me.
I'm sticking with n gauge for a while longer yet but if/when my eyes deteriorate I'll maybe go up a scale
I can go from one extreme to the other :D :D
(http://falconer-family.org.uk/images/wsl/DSCN0835a.JPG)
Quote from: red_death on January 09, 2019, 04:02:12 PM
And there are plenty of models available in N that aren't available in OO so I think it works both ways.
Any examples? I can't think of anything off the top of my head, though my OO knowledge is incomplete, to say the least.
Mind you, on the odd occasion where I find myself browsing OO-related forum content (elsewhere of course :D ), no-one appears satisified with the range available in OO either (or if it is available then it's "wrong" or otherwise unsatisfactory).
I think you should all wash your mouths out with soap :D :NGaugersRule:
Our forthcoming 321s, VEAs, HOAs, Sturgeons, Farish 319, Dapol prototype HST - that is just forthcoming rtr stuff and I'm sure I've missed things.
The Revolution class 92 will arrive long before a decent OO Gauge model.
Dapol's class 67 was much better than the old Lima model Hornby were selling at the time it was released. Similarly the Dapol N Gauge Terrier was a better model than the 4mm scale equivalent.
We do OK on most RTR models. Where we do loose out is when retailers commission models - I'd be suprised if some of Kernow or Hattons wagons get downsized unless someone like Revolution Trains is involved in a bit of arm twisting.
Quote from: railsquid on January 10, 2019, 05:09:48 AM
Quote from: red_death on January 09, 2019, 04:02:12 PM
And there are plenty of models available in N that aren't available in OO so I think it works both ways.
Any examples? I can't think of anything off the top of my head, though my OO knowledge is incomplete, to say the least.
Mind you, on the odd occasion where I find myself browsing OO-related forum content (elsewhere of course :D ), no-one appears satisified with the range available in OO either (or if it is available then it's "wrong" or otherwise unsatisfactory).
My '00' knowledge is now very patchy indeed, but I think Union Mills has favoured us with some splendid locomotives that are not available in '00'. Examples (hopefully!) such as the
Prince of Wales, J38, 7F 'Austin Seven', and the L&SWR Adams 0395. Apologies if any of these are available in '00', possibly from 00 Works.
I have some '00' stuff, mostly Wrenn from years ago, and a few now-regretted purchases from the period when I was disillusioned with British 'N' gauge. It almost never runs nowadays - my Table-Top Railway in British 'N' gauge is far too much fun!
John
Yes indeed. I love your tabletop layout! :thumbsup:
Quote from: railsquid on January 10, 2019, 05:09:48 AM
Quote from: red_death on January 09, 2019, 04:02:12 PM
And there are plenty of models available in N that aren't available in OO so I think it works both ways.
Any examples? I can't think of anything off the top of my head, though my OO knowledge is incomplete, to say the least.
Farish GBRF IIAs spring to mind.
Lots from Revolution's stable (if you consider forthcoming models) though; HOAs, IPAs.
Struggling much beyond that!
Quote from: Bealman on January 10, 2019, 09:39:25 AM
Yes indeed. I love your tabletop layout! :thumbsup:
:thankyousign:
Quote from: tutenkhamunsleeping on January 09, 2019, 01:09:48 PM
Must confess I've pre-ordered an Accurascale Deltic in OO.
Given that the scaled-down Bachmann OO effort is still a relatively recent release in N, my thinking was that the chances of a better shaped N model of this iconic beast before I pop my cloggs are pretty slim!
Now you mention it, I have a TT-scale Deltic :D
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4472/36883357904_742ea61a23_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/YcfRiS)
Lima Class 55 (Deltic) D9003 "Meld" (https://flic.kr/p/YcfRiS) by Rail Squid (https://www.flickr.com/photos/129145651@N06/), on Flickr
Yes as someone just getting back into railway modelling I made the decision to go for N gauge based on limited space available, but there is undoubtedly a much wider range of RTR stuff available in OO/HO...
My interest is the LMS and I was slightly surprised to find that the choice of RTR locos in LMS livery is limited compared to what's available in OO - even the LMS locos that are available in N tend to be in BR early/late livery not LMS.
I presume it reflects what people generally model, and the fact that OO is clearly a much more popular scale, and has the "toy" market to back it up.
BTW I am not from the LMS era myself although I can just remember the last few years of BR steam when I was very small!! :D
more tempted by 0 than 00 :laugh3:
Quote from: chrismann on January 15, 2019, 10:23:45 AMMy interest is the LMS and I was slightly surprised to find that the choice of RTR locos in LMS livery is limited compared to what's available in OO - even the LMS locos that are available in N tend to be in BR early/late livery not LMS.
:hmmm:
The LMS is in fact the
best served of the 'big 4' by the big two RTR manufacturers; and for every loco produced for which LMS livery is appropriate, LMS livery was one of the first batch of releases! Admittedly not all liveries are constantly readily available, from the big name retailers, but they certainly have been produced and can usually be found with a bit of searching...
Quote from: PLD on January 15, 2019, 07:39:54 PM
Quote from: chrismann on January 15, 2019, 10:23:45 AMMy interest is the LMS and I was slightly surprised to find that the choice of RTR locos in LMS livery is limited compared to what's available in OO - even the LMS locos that are available in N tend to be in BR early/late livery not LMS.
:hmmm:
The LMS is in fact the best served of the 'big 4' by the big two RTR manufacturers; and for every loco produced for which LMS livery is appropriate, LMS livery was one of the first batch of releases! Admittedly not all liveries are constantly readily available, from the big name retailers, but they certainly have been produced and can usually be found with a bit of searching...
You may be right about what's been produced in recent years but is now discontinued, I don't know, but right now Graham Farish only offer the Jinty tank and the Fairburn tank in LMS livery (and the not yet released 8F). Dapol have zero LMS locos listed on their website at present (not even in BR livery). Whereas Dapol offer five GWR locos, three Southern and three LNER.
I guess they are simply offering what people currently want to buy. :)
On the plus side I did manage to find a Farish "Black 5" in LMS black at Peter's Spares... maybe I need to hang out on eBay a bit more!
@chrismann (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=7259)
Check out Union Mills (no website) who currently have in stock
0-6-0 tender loco 'Cauliflower' in LMS black
0-8-0 tender loco G2 'Super D' in LMS black
4-4-0 2P class in LMS black
Quote from: Newportnobby on January 15, 2019, 09:20:12 PM
@chrismann (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=7259)
Check out Union Mills (no website) who currently have in stock
0-6-0 tender loco 'Cauliflower' in LMS black
0-8-0 tender loco G2 'Super D' in LMS black
4-4-0 2P class in LMS black
Thank you - I didn't know about Union Mills, I will investigate...
In the garden shed that I have recently had built specifically for railway modelling, I am planning to have two layouts, separated vertically: at the upper level, an OO gauge layout set in the 1930s and at the lower level an N gauge layout set in the 1980s.
Had there been sufficient ready to run rolling stock available for the 1930s in N gauge, I should have had both in N gauge, as, for any given space, one can fit so much more layout into N gauge. Even with an aircraft hanger, one can still fit twice as much in with N gauge.
N gauge has decent availability for what I am planning on modelling (western region BR in the late 1980s), but availability is poor for anything pre-war and inconsistent for other time periods and regions.
Quote from: chrismann on January 15, 2019, 10:23:45 AM
Yes as someone just getting back into railway modelling I made the decision to go for N gauge based on limited space available, but there is undoubtedly a much wider range of RTR stuff available in OO/HO...
My interest is the LMS and I was slightly surprised to find that the choice of RTR locos in LMS livery is limited compared to what's available in OO - even the LMS locos that are available in N tend to be in BR early/late livery not LMS.
I presume it reflects what people generally model, and the fact that OO is clearly a much more popular scale, and has the "toy" market to back it up.
BTW I am not from the LMS era myself although I can just remember the last few years of BR steam when I was very small!! :D
Don't give up on modelling the LMS, if I can do it anyone can, with a little patience you can build up quite a locomotive collection. At the last count I have managed over 20 different classes
Interesting topic...
Pre Bachmann taking over Graham Farish I would have said "yes" - space permitting. However, I would say in terms of looks the current generation of N gauge is almost as good as OO. There are some models in OO I would love to have e.g. Duke of Gloucester.
However, I do not have the physical space to model what I want in OO. HOLLERTON JUNCTION is 5'x3' in N Gauge so I would need a 10'x6' board in OO (approx.). I do often wonder where all these OO models go - there must be people out there with a lot of space.
In pure modelling terms I would not now move away from N. The choice and quality is excellent IMHO. However, the old eyes are not what they were. :(
Paddy
Quote from: martyn on January 08, 2019, 06:19:19 PM
Come to think of it, I've frequently thought that 3mm was possibly the best scale; big enough to give reasonable detail, but still small enough to get an appreciable amount of railway in a given area.
Martyn
Agreed Martyn. I think a British TT system would be almost perfect.
Paddy
Quote from: chrismann on January 15, 2019, 09:28:23 PM
Quote from: Newportnobby on January 15, 2019, 09:20:12 PM
@chrismann (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=7259)
Check out Union Mills (no website) who currently have in stock
0-6-0 tender loco 'Cauliflower' in LMS black
0-8-0 tender loco G2 'Super D' in LMS black
4-4-0 2P class in LMS black
Thank you - I didn't know about Union Mills, I will investigate...
@chrismann (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=7259) I see the LMS black Jinty (Farish 372-210A) is now in the shops
Thank you - I had thought about the Jinty, and I may still get one, though my understanding is they were used more for shunting in goods yards and as a pilot at bigger stations, rather than being in regular use on branch lines - I may be wrong, I need to do more research on that!!
Since I last posted I've managed to find a Farish Black 5 and an (older) 4P Compound in LMS livery, so I'm getting there. :D
There's no mad rush as I'm still to finish my baseboards (working on those today) and then I need to finalise the track layout and start putting some track down. Can't decide whether to go for some of the fancier point motors such as Tortoise or Cobalt, but that's a topic for another thread!
Thanks for all the suggestions!
As someone who followed a 10-foot exhibition layout in N (Hawthorn Dene) with a 5-foot scenic layout in OO (NO PLACE) I'm not that likely to do another OO layout any time soon. Indeed NO PLACE was followed by another N-gauge ten-footer (Croft Spa) which is making its exhibition debut at Sileby in mid-Feb.
OO is not easier to get running than N. There is more slop in the back-to-back which makes lining up couplings more difficult with short wheelbase locos. Locos fall off poor track and split point frogs on tight radius points more easily. EM and P4 cure these at the expense of space and price.
On the other hand getting small locos with sound is nice, though I wish you had a reliable option to fade diesels in when starting without going through the loco start sequence every time you switch the sound on. How does one convincee a punter that the diesel entering the layout has come half a mile down a branch line when it announces it hasn't by starting its engine six inches away from appearing on the layout?
There are actually locos in N that you just can't get in OO, courtesy of Union Mills. These include the Gresley J38, the ex-NER J25, J26 and J27, and LNWR Cauliflower 0-6-0s, the ex-NER D20 4-4-0, and the ex-GNR 0-8-0. A real bonus for me as a North Eastern Region modeller when not doing German.
What am I going to follow Croft Spa with? Five feet scenic again. Probably German, and maybe HO. Why HO rather than OO? I hace a Roco Glaskastern 0-4-0T and a tiny Fleischmann 0-4-0 well tank which are both factory fitted with sound. Their trackholding is far superior to most of my OO locos and it would be a shame not to give them a layout of their own. However the final decision is a lot of months away, so who knows?
BTW- the best OO 0-4-0 I have is the Dapol B4 by a mile- a real bruiser of a loco with compensation which means it is sure footed and slow running is a treat, even over dead frogs. A shame it looks a little odd shunting a North Eastern colliery........
Les
Quote from: chrismann on January 19, 2019, 01:31:57 PM
Thank you - I had thought about the Jinty, and I may still get one, though my understanding is they were used more for shunting in goods yards and as a pilot at bigger stations, rather than being in regular use on branch lines - I may be wrong, I need to do more research on that!!
I think they were used when and where needed. In the books I have about the Coniston Railway (the references for my layout build) there are photos of several Jintys at Coniston - one on the branch passenger train to Foxfield in 1937 and several different ones on the thrice-weekly branch freight in the late 1950s.
I have an old Farish one (well, their generic 0-6-0T) and I'm happy that it's in keeping for my layout, not least because it's the only loco I have so far that was definitely used at Coniston and will fit on the 42' turntable I've been building. The Fairburn tank will also fit but I have no evidence that they actually went to Coniston - however it's a loco that I do like the look of so what the heck :)
These '3F' 0-6-0Ts were versatile little locomotives and, away from yards and stations, could be found on lighter freight duties. Some were vacuum fitted and could work passenger trains. Inverness' 7541 was on the Strathpeffer branch in 1939, for instance. I think that the North London line saw the class used on passenger trains.
John
I'm finally getting the modelling room as the house renovation continues and I am looking hard at OO and comparing options and space and plans. For one my eyesight is not what it used to be. (O in the garden would be tempting except that the garden would probably be more suited to modelling a rack railway 8) )
Alan