SONIC to produce Vanwide Wagons

Started by Carmont, December 07, 2023, 12:17:11 PM

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Woodenhead

To go with it's earlier descendent the Vanfit which Peco appear to have a new version of coming:

https://www.hattons.co.uk/1534516/peco_products_nr_2008xm_12_ton_box_van_vanfit_in_santa_s_workshop_christmas_2023_red_and_green/stockdetail

That is definitely a new chassis design and a bit much for just a Santa special.

bluedepot

what does the yellow circle to the left on the van signify on the vmv vans?

were these xp vmv ones used for explosives?

cheers


tim

martyn

I've been sent these photos from Sonic of the EPs for the VEA (already released)  and vanwide, which show the differences between the two.

In all three photos, the light grey EP is the air braked VEA, the light brown one the vacuum braked Vanwide.












I hope that these clarify and show the differences that Sonic have made between the two types on van.

Martyn

Roy L S

Quote from: martyn on December 07, 2023, 07:12:34 PMI've been sent these photos from Sonic of the EPs for the VEA (already released)  and vanwide, which show the differences between the two.

In all three photos, the light grey EP is the air braked VEA, the light brown one the vacuum braked Vanwide.












I hope that these clarify and show the differences that Sonic have made between the two types on van.

Martyn


Yes indeed, thank you, it is impressive, the attention to detail is clear and differences between the two quite noticeable.

Roy

Newportnobby

Lots of underframe detail.....................................never to be seen unless a derailment means the wagon ends up on its side

bluedepot

#20
v nice

it's a shame they are only available in triple packs.

if they really must be sold in 3s then why not make a variety pack?

often tops coded and non tops coded ran together in the 70s for example. sonic could offer a mix up of the bauxite vacuum braked versions.

I'm a bit fed up of this new trend for triple packs.  esp. when it is wagons that ran singularly or in mixed trains. fair enough if they only ran in block trains.

quite a few people might want a one or two, just to add to a mixed rake, but won't want 3 completely identical wagons (ok, different wagon numbers, but otherwise identical). could at least mix it a bit with the labels and style (stencils or panels for tops codes, maintenance labels, explosives warnings, etc).


cheers for the pics btw martyn.


tim

PaulCheffus

Quote from: bluedepot on December 07, 2023, 04:41:39 PMwhat does the yellow circle to the left on the van signify on the vmv vans?

were these xp vmv ones used for explosives?

cheers


tim

Hi

It could be the ABN symbol but I can't make out the detail from the photo

Cheers

Paul
Procrastination - The Thief of Time.

Workbench thread
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=54708.msg724969#msg724969

Steven B

Quote from: PaulCheffus on December 07, 2023, 09:25:22 PMIt could be the ABN symbol but I can't make out the detail from the photo

It won't be ABN (Air brake network, precursor to Speedlink) on a vacuum braked wagon.

Opening up an individual image on the Rails website:
https://railsofsheffield.com/cdn/shop/files/S2301-05C_V2_R2_1080x.jpg?v=1701100469
And zooming in suggests it's "CRCUT" with a down arrow.

"CRCUT" is short for circuit, indicating that the van was used on a set traffic flow (circuit working). The arrow points down to the wagon label clip to improve the chances that shunters keep the wagon on the set route prescribed by the wagon label.



Photos of the vacuum braked vans show that they carried diamond shaped explosive warning labels in a similar manner to the air braked VEA conversions. Railtec produce a transfer sheet that should be suitable: https://railtec-models.com/showitem.php?id=3665



Steven B

Steven B

Quote from: bluedepot on December 07, 2023, 09:12:43 PMit's a shame they are only available in triple packs.

if they really must be sold in 3s then why not make a variety pack?


Rapido are doing the same with the SECR and OAA wagons. I agree it's a bit frustrating but if it's a choice between triple packs and no wagon I'd take the triple pack.

As for variety within the pack I certainly agree, but then for every modeller wanting three different wagons there's be another wanting them all the same. Manufacturers can't make every combination available
  • so they have to upset someone.

  • I'm sure there's someone (Accurascale?) planning on selling OO models with a pick-your-own box set available as an option


Steven B

bluedepot

ah ok yeh circuit makes sense! thanks.

i may buy two packs and then swap or sell some.

yeh i actually may have some suitable decals already with explosives warnings on as i made some mod containers ages ago. ill see if I have any decals left.

it will be interesting to compare the vanwide with the new peco vanfit for detail and quality.


cheers


tim

Roy L S

Quote from: bluedepot on December 07, 2023, 09:12:43 PMv nice

it's a shame they are only available in triple packs.

if they really must be sold in 3s then why not make a variety pack?

often tops coded and non tops coded ran together in the 70s for example. sonic could offer a mix up of the bauxite vacuum braked versions.

I'm a bit fed up of this new trend for triple packs.  esp. when it is wagons that ran singularly or in mixed trains. fair enough if they only ran in block trains.

quite a few people might want a one or two, just to add to a mixed rake, but won't want 3 completely identical wagons (ok, different wagon numbers, but otherwise identical). could at least mix it a bit with the labels and style (stencils or panels for tops codes, maintenance labels, explosives warnings, etc).


cheers for the pics btw martyn.


tim


I think it was Rapido who said that multi-packs is the only way for them to make N wagons viable at a price-point that modellers would find acceptable, and as an even smaller player in the N market at this point that appears to also be true of Sonic.

To be fair, three Vanwides of this quality working out at a shade over £23 a wagon seems quite a reasonable deal to me, and surely it wouldn't be beyond the capability of Forum members who so wish to work together and split sets and/or offer swaps to others?

Roy


Bob G

I've looked through the Paul Bartlett site and determined that for me running a 1960s/70s era the only ones that suit are the BR Bauxite (Early) XP labelled wagons (which are not in fact that early, being 1968-75 ish) and the Freight Brown C-XP (which are around 1977-80 ish). All the others are 1980s or 1990s versions.

I wonder if Revolution had a hand in this wagon at all?

Bob

Newportnobby

Quote from: Bob G on December 10, 2023, 07:15:16 PMI've looked through the Paul Bartlett site and determined that for me running a 1960s/70s era the only ones that suit are the BR Bauxite (Early) XP labelled wagons (which are not in fact that early, being 1968-75 ish) and the Freight Brown C-XP (which are around 1977-80 ish). All the others are 1980s or 1990s versions.

I wonder if Revolution had a hand in this wagon at all?

Bob

@Bob G
From the Rails newsletter which led me to order a triple pack of late bauxite ones

Due to pressure from large customers BR developed a box van design with sliding doors, the Vanwide to Diagram 1/217, with standard dimensions of 17ft 6 inch length with a 10ft wheelbase. The sides were of plywood construction with flush doors that moved out slightly thus enabling them to slide down the sides, so alleviating the problem of confined locations. The end walls were made from corrugated metal sheeting. The door opening method made a door aperture of 9ft possible which aided loading of pallets by fork lift truck. It was this wider door opening that gave rise to the code name. The build was between Wolverton works and Derby works with nearly 2000 being built between 1961 - 1962.

martyn

#28
Quote from: Newportnobby on December 10, 2023, 07:37:37 PM
Quote from: Bob G on December 10, 2023, 07:15:16 PMI've looked through the Paul Bartlett site and determined that for me running a 1960s/70s era the only ones that suit are the BR Bauxite (Early) XP labelled wagons (which are not in fact that early, being 1968-75 ish) and the Freight Brown C-XP (which are around 1977-80 ish). All the others are 1980s or 1990s versions.

I wonder if Revolution had a hand in this wagon at all?

Bob

@Bob G
From the Rails newsletter which led me to order a triple pack of late bauxite ones

Due to pressure from large customers BR developed a box van design with sliding doors, the Vanwide to Diagram 1/217, with standard dimensions of 17ft 6 inch length with a 10ft wheelbase. The sides were of plywood construction with flush doors that moved out slightly thus enabling them to slide down the sides, so alleviating the problem of confined locations. The end walls were made from corrugated metal sheeting. The door opening method made a door aperture of 9ft possible which aided loading of pallets by fork lift truck. It was this wider door opening that gave rise to the code name. The build was between Wolverton works and Derby works with nearly 2000 being built between 1961 - 1962.

Mick is correct.

The dia. 1/217 vans were, according to 'British Railways Wagons, the first half million' by Rowland,  built at Wolverton and Derby on three lots, the final lot from Derby having translucent roofs. It says they were all delivered in 1962. The book also says they were not coded as Vanwides when built, but 'later'.

A total of 1994 were built.

The design work was done by the Sonic team.

Martyn

Bob G

#29
Hi @Newportnobby and @martyn

I dig all that and I have read it previously - so I originally reckoned that a late BR bauxite wagon would be right for my era, but when you look at Paul Bartlett's site the markings on the BR Bauxite Early wagons were similar to those photographed by Paul Bartlett in the 1960s and early 1970s.
The BR bauxite late and BR Freight Brown liveries are clearly post TOPS and were photographed by Paul Bartlett post 1975 and into the 1980s, and the Olive liveries in the 1990s.

So while the wagon was 1961 onwards, only the early bauxite livery (which actually means the earliest bauxite livery carried by these wagons, rather than early bauxite which Bachmann use as a description for 1950s bauxite livery, which was a lighter bauxite) applies for true transition era modellers.

Hence my question about Revolution as they seem to know more about the later variants of prototypes such as these, which seem to be better represented by Sonic than earlier variants.

Anyway, I think I might get three of the earliest version, because based on previous discussions, bauxite is any shade of brown and dirt that you fancy :) .

Thanks
Bob

PS @martyn don't ever say Mick is correct. Even in jest. He will absorb all that positive energy and explode into a million fragments :)

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