I'm thinking of putting a rake of the nice new pullmans on my 'Christmas List' (Santa needs a nudge in the right direction, he doesn't know me that well). In the RM supplement there's a lovely shot of a rake of 10 (Blea Moor) and I'd like to have something similar, although that would break their rule of thirds idea but I don't care. I have a couple of questions.
Firstly, knowing nothing about coaches really, I wouldn't know what to buy. As far as I can see Farish are selling 5 different coaches:
374-230B BR Mk1 SK Pullman Second Kitchen 'Car No. 334' Umber & Cream
374-220B BR Mk1 FK Pullman First Kitchen 'Falcon' Umber & Cream
374-210B BR Mk1 SP Pullman Second Parlour 'Car No. 349' Umber & Cream
374-200B BR Mk1 FP Pullman First Parlour Car 'Amethyst' Umber & Cream
374-240 BR Mk1 BSP Pullman Second Bar 'HADRIAN BAR' Umber & Cream
What are they all, seriously? Amethyst and No. 349 look like normal dining pullman carriages but why are they labelled First and Second? If they're classes then I had no idea that pullmans had a class system. Falcon and 334 are 'Kitchen' cars, what does that mean? Again, they look like normal pullmans. Same question about the 1st and 2nd bit. And I'm assuming the Bar is a coach with a bar in it. It doesn't help that had that pullman experience.
Secondly, train formation. I'm not a rivet counter but equally have no ideal of how to properly put a passenger train together apart from what looks pretty. So what kind of ratio of the above would I need to get an 8 car train? Finally, is possible to rename them? Going to look a bit stupid if 3 Car 349s.
Apologies for my density ::). If someone would be so kind as to educate me please. :) Thank you!
It's a long time since I watched the Bournemouth Belle rattling through Brookwood Station, but I think named coaches are first class, but numbered coaches are second class.
Hi Richard - I have the same problem but I can only manage 6 coach trains. I bought all 5 when they came out and wondered why there was no brake car available. I subsequently found out the reason Farish hadn't made one is that they didn't exist at the time from that carriage builder - trains ran with just a (maroon) Mk1 brake. I have seen photos and films that back that assertion from Farish up. Hopefully someone else can help regarding renumbering but at least you are up to 6 of the 8 coaches you need now :thumbsup:
I do not know where I read this, hopefully someone can give full details. WR chocolate and cream coaches are a better match for the Pulman livery than maroon. At some point the SR exchanged one of their maroons for the chocolate and cream to run with the Pulmans. It apparently took some time for the WR to realise where their carriage had gone and they complained to BR HQ because the SR were dragging their heels giving it back.
Elmo
So are these new Farish models, ie the Blue Riband improvements they've done to the other Mk1 coaches or just available stock of the original models? I'd heard they were supposed to be coming at some point but missed any announcement.
Quote from: Zwilnik on October 05, 2011, 09:25:04 PM
So are these new Farish models, ie the Blue Riband improvements they've done to the other Mk1 coaches or just available stock of the original models? I'd heard they were supposed to be coming at some point but missed any announcement.
Thanks for the replies. So there are different classes on Pullman trains?
Yes, they're new models and they're nice too. Saw them at TINGS.
Originally the mark 1 pullman coaches ran with an older type pullman brake at both ends, this was later replaced by a mark 1 full brake(BG). Farish are releasing a blue riband quality mark 1 ganwayed brake(BG) around christmas.
The mark 1 pullmans mainly ran on the eastern region. The coaches operated in pairs i.e. second parlour+second kitchen or first parlour+first kitchen with the kitchen area marshalled at the centre of the pair to make food distribution to passengers easier. Rakes were usually 8-10 coaches long. I would imagine, but have no proof that the bar car would be marshalled between the first and second class portions of the train. This would keep the second class riff-raff out of the posh first class area.
So I would marshall the train as follows.
BG-SP-SKIT?-SBAR-FP-FKIT? and at a later date you could insert another pair or pairs of parlour and kitchen cars when farish release them in new guises.
this pic may prove an exception to every rule though, i think it is a bradford portion.
http://www.davidheyscollectionextra.com/userimages/001-d-butterfield-DP2-laisterdyke-1.jpg
Hope that little lot helps a bit!
mark
Posted elsewhere before but here they are
(http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j454/nobbynewport/HadriansBar001.jpg)
(http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j454/nobbynewport/CarNo349.jpg)
Thanks Scruff! Really helpful! :D :thumbsup: What does the blue riband ganwayed bit mean? Will it be in the pullman livery? I don't see it on their website, do you have a link? So is the parlour a seating coach and kitchen coach where they ate? (or where they cooked?)
The Hadrian Bar ran on the Tees Tyne Pullman. Coach formations plus bar menu (Gin 2/3d, lager 2/- or 10p) can be found here. http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/coupe_se04.pdf
The original releases were different names and numbers - same product code but with either no suffix or an A. I have Eagle, Emerald, No 332, etc. I have 7 Pullmans and run them with a Mk 1 BG in Western Choc/Cream (apparently when they first were built, they ran with old brakes so I was using one of the old Pullman Brakes but then learnt that two BGs were transfered from the WR for use). I got some transfers from the NGS and renamed and numbered by duplicate 332 and Eagle - to 333 and Magpie only to learn they were the B letters!
It isn't a hard job as all you need to do is remove (or carefully paint over using the Precision Pullman Umber as this is an excellent match) the bits you don't want and slide the new tranfers in.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-dHZEwJisAj8/Tero_VBnrDI/AAAAAAAAAS8/9qL559DX7kY/s1600/Mk+1+Pullman.jpg)
When the Blue Ribband BG comes out the current one will be replaced. What I am currently considering is getting the "rest" of the Pullmans so I can have a set with white roofs and a set with grey.
Thanks poliss! Some great pics in there too!
Ahh, that's rubbish, I didn't realise there was an original release that I've missed and they no longer sell. :( Would have been perfect to buy some of both runs to get a full train. I doubt they'll do anoter run. So what do you use now, Sithlord, for brakes? Is there a BG out already then? The renumbering looks great!!
There is a Blue Ribband BSK you could use I guess, but the new, all singing, all dancing BG hasn't arrived yet - 2012 apparently. In the meantime I am using the next best which is the most recent released BG with the printing on the solebars and blackened, low profile wheels etc. The biggest issue I have (not that I have been running them recently but come December I'll be back at it) is the roof colours don't match - do I spray the BG roof white or the Pullmans grey?
I know my Pullmans were based on the Eastern Region but I'd have to find a very inventive reason how they got into the Oxford area so I'll be running them as Western Region under the 'modelling license' rule. There was a great cross country line from Cambridge to Oxford so perhaps I could run an Oxbridge Pullman or Camford Pullman service - not that students could have afforded the fares ::) ;D
Is the Blue Ribband just a mark fro high quality then? Are there any pictures of this new BG anywhere? Will it be the same umber/cream livery do you think? Personally I like the white roofs. I currently have a rake of the older pullmans with the grey roofs which I'll be selling as I like the new ones better. Plus I like that they're from the Eastern region. :)
I dunno, the Cambridge students might be able to afford it! :P
Blue Ribband is the higher quality job yes. There are only photos of OO BGs AFAIK but there are some threads around with the Dapol 26 with the Blue Ribband Mk 1s in comparision with a 33 converted to a 26 hauling the older style - worth a look.
Quote from: newportnobby on October 08, 2011, 12:17:00 PM
I know my Pullmans were based on the Eastern Region but I'd have to find a very inventive reason how they got into the Oxford area so I'll be running them as Western Region under the 'modelling license' rule.
The Mk.1 Pullmans were occasionally used in the Western Region Blue Pullman standby set (nicknamed the 'Wells Fargo'). There's a good picture of such a train in Brian Haresnape's 'Pullman: Travelling in Style' book with Brush Type 4 with a train including three Mk.1 Pullmans top and tailed each end with two lots of two old style Pullmans.
Thanks Bernard - very useful piece of information :thumbsup:
Can't seem to find it Sithlord, do you have a link? The new brakes that are coming out, would a train have two of them or just one?