All,
It seems that on the other Forum, there is an OO Wishlist Poll being run, https://www.rmweb.co.uk/topic/175961-the-00-wishlist-poll-returns/#comment-5012502 (https://www.rmweb.co.uk/topic/175961-the-00-wishlist-poll-returns/#comment-5012502) and I happen to mention that there is no N Gauge equivalent, and it got this reply:
"Hello Neal
We ran N gauge for a number of years (with help from the NGS) - as well as Industrial and Underground categories - but had to stop due to time constraints.
We offered all our data and assistance to any responsible group wishing to run N themselves, but - so far - there have been no takers. And that is despite much effort on the part of a number of N modellers.
Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)"
So a question has arisen form this and I suppose it's aimed at both the NGS & @Tank (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=2) :
Have either been approached to assist in an N Gauge Wishliost poll??
Regards
Neal.
P.S. I've asked the same question on RMWeb....
@Calnefoxile (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=619)
Neil,
I started formulating one on Google polls and tried basing it off the last poll conducted via RMweb (2016!), And tried to use some of the results of it from that.
But it proved to be a massive hole as reading all the differing opinions of how it should/was conducted I just thought forget it I can't be bothered with people who can't be bothered.
To many people willing to criticize or offer opinions but not willing to do it themselves, I still have the format hidden away somewhere if people are willing to take up the task and I will happily do my bit.
However reading into it the 2016 poll did have one massive flaw, which simply was to many options...
You could select as many items as you wanted and in some sections there was dozens so it really skewed the numbers..
My thought is that it should be more limited and a single vote per section, but as ai say that meet resistance...
Gareth
@acko22 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=4166)
Gareth,
It seems that @TomE (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=672) has started a D&E one here https://www.ngaugenews.com/post/the-n-gauge-news-n-gauge-christmas-wish-list-2022-diesel-electric (https://www.ngaugenews.com/post/the-n-gauge-news-n-gauge-christmas-wish-list-2022-diesel-electric) which already has a Thread here https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=58248.0 (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=58248.0)
But my issue is with RMWeb really and trying to highlight the apathy on RMWeb towards N Gauge, we all know that N is a minority gauge to OO, but I would've though that RMWeb/BRM would at least try and cover all...
Ahh well, let's see how long I get on the naughty step for daring to question the mighty Andy Y :P :P :P
Cheers
Neal.
Quote from: Calnefoxile on December 05, 2022, 02:40:43 PM
But my issue is with RMWeb really and trying to highlight the apathy on RMWeb towards N Gauge, we all know that N is a minority gauge to OO, but I would've though that RMWeb/BRM would at least try and cover all...
Ahh well, let's see how long I get on the naughty step for daring to question the mighty Andy Y :P :P :P
I came close to the naughty step for daring to suggest that RMWeb/BRM might like to feedback to the manufacturers that there are many readers who would buy a few more coaches should they ever get around to making some in popular liveries.
Steven B.
BRM don't seem very interested in N. Most months if you read BRM you would not know N gauge existed. In my experience the rest of the "big four" are keen to include N gauge layouts if and when good ones come along.
Here are the results from the 2013 NGF Poll.
I don't reckon we've done too badly :no:
I help curate the "modern wagons" section of the OO gauge poll, so have a bit of insight. They dropped the N gauge one simply because of a lack of engagement and the sheer amount of work involved in curating the two lists, when all the poll team model OO. I do think they complicate it a bit, and probably do try to be too expansive. They were previously creating a virtual encyclopaedia, with descriptions and history of every single item. I tend to think that if you're voting for a model you know what it is. I also think they complicate it by having an arbitrary threshold of "any model 10+ years old can be included", so you end up with the list being cluttered with good quality models still widely available because they are "old", although I accept you need an agreed definition.
As Gareth said a team of us did look at this, using the last OO gauge one as the basis. @TomE (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=672) 's D&E one looks great, it's easily shareable, and even does cool things auto ranking the suggestions. I'm happy to help with some of the other sections if it would be valuable. I'd be minded to use the OO gauge one as the basis and add in the missing N gauge bits!
Quote from: njee20 on December 05, 2022, 05:51:42 PM
I'm happy to help with some of the other sections if it would be valuable.
It absolutely would be valuable!! (I'll be in touch :D)
Tom.
I still have the Excel version of the one we created back in 2018.
A big challenge, once we had got the lists about right, was the need to populate every example with some history and even a photo to show what we meant by that particular prototype.
I am inclined to think that the D&E version now online gets the balance right. And is independent of RMWeb. That's two things in its favour.
Bob
Quote from: Chris Morris on December 05, 2022, 04:39:36 PM
BRM don't seem very interested in N. Most months if you read BRM you would not know N gauge existed. In my experience the rest of the "big four" are keen to include N gauge layouts if and when good ones come along.
My comment above was unfair on BRM. I'm sure the editorial staff are interested in N gauge. It is probably the case that BRM don't get offered many N gauge layouts so they can't feature as many as they would like.
Quote from: Chris Morris on December 05, 2022, 04:39:36 PM
My comment above was unfair on BRM. I'm sure the editorial staff are interested in N gauge. It is probably the case that BRM don't get offered many N gauge layouts so they can't feature as many as they would like.
Interesting. Following publication of my layout "Southwark Bridge" in the N Gauge Journal (6/20), I sent an article to the RM. They acknowledged it but since then, nothing. Perhaps I'll try BRM.
It wasn't the same article, though?
RM won't publish something that's been published elsewhere.
The comment about RM not publishing an article that has been in the Journal is not correct. Both Lynford Junction and James Street had what was essentially the same arictle in the Journal before these went into RM, and more recently the other articles we did on the carriage and wagon stock on JS also did both.
Dave
Ok, but back in the nineties when I had mine published, I'm sure it was a stipulation.
Maybe not. Years take their toll. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Bealman on December 06, 2022, 08:51:32 AM
It wasn't the same article, though?
RM won't publish something that's been published elsewhere.
I did a rewrite although, of course, there's only so many ways you can tell the same story.
Quote from: Southerngooner on December 06, 2022, 08:56:16 AM
The comment about RM not publishing an article that has been in the Journal is not correct. Both Lynford Junction and James Street had what was essentially the same arictle in the Journal before these went into RM, and more recently the other articles we did on the carriage and wagon stock on JS also did both.
Dave
BRM also had James St on front cover and main article in February 2020, with a dvd featuring Steve. But as I don't get BRM, nor, regularly, any modelling magazines, I can't comment on how often it features N gauge.
I was present at the photo shoot, and Steve and I got plenty of positive comments during this time from the photographer-whose name I can't remember.........
Martyn
Apologies for going a bit off piste here.
From a quick survey I have just done, between October 2021 and now Model Rail and Railway Modeller jointly have the highest percentage of N gauge layouts with around 16% of all featured layouts being N gauge. RM appears to have an N gauge layout almost every month while half the Model Rail magazines also have an N gauge layout featured. Hornby Mag is behind with 12% of featured layouts being N while BRM has 10%. 9 out of the last 15 HMs had no N gauge featured layout while 10 of the last 15 BRMs didn't have one. I'm not saying any of this is good or bad, just what I found. I would imagine all the magazines try to include N gauge layouts where they can.
I would expect that the N gauge share of the market may well be around 15% to 20% compared to 00 so I can understand RMWeb putting effort into an 00 poll but not an N poll.
As a further aside and based on little bites of information I would like to suggest that N Gauge has had quite a good year. At this year's Exeter show an N gauge layout (not mine) topped bot the visitor and exhibitor polls for favourite layout. There were a couple of excellent 4mm layouts at this show so that was quite an achievement. At Rail-Ex Taunton N gauge layouts came first and second in the public vote for best layout. This came as a surprise to me as "Hills of the North" was there and I would have expected that to win. In the RM Cup last year 2mm layouts came 2nd and 4th which is pretty good going. Finally my little N gauge layout came third in the HM layout of the year vote this year. I think all of this shows that N gauge is very popular with both exhibition visitors and magazine readers.
Tom's poll works well. It'll be interesting to see the results. Expanding it to cover coaches, wagons and steam locos would be a labour of love!
I'd be interested to know what pent-up demand there is for more frequent re-runs of existing models. How many want a few more class 37 liveries or a maroon Mk1 SK for example.
Steven B
:offtopicsign:
Quote from: Bealman on December 06, 2022, 08:51:32 AM
It wasn't the same article, though?
RM won't publish something that's been published elsewhere.
When we had the James Street and Lynford Junction articles published in 'Railway Modeller', I think that it was permitted that the article could have been published in a limited access specialist magazine, eg the Society 'Journal', but could not have been, in a similar form, in another trade-published magazine.
@Chris Morris (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=3123)
'James St' also won best in show by both public and members' votes at Loughborough (and also best scenery), and we had MANY compliments at both Stafford and Wigan, where I think no awards are made, along the lines of 'best layout here'.
So yes, N is appreciated, but not necessarily by some magazines and show organisers! I'm thinking of your comment about your own layout and Warley.
Martyn
Quote from: Steven B on December 06, 2022, 09:59:11 AM
Tom's poll works well. It'll be interesting to see the results. Expanding it to cover coaches, wagons and steam locos would be a labour of love!
But a lot of the background work, i.e. the steam locos, coach and wagon types, has been done (by me and quite a few others) in 2018!
All you need now is example photographs.
Bob
Thanks for the memory jog, @martyn (https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=447) .
That is quite correct. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Calnefoxile on December 05, 2022, 01:46:20 PM
Have either been approached to assist in an N Gauge Wishliost poll??
Regards
Neal.
Nope, never heard a thing.
I'd certainly love us to have a poll on here again, but I just don't have the time myself. I'd be happy for someone else, or a team to start one.
I'll be reaching out to people who I now know were/are involved in previous attempts to setup an N Gauge Poll in the new year regarding the steam poll. If work has been done and all I need to do is facilitate hosting it on NGN then all the better really!
Tom.
Quote from: TomE on December 07, 2022, 02:14:42 PM
I'll be reaching out to people who I now know were/are involved in previous attempts to setup an N Gauge Poll in the new year regarding the steam poll. If work has been done and all I need to do is facilitate hosting it on NGN then all the better really!
Tom.
Reach out. I'll be there. The Four Tops are coming!
Clearly the steam poll will take a lot more time to setup than the diesel/electric one as there are many more potential choices. One way of simplifying things would be to restrict it to locos and stock that have already been made, or announced, in OO or that have been made in N in the past; if a model hasn't been considered viable in OO it's unlikely it would be considered viable in N.
Quote from: D9020 Nimbus on December 07, 2022, 03:21:31 PM
Clearly the steam poll will take a lot more time to setup than the diesel/electric one as there are many more potential choices. One way of simplifying things would be to restrict it to locos and stock that have already been made, or announced, in OO or that have been made in N in the past; if a model hasn't been considered viable in OO it's unlikely it would be considered viable in N.
Not if the initial hard work has already been done :)