Import Duty etc On Goods From UK After 1 January 2021

Started by dannyboy, December 08, 2020, 07:46:52 PM

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Paul J

Another thing; Shapeways prints their stuff in the Netherlands so we are not just talking about people who like exotic European trains here!

red_death

Quote from: Paul J on December 16, 2020, 10:14:50 AM
Quote from: red_death on December 08, 2020, 10:45:32 PM
It shouldn't make a massive difference to most people.  You should be paying no duty as the tariff for pretty much all model railway items is 0.

I'm afraid that is mistaken. Tariffs are not the same thing as import duty. Basically, even with a deal, buying from EU countries will have the same faff and expense as buying from places like Plaza Japan, with customs and handling charges added on to orders. That is because we are leaving the customs union.

Worse still, it looks as thought the UK government is trying to push processing UK VAT on to overseas retailers. This is something that small businesses will be unlikely to want to process.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/william-shatner-stop-merchandise-to-uk-122643199.html

Personally, I cannot see that policy being politically sustainable but who knows with this lot?

Sorry Paul but that is incorrect - you are mixing duty and VAT.  Tariffs and duty are the same thing - when we import our products from China (or the USA or Japan as you say) we pay import VAT, but the tariff is 0 (under WTO rules) so the duty is 0.  Import VAT is paid at the UK standard rate of 20%.




Paul J

#17
Hi

Thanks for the correction; it was me who mixed it up. I did not notice you worked in the sector when I posted. Let's just hope we are able to reclaim European VAT at European websites!

https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/commodities/9503003000

Alcazar

Just checked the situation for Germany:
https://www.zoll.de/EN/Businesses/Movement-of-goods/Brexit/brexit_node.html;jsessionid=C9E3856A5168C30AC1146D72F5BE536E.live4412

Apparently the UK will leave the Customs Union on 31st December, irrespective of any deal/no deal. For Northern Island:
"The Northern Ireland Protocol set out in the Withdrawal Agreement stipulates that Northern Ireland will remain part of the UK's customs territory, but that all relevant EU internal market rules and the EU Customs Code will apply in Northern Ireland. This means that although Northern Ireland is part of the customs territory of the UK, for customs purposes it will be treated as if it were part of the customs territory of the Union."

Unfortunately there seem to be no exceptions to VAT like France, unless things go person to person. Even there, you are going to have to fill out the little green customs declaration and stick it to your package - remember them? Back to the future!!

The question is whether the NGS shop will deduct VAT at source?

Peter

marco neri

Hi,
Watchin' the Italy daily news...it seems the only difference from Brexit will be that UK is going to leave  "Erasmus"  (Universitary interchange project) , will need passport to came there...and EU students and workers need a quote study or salary €28.000 minimum to access to study and job UK  universe....the rest (VAT, import/export duties ecc. ecc) will remains the same.

Marco
...never turn you back on the ripper (judas priest)

steve836

Now a deal has been done we will have to wait and see what the effect will be.
KISS = Keep it simple stupid

Paul J

#21
Marco

UK citizens need passports even now as we have never been in Schengen.

From the point of view of modellers, the big change will be loads of red tape for importing stuff. If one cannot reclaim VAT from the vendor, you can expect to pay it twice I think, which of course is a compounded charge. Not sure though. There will be handling charges so buying stuff from abroad will be more expensive unless you get lucky and the parcel is waved through, which can sometimes happen.

The most likely difficulty will be for UK layout owners exhibiting abroad, as you will need customs clearance for items to are taking out to prove they were not purchased abroad when you re-enter the country. This either means an itemised list of every item taken (a duplicate list) in duplicate with a form, plus dealing with EU customs or forking out £326 for an ACA Carnet. A lot will depend on now customs are enforced, as these requirements are in practice ignored for personal effects such as cameras or phones when it is obvious they are not items for smuggling. I fear a layout and stock will attract quite a bit more attention.

I would be delighted to be corrected on the above paragraph, but I have looked this up on the UK government website.

These are examples of non-tariff barriers which will become the next Brexit related debate after January 1st. As the Swiss know to their cost, staying out of the EU means having to debate this stuff for ever and ever and ever and ever :sleep:

marco neri

Quote from: Paul J on December 25, 2020, 09:36:20 PM
Marco

UK citizens need passports even now as we have never been in Schengen.

From the point of view of modellers, the big change will be loads of red tape for importing stuff. If one cannot reclaim VAT from the vendor, you can expect to pay it twice I think, which of course is a compounded charge. Not sure though. There will be handling charges so buying stuff from abroad will be more expensive unless you get lucky and the parcel is waved through, which can sometimes happen.

The most likely difficulty will be for UK layout owners exhibiting abroad, as you will need customs clearance for items to are taking out to prove they were not purchased abroad when you re-enter the country. This either means an itemised list of every item taken (a duplicate list) in duplicate with a form, plus dealing with EU customs or forking out £326 for an ACA Carnet. A lot will depend on now customs are enforced, as these requirements are in practice ignored for personal effects such as cameras or phones when it is obvious they are not items for smuggling. I fear a layout and stock will attract quite a bit more attention.

I would be delighted to be corrected on the above paragraph, but I have looked this up on the UK government website.

These are examples of non-tariff barriers which will become the next Brexit related debate after January 1st. As the Swiss know to their cost, staying out of the EU means having to debate this stuff for ever and ever and ever and ever :sleep:

Hi,
about 1St part...I was talking about EU citizens coming to UK....'til 31/12 will need IC (Identify Card...similar to a credit card ) only.....after we will need passport with sign of the UK embassy..

Marco
...never turn you back on the ripper (judas priest)

Alcazar

Quote from: Paul J on December 25, 2020, 09:36:20 PM
The most likely difficulty will be for UK layout owners exhibiting abroad, as you will need customs clearance for items to are taking out to prove they were not purchased abroad when you re-enter the country. This either means an itemised list of every item taken (a duplicate list) in duplicate with a form, plus dealing with EU customs or forking out £326 for an ACA Carnet. A lot will depend on now customs are enforced, as these requirements are in practice ignored for personal effects such as cameras or phones when it is obvious they are not items for smuggling. I fear a layout and stock will attract quite a bit more attention.

I remember that one of my first exhibitions with my module group was at the "N-Bahn Club beider Basel" in the late 1990s, before Switzerland joined Schengen. One of the organizers had a van which we filled with modules and stock on the German side of the border. We knew that we had to have the list of equipment and pay a deposit of CHF300 at the Swiss customs, but forgot completely about the German customs. When we came back, we picked up our deposit from the Swiss, who did not bother to look into the van at all, but we were stopped by a German custom's man. He wanted to see what we had in the van - luckily he could see only the modules, which we told him were worth about €50 each. He gave us a lecture about how to do it properly next time and then let us through.

Peter



Paul J

Alcazar

According to the UK government website, the duplicate list needs to be on business headed notepaper, and the attached form has a section for company details? Was that a requirement in that case, and if so how was it met?

ntpntpntp

#25
The first time I took my layout out to Germany in 2003 I was advised by a friend in Customs & Excise to make sure we had a fully detailed inventory listed out just in case.  In the end it wasn't asked for at any point.

Subsequently when the layout has gone abroad twice more it's travelled as part of East Surrey N Gauge Group's van load.  I've not provided an inventory on those occasions.  I don't recall the guys ever mentioning a need for one and they go over pretty much every year.  Of course the rules change now, so might have to make sure I make a list for any future adventures.
Nick.   2021 celebrating the 25th anniversary of "Königshafen" exhibition layout!
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=50050.0

Paul J

Quote from: ntpntpntp on December 26, 2020, 05:10:05 PM
The first time I took my layout out to Germany in 2003 I was advised by a friend in Customs & Excise to make sure we had a fully detailed inventory listed out just in case.  In the end it wasn't asked for at any point.

I have taken a layout abroad before without a duplicate list as we were in the customs union.

https://www.gov.uk/taking-goods-out-uk-temporarily/duplicate-list

QuoteBefore you export the goods, prepare a list on company stationery. Include:

    a description of the goods
    how many there are
    serial numbers, if the goods have them
    value of the goods

At customs, you'll need to provide:

    2 copies of the list
    a completed form C&E 1246 (PDF, 638 KB)


Alcazar

Quote from: Paul J on December 26, 2020, 04:57:09 PM
Alcazar

According to the UK government website, the duplicate list needs to be on business headed notepaper, and the attached form has a section for company details? Was that a requirement in that case, and if so how was it met?

It's a long time ago, but I think that we just had a formal invitation on headed paper from the exhibitor and attached the listings to that. If you are going as a club, you can probably satisfy the requirements anyway.

Did you exhibit in Stuttgart?

Peter

Chris Morris

Although probably not a much of a problem with N gauge VAT is charged on the value of goods plus the cost of the postage when bringing stuff into the UK. Parcelforce charge twice that of the Royal Mail at around £14 for handling the VAT payment. In my experience of buying G scale items from the States there is also a delay of about two weeks between stuff arriving in the UK and me being billed for the VAT - it spends longer awaiting customs clearance than it does in transit from the States. Being charged VAT on the postage (which is zero rated in the UK) always racked me off especially when the postage could be in the realms of £60-£80.  Buying items from within the EU used to be  quick and cheap but I expect it will now be the same as buying items from the States - slow and expensive.
Working doesn't seem to be the perfect thing for me so I'll continue to play.
Steve Marriott / Ronnie Lane

ntpntpntp

Quote from: Chris Morris on December 29, 2020, 09:38:19 AM
Buying items from within the EU used to be  quick and cheap but I expect it will now be the same as buying items from the States - slow and expensive.

Yeah thanks a lot Brexit  :veryangry:   So much for us coming together as one global market.   I've probably made my last EU ebay purchase for a while until things become clear. I've got one item on the way, hoping it makes it before New Year  :D
Nick.   2021 celebrating the 25th anniversary of "Königshafen" exhibition layout!
https://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=50050.0

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