Import Duty etc On Goods From UK After 1 January 2021

Started by dannyboy, December 08, 2020, 07:46:52 PM

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dannyboy

I have just had an email from Amazon UK, to the effect that as from 1st January, any goods I buy from the UK will be subject to VAT and Customs duty etc., as they are now when I buy something from Japan or the USA, when they arrive in Ireland. That made me think of two things - i) could I buy from the UK VAT free and ii) presumably, if I buy from another EU country, say the Amazon German site, I would not then be liable for VAT and Customs duty etc.? I have already been informed by An Post that I can not use the 'drop off' system I use at the moment to save on postage, certainly not in the format it is at present.

I am just thinking out loud here and do not want to get all political.  :)

And another thought I just had - how will members who live outside the UK, who can currently buy goods VAT free, fair after 1st January?
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.
If a friend seems distant, catch up with them.

themadhippy

freedom of speech is but a  fallacy.it dosnt exist here

chrism

#2
Quote from: dannyboy on December 08, 2020, 07:46:52 PM
I have just had an email from Amazon UK, to the effect that as from 1st January, any goods I buy from the UK will be subject to VAT and Customs duty etc., as they are now when I buy something from Japan or the USA, when they arrive in Ireland.

Surely you were already paying VAT on goods bought from a UK supplier, at the UK VAT rate? I say the last bit because different EU countries have different VAT rates, the EU only sets a minimum. I remember buying some software from  a Danish company and being rather peeved at having to pay 22% instead of 15%

QuoteThat made me think of two things - i) could I buy from the UK VAT free

Not sure, it's usually the case that goods sold for export are VAT-free at source and VAT is chargeable upon arrival in the destination country. If we don't reach a free trade deal between the UK and EU then you would be liable for import duties, but I don't know if the deal (if one is struck) would also waive VAT as well as import duties - obviously, the duties if any would depend on the product.

Quoteand ii) presumably, if I buy from another EU country, say the Amazon German site, I would not then be liable for VAT and Customs duty etc.?

That would be my assumption, since both Eire and Germany are in the EU.

What would happen if amazon.de chose to send the goods from a UK warehouse, though, I don't know.
I've frequently bought stuff from amazon.co.uk but the goods have actually come from a warehouse in Germany or Luxembourg. I would hope that any duties, etc. would be based upon the division of Amazon that actually took the order, not the location from which they chose to send the goods.
If we don't strike a trade deal and I get charged for goods coming from, say, Luxembourg when I ordered from the UK Amazon site I'll be extremely annoyed, especially if the website didn't specify the location of the goods.

QuoteAnd another thought I just had - how will members who live outside the UK, who can currently buy goods VAT free, fair after 1st January?

If they aren't in the EU the situation won't change.
If they are they will/should have been paying VAT anyway. They would, without a trade deal, be liable for import duties, I would assume.



jpendle

Quote from: dannyboy on December 08, 2020, 07:46:52 PM
And another thought I just had - how will members who live outside the UK, who can currently buy goods VAT free, fair after 1st January?

Members who live outside of the EU, can currently buy goods VAT free, but only if the retailer deducts the VAT for them.
So Hattons, Rails, Revolution, et al automatically deduct UK VAT for non EU customers (a 16.66% discount). Smaller suppliers are not always willing/able to do this.

Regards,

John P
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njee20

Quote from: chrism on December 08, 2020, 08:35:08 PM
What would happen if amazon.de chose to send the goods from a UK warehouse, though, I don't know.
I've frequently bought stuff from amazon.co.uk but the goods have actually come from a warehouse in Germany or Luxembourg. I would hope that any duties, etc. would be based upon the division of Amazon that actually took the order, not the location from which they chose to send the goods.
If we don't strike a trade deal and I get charged for goods coming from, say, Luxembourg when I ordered from the UK Amazon site I'll be extremely annoyed, especially if the website didn't specify the location of the goods.

That won't happen, you don't control that. The more likely outcome is that Amazon DE won't use any UK warehouses and vice versa, in the event there is no trade deal in place.

dannyboy

Quote from: chrism on December 08, 2020, 08:35:08 PM

Surely you were already paying VAT on goods bought from a UK supplier, at the UK VAT rate? I say the last bit because different EU countries have different VAT rates, the EU only sets a minimum. I remember buying some software from  a Danish company and being rather peeved at having to pay 22% instead of 15%


You are quite correct Chris - I do pay VAT, at the UK rate, on goods bought in the UK for delivery to Ireland.  As you say, different EU countries have different VAT rates, my point was that, as of 1st January, the UK will not be an EU country.  ;)
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.
If a friend seems distant, catch up with them.

Dancess

This is the situation here in France so guess it will be the same in Ireland.

If your purchase comes from countries outside the European Union :

In mainland France , receipt of goods from a country outside the European Union is subject to  :

VAT (and other national taxes) from the first euro
and

any customs duties if the value of the order exceeds 150  euros.

This is from French customs website.
S&D lives on - sort of!


dannyboy

Thanks for that Dancess, (I think  :)). Looks like my sister and brother are going to be buying me some extra presents.  ;). A bit of a b*gger though, my nearest model shop is in Northern Ireland and the nearest decent one, (as far as I know), is in Dublin - 100 miles away - or as we say in the EU, 160 kms.  ;D
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.
If a friend seems distant, catch up with them.

Jim Easterbrook

I wonder if going via Northern Ireland will make life easier?
Jim Easterbrook
"I'm an engineer, not an artist!"
"Amoro, emptio, utiliso!"
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dannyboy

Quote from: Jim Easterbrook on December 08, 2020, 10:02:18 PM
I wonder if going via Northern Ireland will make life easier?

The argument with that is that Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom. I don't pretend to understand a small fraction of what exactly is happening, (and I would hazard a guess that very few members of the forum understand exactly what is involved), but I know one of the problems has been the Northern Ireland situation and the fact that there is a land border between the two countries. As I said though, I do not want to get political - all I know is that if I buy owt from the UK, it will cost me more.  :'(
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.
If a friend seems distant, catch up with them.

LASteve

Quote from: jpendle on December 08, 2020, 08:50:36 PM

Members who live outside of the EU, can currently buy goods VAT free, but only if the retailer deducts the VAT for them.
So Hattons, Rails, Revolution, et al automatically deduct UK VAT for non EU customers (a 16.66% discount). Smaller suppliers are not always willing/able to do this.
I very rarely - maybe once? get a VAT charge - to add to JP's namecheck, my regular suppliers - ModelRailwaysDirect, YouChoos, DCConcepts, Osborn's, TMC, Kernow, CRSignals (my apologies if I've missed anyone) automatically deduct VAT from the quoted prices. I can't remember who assessed VAT on an export, but it was small potatoes and not worth the candle making a fuss about it.

N_GaugeModeller

We will all have to watch out for the other change coming in on the 1st January 2021 and that is import duty on all things coming into the UK from anywhere in the world (unless there are any agreement in force at the time)

What this means is if for example you buy something from China on eBay and get one of those 99p including free shipping items Chinese sellers on the bay are famous for you will find it may attract duty and handling fees, duty it not the problem, the likes of Royal Mail will charge you £8 for collecting the few pence duty.

I have had a couple already even though it's not officially starting till next month.

I suppose it's one way of killing trade with China

Just a heads up, it's coming soon.

NGM
There may be spelling and grammatical errors in my posts, I am Dyslexic so just think yourself lucky you can actually read what I have written.

I am also in the early stages of Alzheimer's and Vascular dementia so sometimes struggle with basic communication.

You don't need to point out my errors.  Thanks

red_death

It shouldn't make a massive difference to most people.  You should be paying no duty as the tariff for pretty much all model railway items is 0.

VAT is (mostly *) charged at the rate of the place of supply ie:
- if you buy from the UK (assuming no deal) then no UK VAT would be charged but you would have to pay VAT on import to Ireland ie the net difference would be +1% (currently) as UK VAT is 20% and IE VAT is 21%. Conversely if you live in a country with a lower VAT rate (Germany?) then you will save a small amount of money.
- if you buy from a different EU Member State then you will pay VAT at the rate of the supplying country ie no change

* place of supply rules can be complicated particularly for things like software where the place of supply can be your country

Cheers Mike



Paul J

Quote from: red_death on December 08, 2020, 10:45:32 PM
It shouldn't make a massive difference to most people.  You should be paying no duty as the tariff for pretty much all model railway items is 0.

I'm afraid that is mistaken. Tariffs are not the same thing as import duty. Basically, even with a deal, buying from EU countries will have the same faff and expense as buying from places like Plaza Japan, with customs and handling charges added on to orders. That is because we are leaving the customs union.

Worse still, it looks as thought the UK government is trying to push processing UK VAT on to overseas retailers. This is something that small businesses will be unlikely to want to process.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/william-shatner-stop-merchandise-to-uk-122643199.html

Personally, I cannot see that policy being politically sustainable but who knows with this lot?

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