Sonic 51xx Large Prairie - Disappointing Runner

Started by Smokebox Door, July 19, 2024, 03:17:01 PM

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Hailstone


JohnR

#16
As a recent newcomer to model railways and specifically n gauge, I bought a Sonic prairie from Rails to compliment a Dapol 57xx pannier. The prairie runs very well on kato track but had  an issue on one turnout, constantly derailing. I modified the turnout and it now runs through ok. The pannier on the other hand stuttered and hesitated continually despite running in. I spoke to Rails and they advised me to return it so they could check it out. I received a tested replacement within a week which runs properly. I know this post doesn't resolve any of the issues others have had, but so far, my limited experience of Rails' service has been a positive one.

Newportnobby

Drifting off topic, welcome to the forum, John.
How about a post in the 'Introduction' section to tell us what you're up to in N?

Bealman

Yep, G'day from Australia, mate, and welcome to the NGF!  :thumbsup:

Was it a Kato #4 point?
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

JohnR

Thank you for the welcome, Newportnobby and Bealman. Apologies to everyone for interrupting this thread I've not interacted with forums before. In answer to your question, yes it was a Kato 4# point.

Firstone18

Quote from: Smokebox Door on July 20, 2024, 07:47:47 PMI could return the loco but I want a 51XX of my choice, not a refund. This is not the first time that I have received a 'tested' loco that has a running issue.

I was aware of the other thread referred to earlier but hadn't read enough of it to realise that the pre-production discussion had continued post production. Now that I have read through it all and have watched a video of a 51XX creeping along in a way that mine cannot, I'm irritated even more about how I have been fobbed off.

After several hours of continuous running, pulling a rake of a half dozen Mk1 coaches, the behaviour of my 51XX hasn't changed - it still has a slight limp and the driving wheels slip on every point frog. Time to give the pony truck spring shortening a go me thinks.
I had similar problems with the same seller on Sonic's first loco; I don't believe the 'tested' sticker means what it says; probably only run up and down a straight piece of track. I rejected a third loco as the livery I wanted was not available, and chose a Dapol Schools. I tried two of those, both were awful. I then tried a GF WD; it ran fine for about 4 weeks then stopped. It went back for a refund, but I was offered a 'tested' replacement after the seller agreed it had failed which I reluctantly accepted. The replacement WD has, so far, run well. This experience has put me off purchasing unless I can a) purchase at a show, and b) test it before leaving the show. Not all sellers offer a test track, even a straight one. I will often ask an exhibitor if they will help me, or better still if the NGS stand is there get it tested there. It is about time manufacturers concentrated more on the mechanisms rather than putting so much detail on the loco which cannot be seen at more than arms length by most of us oldies. Just my feelings. cheers :beers:
Finally, after waiting over 55 years I am building a permanent layout in a purpose built shed!

Roy L S

Everyone has their own view, but personally I don't think there should have to to be a trade-off between detail and performance. I absolutely love the level of detail on N Gauge models these days and would never want to go back to the days of Poole Graham Farish with all detail moulded on.

I haven't had many problems with recent locos running wise, from memory just a sound fitted Rapido Class 28 where the sound chip blew (turned out to be a fault with some of the Loksound chips so not the loco's fault) plus it would have to be said my two Sonic J50s which run OK in a straight line but have developed an issue where they "stutter" when they hit a curve. I haven't identified the problem yet, but as most people don't seem to have had an issue it is unlikely to be anything inherent in the chassis design.

All my recent Farish locos run superbly, both steam and diesel, not a single issue (touch wood).

Roy


Southerngooner

I have to agree with Roy regarding the performance of modern N locos. We've gone through most of them when exhibiting James Street, and while there have been a few rogues that have had to be replaced, in the main they've all proved reliable runners and haulers. The world does seem to have got into a moaning mentality since social media came along, and small issues can get magnified when one person gets a dodgy model and splashes videos or posts all over the net, often massively inflating the apparent scale of the problem. If it's new and defective, send it back for replacement, which has always been the case even since the early days of UK N.

In terms of secondhand locos, I won't buy unless I can see it tested, or more preferably, test it myself. I've had a few good bargains from eBay and the like, but I much prefer buying at a show where I can test it on the layout. We are always open to test locos for people on James Street, so never be afraid to ask! I'm sure many other exhibitors are the same.

Dave
Dave

Builder of "Brickmakers Lane" and member of "James Street" operating team.

Bealman

I can confirm that. After buying a loco from @Newportnobby in York last year (not that I div'nt trust you, Mick), I was graciously allowed to run it on JS.  :thumbsup:

I bought a GWR railcar sight unseen from @dannyboy of this parish, and it's great! I trust the classifieds on here, my rationale being we're not likely to rip each other off.
Vision over visibility. Bono, U2.

Bazza

#24
Quote from: Firstone18 on July 29, 2024, 10:14:51 PMIt is about time manufacturers concentrated more on the mechanisms rather than putting so much detail on the loco which cannot be seen at more than arms length by most of us oldies. Just my feelings.

I don't believe there is, or has to be, a trade off between such things. There's no reason why models can't be engineered and manufactured to have high fidelity and detail, and great performance and operation. I'm sure manufacturers try to achieve both rather than concentrating on one to the detriment of the other.


Cols

At the risk of being told that I'm a bit late joining this discussion, I'm going to chuck my hat in the ring!

I have two of the Sonic Large Prairies, but have had traction problems with both.

On receiving the first one from Rails (4141), I read, and followed exactly, the instruction sheet - and ran the loco, non-stop, for (over) an hour in each direction at a medium speed: it was almost silent, and very smooth right from the start. I was delighted. After the two hour's running in, I placed a Dapol B-set behind it... and it slipped badly - even on straight track. I then ran it bunker-first which improved matters, but it still slipped on a fairly gentle curve. So, more out of curiosity than any technical insight, I ran it (light) for another 30 minutes in each direction. I don't know what that extra hour did, but it will now confidently haul 4 or 5 Hawksworth coaches - with no slipping. Maybe all that running-in has compressed the springing of the pony trucks...

So, I bought another one (4156) a couple of weeks ago...To start with, both front smokebox to front footplate struts had come adrift in the box (I gather that this is a common problem...). Having  fixed this issue (not easy when partially blind...), the loco was run-in in the same way as the previous model. It ran beautifully - until, after running-in, two coaches were put behind it. The loco absolutely refused to move - it just slipped, and slipped, and - well, you get the picture... So, out of sheer exasperation, I decided to remove the spring from the front pony truck. I did initially clip it, but then decided to get rid of it altogether. 4156 now hauls what I want and at the speeds that I want. One of my fellow NGS Area Group members has postulated that it may be a good idea to remove both pony-truck springs altogether.

This experience with springing, makes me wonder how well the forthcoming Dapol WC/BB Pacific locos (for which I've waited for 13? years!!), and their GWR Mogul and revised Manor, will behave with their compensated centre driving wheels - it sounds like a great idea - but the proof of the pudding...

In short, I'm very pleased with my models of 4141 and 4156. Though I rather doubt that I should have experienced these Quality Control/technical issues, which may well put some people off from considering purchases of future Sonic products.

Now to go - and pray for an ROD 2-8-0 in GCR/LNER/GWR guise, and the hitherto overlooked BR Standard 4MT 4-6-0, and a Southern S15 4-6-0... and a re-run of the Bachmann-Farish 64xx and the 4MT 2-6-4T, and the SR C Class 0-6-0. Oh, and will Bachmann-Farish seriously consider putting a close coupling mechanism on their Mk.1 non-gangwayed passenger coaches..?

Newportnobby

Quote from: Cols on October 22, 2024, 11:41:23 AMNow to go - and pray for an ROD 2-8-0 in GCR/LNER/GWR guise, and the hitherto overlooked BR Standard 4MT 4-6-0, and a Southern S15 4-6-0... and a re-run of the Bachmann-Farish 64xx and the 4MT 2-6-4T, and the SR C Class 0-6-0. Oh, and will Bachmann-Farish seriously consider putting a close coupling mechanism on their Mk.1 non-gangwayed passenger coaches..?

Strewth! You don't want much, do you? :D  ;)

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