!!

Not Registered?

Welcome!  Please register to view all of the new posts and forum boards - some of which are hidden to guests.  After registering and gaining 10 posts you will be able to sell and buy items on our N'porium.

If you have any problems registering, then please check your spam filter before emailing us.  Hotmail users seem to find their emails in the Junk folder.


Thanks for reading,
The NGF Staff.

Author Topic: Freight formations  (Read 341 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Freight formations
« on: September 18, 2018, 02:36:32 pm »
Hi to everybody not posted for a while as been kept busy with trivial things like work and wife ;). But now with a bit more time on my hands Iíve been playing trains again and my favourite part running freight I find it very interesting all the different wagons and colours with various logos and branding having looked at train formations in various heritage rail magazines I noticed that a lot of pictures show a break van at both ends of the train and it got me wondering how prototypical this I understand that for purely demonstration purposes it make it a quicker turn round time but did it happen on railways in the days of break vans?

Offline Newportnobby

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+63)
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • N Gauge Society Number: 21962
  • Posts: 29624
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2018, 02:55:13 pm »
All I know is the answer is "Yes".
I remember long mineral freights through Wolverton with one at each end and sometimes more than one elsewhere in the rake

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2018, 03:11:26 pm »
Thatís interesting would the ones marshalled with in the formation be for splitting the train down at various locations along the line???

Offline NGS-PO

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2018, 03:16:29 pm »
The Cliffe to Uddingston cement train had a brake vehicle at each end because the train reversed direction during the long journey (at least once) and so negated the hassle of having to move a single brake from one end to the other.
PLEASE NOTE: Unless where obviously posting on behalf of the NGS, all posts and views are my own and not connected/endorsed by the Society.

ďHaving anxiety and depression is like being scared and tired at the same time. It's the fear of failure, but no urge to be productive. It's wanting friends, but hate socializing. It's wanting to be alone, but not wanting to be lonely. It's feeling everything at once then feeling paralyzingly numb.Ē

We're not crazy, or insane, we're just people living with a condition.

SEEKING THE FOLLOWING FARISH BLUE RIBAND MK1 MAROON COACHES. PLEASE DROP ME A LINE IF YOU HAVE ANY TO SELL:

BSK x15
CK x10
FO x2
SK x11
SO x2
CCT x12

Offline Dorsetmike

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 2365
  • Posts: 3170
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • Grumpy old fart
    • Skype
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2018, 03:19:36 pm »
"Fitted vehicles", i.e those fitted with vacuum brakes would normally be marshalled immediately behind the loco so that their braking could be used (in early BR days they could be identified by being coloured bauxite, non fitted vehicles were grey) brake vans would often be found at front as well as the rear and occasionally additional ones elswhere; where there were a number of fitted vehicles then additional brake vans would not be required, only the one at the rear in which the guard travelled.
Cheers MIKE
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)


How many roads must a man walk down ... ... ... ... ... before he knows he's lost!

Offline Newportnobby

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+63)
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • N Gauge Society Number: 21962
  • Posts: 29624
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2018, 09:17:01 pm »
Thatís interesting would the ones marshalled with in the formation be for splitting the train down at various locations along the line???

That's distinctly possible but, as Mike says in reply #4, it could also depend on what wagons make up the train.

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2018, 09:39:33 pm »
 Well called in to the svr shop at Bridgnorth this afternoon before it closed and picked up a couple of extra break vans just to be safe and when the wife asked me why I just blamed you guys saying that you lot had told me that I would be needing more of them  :laugh3:

Offline EastMidsCoal

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 72
  • Country: gb
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2018, 09:43:09 pm »
Hi Tim,
I would suggest that brake vans at both ends were not commonplace, but by no means rare.  As others have said it all depends on the type of wagons, the make-up of the train, and also its routing.

I recall back in steam days, coal services (made up of 16-ton minerals and brake vans either end) arriving at Ironbridge had to do a complicated shunt at Madeley Junction when arriving from the north.  It involved, running past the junction, then propelling back onto the branch, then forwards into a loop on the 'Down' side.  Loco uncoupled and ran-round, recoupled to the train, brake test and away down the branch to the power station.  The use of pairs of brake vans there saved not only shunt moves but also time, with only the down loop for use it would have needed either to the block the Down Main or more likely head to the next yard down the line where the shunt to swap the brake van from one end to the other could take place.

Interestingly it also happened with some air-braked coal trains.  There was a Merry-Go-Round (MGR) flow in the late-1980s, usually Class 20-hauled I think (I'll stand corrected!) to one of the Trent Valley Power Station (Willington I think) that was formed of air-braked HAA wagons, but had brake vans each end.  This was nothing to do with reversals on route, as air braked trains such as the MGRs did not use them, but because it traversed one of the branches, possibly to Denby, and there was a guard (no, more likely a shunter or gateman) who accompanied the train to deal with the gates on the road crossings.  Why two brake vans? Well, the secondman would open the gates to allow the train through, the shunter in the rear brake van would then close them after it passed.  This saved having to wait for a staff member to walk the length of the train at every road crossing.  With limited ability to shunt the van to the other end of the train, and also the time that would take, there was one on each end for each direction.  In this example, the brake vans were nothing more than somewhere for the shunter to travel in, they had no braking function at all!

Richard

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2018, 09:58:00 pm »
Thanks for the information guys found it interesting and useful was nice to hear about the trains in to iron bridge as I now only live a few minutes drive from there in telford and often treat the current mrs Millington to chips and we sit on the river bank where the line crosses the Severn to eat them and who says romance is dead  ;)

Offline Newportnobby

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+63)
  • Full Member
  • *****
  • N Gauge Society Number: 21962
  • Posts: 29624
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2018, 10:01:49 pm »
I used to live in Norfield View in Randlay, Telford :D

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2018, 10:08:40 pm »
Itís a small world Iím a Wolverhampton boy originally but moved to stirchley telford a couple of years ago love being so close to my beloved Severn valley railway and the brilliant pub thatís there

Offline tutenkhamunsleeping

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 23866
  • 2mm Association Number: 4854
  • Posts: 1504
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Ebay
    • YouTube
    • My Rail Photos
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2018, 10:29:56 pm »
Very small world. Iíve lived in Randlay, Priorslee and now Donnington.

Of course, not once did I photograph anything on the Ironbridge line :-[

Offline Timofpenk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 53
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
    • Awards
Re: Freight formations
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2018, 10:35:48 pm »
Telford the N gauge center of the world???

 

Please Support Us!
October Goal: £55.00
Due Date: Oct 31
Total Receipts: £60.00
Above Goal: £5.00
Site Currency: GBP
109% 
October Donations


Advertise Here
anything