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Author Topic: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!  (Read 23666 times)

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Offline dannyboy

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #225 on: December 12, 2016, 10:57:23 pm »
Okay, my arm is twisted enough - I will put in another order for a set of 3 - might go for the Esso ones this time  :thumbsup:  :)
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.

Offline jrb

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #226 on: December 12, 2016, 11:37:15 pm »
I've just placed my third (and final... :uneasy:) order.

Now got 3x triples & a single in Esso, and 2x triples & a single in unbranded. I think 17 really is my limit...

At least if it doesn't go ahead I'll get a sizeable payment back, which I can then spend on other stock. It's almost like a savings scheme!
I'm supporting Revolution Trains' Class 'B' project:

Offline dannyboy

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #227 on: December 13, 2016, 01:57:13 am »
Okay, my arm is twisted enough - I will put in another order for a set of 3 - might go for the Esso ones this time  :thumbsup:  :)

Gone and done it - think I might have to tell SWMBO that she has bought me 3 unbranded ones for my birthday, (hopefully they will be with us before next May  ??? :worried:).
David.
I used to be indecisive - now I'm not - I don't think.

Offline red_death

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #228 on: December 13, 2016, 08:10:51 am »
hopefully they will be with us before next May

Hi Danny

Absolutely no chance - even if we had been able to start tooling straight away from the completion of CAD we would still have been lucky to have received them by Summer 2017. By adding a potential 5-6 month delay into the process to wait for sufficient orders to justify tooling you can see the knock on effect will be that production won't be until late 2017/early 2018 (even that is quick progress).

At the moment we are at orders of under 50% of what we need to sell to make the project financially viable. Between where we are now and the number we need to make the project viable there is a number of orders that Ben and I would be prepared to take the risk that we would sell enough further wagons to enable us to authorise tooling - bluntly the sooner we reach that number the sooner we can start tooling (if we get there before Feb 2017 then we will start straight away).  If we don't reach that number by end of Feb 2017 then we refund everyone as we won't hold peoples' monies indefinitely.

Once we reach our internal sales target we will authorise tooling, but of course we will still need to sell more to make the project viable and the order book will remain open until we start production.

Please don't forget you don't have to pay the full amount now, you can pay a 50% deposit now and the balance when we start production.

Cheers, Mike



Offline Dalek

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #229 on: December 13, 2016, 10:50:08 am »
Read the thread, all will be revealed!
Basically you need to buy now, not next month, not next week & not tomorrow!! NOW!!

I have been reading it on and off over its course but its 16 pages now and i don't think a simple question is too much to ask  :)

Offline PaulCheffus

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #230 on: December 13, 2016, 10:52:34 am »
Read the thread, all will be revealed!
Basically you need to buy now, not next month, not next week & not tomorrow!! NOW!!

I have been reading it on and off over its course but its 16 pages now and i don't think a simple question is too much to ask  :)

Hi

Post above yours gives February 2017 as the cutoff date.

Cheers

Paul

Offline Dalek

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #231 on: December 13, 2016, 11:01:31 am »
Hi Craig and all

Ben and I had a review of the latest figures at the weekend and we have to confess that we are in a real quandary with this wagon. 

The bad news is that we are still not at a level of sales where we could justify tooling. The good news is that we have seen an increase in orders recently.

We really don't want to cancel the project and refund people, but we have to be realistic. What is becomingly increasingly clear is that the pattern of orders is different to our modern wagons with far fewer orders for sizeable numbers of the Class B than our TEAs (or the expressions of interest in our HOAs).

So we are going to give the project until the end of February before we make a final decision - that allows us to talk to people at Glasgow and allows customers to get Christmas out of the way.

Cheers, Mike

Thanks for the reply Mike :)
I will come and seek you out at the Glasgow show  :wave:

The tanks look great, actually much better than great, they look fantastic !  :thumbsup: :greatpicturessign:

Looking at it from another perspective though i could get peco tank wagons for about 8 each, yours is more than double that. Now before you all shoot me to death perhaps thats how people are maybe holding back and not placing oders, i don't know ?

Having said that i do intend on buying some, quality is better than quantity ! (unless its far away in the distance!). I just need to recover after x-mas ! :o

Craig

Offline Dalek

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #232 on: December 13, 2016, 11:02:36 am »
Read the thread, all will be revealed!
Basically you need to buy now, not next month, not next week & not tomorrow!! NOW!!

I have been reading it on and off over its course but its 16 pages now and i don't think a simple question is too much to ask  :)

Hi

Post above yours gives February 2017 as the cutoff date.

Cheers

Paul

Yes, i know that now.  :thankyousign:

Offline Bob G

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #233 on: December 13, 2016, 11:24:13 am »
Really appreciate the update Mike.

The only additional thing I can think of to stretch the sales potential would be to approach Hattons/Rails/Osborns/Kernow with the opportunity for them to buy a proportion of the production for resale at the RRP. That might reduce the return to you guys but could get the numbers you require. An exclusive deal with one of them might be the way to go?

The alternative (not my recommendation) would be to buy a tranche yourselves and sell them on EBay - the TEA tankers were glowing red last weekend on that site.

Just a thought.
Bob

Offline red_death

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #234 on: December 13, 2016, 11:53:45 am »
Looking at it from another perspective though i could get peco tank wagons for about 8 each, yours is more than double that. Now before you all shoot me to death perhaps thats how people are maybe holding back and not placing oders, i don't know ?

Hi Craig

That may well be the case and in an ideal world we would love to be able to price things at a lower price (I mean who doesn't want cheaper models!), but we have already swallowed a double price increase (from currency fluctuations (or we will if we get to tooling) and from increases to tooling and production costs) without putting our price up.

We don't want to start compromising on quality and our business model is very different from Peco's (or Farish). We are doing comparatively short runs which have to pay off the tooling on the first run (as there may never be a second run!). When you look at the price of Farish's Covhop (RRP 21.95) then we think this is a comparable standard of model and a reasonable price for modern tooling.

Cheers, Mike



Offline Snowwolflair

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #235 on: December 13, 2016, 12:13:05 pm »
Possibly they are not "sexy" or stunning enough to turn heads.  Let me explain;

At three recent shows I have seen TEA tankers turn heads and prompt questions.  They are distinct and desirable.  the Class 92, Pendalino etc will all get noticed and will have people reaching for their wallets.  I am not sure the B tankers are that distinctive.

Having said that I have reserved nine of the Mobil Charringtons Red B tanks as my grandfather was the Scottish manager for transport for Mobil from the 30's to the 60's so I have a personal reason for those particular models.

PECO are good they are very basic, lack detail and they do not have NEM pockets although they keep saying some day for this feature..

Offline Ben A

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #236 on: December 13, 2016, 12:17:53 pm »
Looking at it from another perspective though i could get peco tank wagons for about 8 each, yours is more than double that. Now before you all shoot me to death perhaps thats how people are maybe holding back and not placing oders, i don't know ?

<snipped>

Craig

Hi Craig,

No one is going to shoot you down, and that is an excellent point.  I think there are lots of factors involved in this, and one undoubtedly seems to be that a significant sector of this part of the market is esopecailly price conscious.

Mike has already given a good assessment of the figures, but in addition I would add that the point of Revolution is to offer adult modellers who care about detail and accuracy high-end models that are not compromised to save a few pounds.

In my view this is the key to re-defining N gauge as a scale that offers the best combination of fidelity and space saving; and therefore growing the market and attracting discerning modellers from other scales.

Cheaper models, with more basic or generic detail, or that may not be quite right for a particular era or operation, will always be available and if that is what a particular sector of the market prefers then fair enough; so be it.

In terms of arranging for exclusive models we are not averse to this possibility and if approached would certainly consider the options, however the core principle is that our direct supporters will always get the best deal.

Cheers

Ben A.



Offline red_death

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #237 on: December 13, 2016, 12:39:15 pm »
The only additional thing I can think of to stretch the sales potential would be to approach Hattons/Rails/Osborns/Kernow with the opportunity for them to buy a proportion of the production for resale at the RRP. That might reduce the return to you guys but could get the numbers you require. An exclusive deal with one of them might be the way to go?

The alternative (not my recommendation) would be to buy a tranche yourselves and sell them on EBay - the TEA tankers were glowing red last weekend on that site.

Hi Bob

Retail - I'd hope that our existing retailers (and we have added a couple more since the TEAs!) will pick up some orders, but many of the retailers are in as difficult a position as the rest of us ie strapped for cash and may be reluctant to fund things upfront - that is OK, that is why we always make sure that people who order direct from us get the best prices as they are the people trusting us with their money and making sure the projects can go ahead.  The retailers (in most, not all cases) are "topping up" the order book - with the TEAs the retail orders were the difference between breaking even and making a small surplus that we could invest in the next projects (Class B tank CAD as it happened!).

The TEA sales on Ebay have got very interesting and of course what people do with their models once they have paid for them is entirely up to them.

Cheers, Mike




Offline Barry M

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #238 on: December 13, 2016, 12:42:04 pm »
Hi Craig and all

Ben and I had a review of the latest figures at the weekend and we have to confess that we are in a real quandary with this wagon. 

The bad news is that we are still not at a level of sales where we could justify tooling. The good news is that we have seen an increase in orders recently.

We really don't want to cancel the project and refund people, but we have to be realistic. What is becomingly increasingly clear is that the pattern of orders is different to our modern wagons with far fewer orders for sizeable numbers of the Class B than our TEAs (or the expressions of interest in our HOAs).

So we are going to give the project until the end of February before we make a final decision - that allows us to talk to people at Glasgow and allows customers to get Christmas out of the way.

Cheers, Mike

Thanks for the reply Mike :)
I will come and seek you out at the Glasgow show  :wave:

The tanks look great, actually much better than great, they look fantastic !  :thumbsup: :greatpicturessign:

Looking at it from another perspective though i could get peco tank wagons for about 8 each, yours is more than double that. Now before you all shoot me to death perhaps thats how people are maybe holding back and not placing oders, i don't know ?

Having said that i do intend on buying some, quality is better than quantity ! (unless its far away in the distance!). I just need to recover after x-mas ! :o

Craig

You can't get Peco Class B 35T Tank wagons....??
Building 'Bromsgrove' - a large N Gauge layout depicting the banking practices 1958-1964 on the Lickey. DCC and computer controlled with Railroad & Co!

Offline PaulCheffus

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Re: EXCLUSIVE - REVOLUTION Goes To The Top Of Class B!
« Reply #239 on: December 13, 2016, 12:46:58 pm »
Hi Craig and all

Ben and I had a review of the latest figures at the weekend and we have to confess that we are in a real quandary with this wagon. 

The bad news is that we are still not at a level of sales where we could justify tooling. The good news is that we have seen an increase in orders recently.

We really don't want to cancel the project and refund people, but we have to be realistic. What is becomingly increasingly clear is that the pattern of orders is different to our modern wagons with far fewer orders for sizeable numbers of the Class B than our TEAs (or the expressions of interest in our HOAs).

So we are going to give the project until the end of February before we make a final decision - that allows us to talk to people at Glasgow and allows customers to get Christmas out of the way.

Cheers, Mike

Thanks for the reply Mike :)
I will come and seek you out at the Glasgow show  :wave:

The tanks look great, actually much better than great, they look fantastic !  :thumbsup: :greatpicturessign:

Looking at it from another perspective though i could get peco tank wagons for about 8 each, yours is more than double that. Now before you all shoot me to death perhaps thats how people are maybe holding back and not placing oders, i don't know ?

Having said that i do intend on buying some, quality is better than quantity ! (unless its far away in the distance!). I just need to recover after x-mas ! :o

Craig

You can't get Peco Class B 35T Tank wagons....??

Hi

No they don't however I think the point was that other people would see the Peco tank wagon at 8 and think well I can have that for that price why should I pay over twice that for one.

To some people one four wheel tank is the same as another and they are quite happy with something that looks like a tanker. There is absolutely nothing wrong with this view.

Cheers

Paul

 

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