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Poll

N gauge Pendolino

Yes I'd invest in a crowd sourcing venture for a 9 car N gauge Pendolino
62 (36.3%)
No I wouldn't
78 (45.6%)
I have voted on the RMWeb poll so cannot vote here
31 (18.1%)

Total Members Voted: 169

Author Topic: Pendolino - a new approach  (Read 287719 times)

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Offline red_death

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2610 on: June 18, 2018, 10:20:48 pm »
One thought about repairs/support etc (and to show that we're not trying to avoid ownership of the problem):  we've been forwarding problems across to Rapido's repairs agent as we've been asked to.  The difficulty is that we have no way of knowing whether he has resolved problems or not so we will start logging those customers that we've passed to Simon and ask Simon to report to us when he has resolved the problem. We can then chase more effectively to make sure things get resolved.

Cheers, Mike



Online Dr Al

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2611 on: June 18, 2018, 10:22:10 pm »
Dr Al is right to keep pressing about the missing parts.

Absolutely, and I have done my best to answer.  But if I don't answer, it's usually because I don't know the answer. 

I'm not wading in to too much of the hyperbole here, other than to come back to the above point......Respectfully, to this very specific ask I've actually had no response - after twice asking publicly in the last week here, and I kind of feel it's a simple and not unreasonable question:

I did not receive the screws for the light bars when sent out - that was swiftly acknowledged as a foul up by Rapido, when I first pointed it out on this thread - fair enough.

However, that was ever such a long time ago (March 28 to be precise - 12+ weeks ago), and I have not subsequently received them - have they not been sent yet? If they have now all been sent to those missing them, then I'm sorry but they haven't - I have 27 currently unusable bars.

Having said that, I can't actually use them yet even if I did have the screws, as I have no idea if all 4 of my sets will have to go back due to the various faults that I've yet to have comeback on, 11 weeks 6 days since the faults were first pointed out (April 3), and 4 weeks and 1 day since I sent first email requesting rectification (May 20) after patiently waiting from April 3 to May 20.

Also - new question alert (!) - if/when I have to send units back, I presume Revolution will be paying that postage cost....? If so how will this be re-imbursed? I won't be at all happy if I'm expected to pay it given they were sent Parcelforce, which at retail is 12 quid a shot.....

Cheers,
Alan

Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Offline red_death

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2612 on: June 18, 2018, 10:29:12 pm »
Alan

In the "excitement" of tonight's posts I missed your question about light bar screws but in answer to your questions:

Light bar screws - no they haven't all been sent out yet.

Rapido's repair agent has tried to make contact with everyone (he thinks) so I'll compare our list with his to make sure what has happened as there seems to be something falling down - I've chased him tonight about your problem and Newportnobby's. Simon did say that he hadn't heard back from 4 or 5 people he's tried to contact.

Postage - it will be at our/Rapido's cost. I will check with Simon how he normally deals with it. If he has nothing in place then we will find a solution.

Cheers, Mike



Offline acko22

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2613 on: June 18, 2018, 11:05:13 pm »
Hi all,

Ok firstly Ben and Mike if there is anything you feel I have said is in correct please tell me to go away or  :censored: shut up! Where I will duly correct it!

For the Pendo both of these guys have been enablers not the manufacturer so to compare Revolution to the likes DJM / Dapol / Farish is a little misconceived, they are purely getting US as a community together in a unified voice to say that's what we want and if the shouting is loud enough put our money where our mouth is!

As both have held their hands up there has been mistakes and I personally applaud them for been man enough for holding their hands up and admitting so, they are still learning but around their day jobs which let face it as anyone who has ever worked 2 jobs knows is a hell of a task in itself!

My take on things isn't so much the fault of these guys after all they have had a hell of an undertaking and considering the factors they have done amazing. I actually lay the fault at Rapido they want to be in the UK market and this was their first test in the N gauge world, and with regards to the after care they have been found wanting.

In my opinion they should have had a repair agent in place before the models arrived instead of leaving things at Ben and Mikes door which includes in effect saying Revolution will deal with the repairs by having their email as who to contact in case of warranty repairs if the plan was so source a repair agent which was done post arrival of the models.

I appreciate what I say isn't going to magically sort any issues some of you guys have, but hopefully as all parties learn and know what to do right it will improve things for all and in the mean time get you running your models. (Which if they are as good as they look then I am in for a right treat when mine finally come out of the box)

But one thing that has been said that has annoyed me was the comment


As a final point I think Revolution have abused their relationship with this forum using it as a convenient marketing tool for their own benefit. Don't know what contribution, if any, they have made towards the upkeep of the Forum and that is Tank's business. Certainly in my opinion it is only the Forum that has made this Company the success that it is. Would any of the other manufacturers have got away with so many postings. Interesting that although both Ben and Mike hold positions with the NGS there are nowhere near as many posts about NGS forthcoming or current models and forum members are encouraged to go to the NGS Facebook page or website.



As already pointed out if @Tank had an issue I am sure he would have voiced it to Ben and Mike directly! Would any other manufactures have got away with so many posts? Well just look on other forums and they are posting just as regular in numerous cases more so YES they would and DO!!
As to the NGS (Thanks for reminding me I need to renew my membership) why should they post more themselves about the NGS they have elected members and volunteers who are there to do things regarding the society buisness its not just Mike and Ben and if anything Ben is one of the more active posters regarding NGS matters.

Sorry it just struck me as extremely naive and honestly complete   :poop: but as i say that's my opinion from where I stand.

As others have finished that my rant over

Online Dr Al

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2614 on: June 18, 2018, 11:16:04 pm »
Just a quick public thanks to Mike, who has clearly been chasing things behind the scenes - I now have had proper contact and instructions from the repair agent. Clearly a previous reply to my query was either lost to the email gods, or eaten by spam.

Hopefully, rectification will move on swiftly from now.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Online ColinH

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2615 on: June 18, 2018, 11:46:31 pm »
Did a long reply to Ben's post above but it seems to have got lost and don't want to type it all again so will just say thanks to both Ben and Mike for taking the time to respond to my post.
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Offline Newportnobby

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2616 on: June 19, 2018, 09:53:43 am »
Just a quick public thanks to Mike, who has clearly been chasing things behind the scenes - I now have had proper contact and instructions from the repair agent. Clearly a previous reply to my query was either lost to the email gods, or eaten by spam.

Hopefully, rectification will move on swiftly from now.

Cheers,
Alan


I've also had a reply from the repair agent (thanks Mike) and, like Alan, a mail to me has gone missing somewhere in the ether.
I also agree with @acko22 in that a warranty system should have been sorted out by Rapido and not dropped into RevolutioN's lap.

Offline woodbury22uk

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2617 on: June 19, 2018, 10:03:14 am »
It is somewhat ironic that ColinH's long response got "lost" somewhere (see post #2634 above). Just last week I had a whole series of legitimate messages which failed to reach me because my email provider classified them as "spam" and never even delivered them to my "spam" folder. Turns out that they have a lot of educational establishments on their blacklist, and the sender used his computer at work to send the messages even though they were from his peronal email account. This meant that they got caught as from a blacklisted source. When he resent the messages from home, everything sailed through.


A regular complaint on internet forum sites is that manufacturers and sellers generally do not participate in them. An advantage of having RevolutioN on the NGF and RMWeb is that there is another avenue for contact if the regular message system seems to be failing the sender. And there is the opportunity for informed discussion rather than rumour which develops when those in the know are not involved.

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Offline njee20

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2618 on: June 19, 2018, 10:08:14 am »
I'm don't want to comment on the specifics of how Revolution operate, other than to say that I am extremely glad Ben and Mike are so visible on here and on RMWeb. I don't think there's any abuse of their 'position' whatsoever - ultimately these are public forums and anyone can join and post. I wouldn't want anything to change on this front, I think it's a huge advantage to us as consumers.

I've been extremely happy with all my models from them and will continue to back them. I understand frustrations people have, having waited a good while only to receive something which doesn't live up to the high standards we should all expect, but it does sound like these issues are being resolved, and I'm sure lessons are being learned which will help with future projects.

Offline PWayman

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2619 on: June 19, 2018, 05:12:06 pm »
I just hope that Ben and Mike right now are not wondering why they let themselves in for this lot. Is it worth it they may well be thinking and I for one hope that this is not the case. They have supplied me with 2 Pendo sets I would not otherwise have, two affordable class 92's on order and a class 321 hopefully.
    Major manufacturers would never have attempted a Pendo set. and the Farish class 350 EMU has not sold well and although Farish are supposed to be producing a class 319, will it actually appear ?
    This suggests to me that EMU's would probably not be risked by a major manufacturer again thus leaving a big hole in the model supply for people modelling modern layouts.
    My WCML layout was crying out for modern West Coast trains to replace my MK3 class 87 hauled sets and now is graced by the 2 Pendos thanks to Mike and Ben.
    Many people owe a great deal to these two guys and lets make sure they don't throw the towel in and ask themselves why are we doing this in our spare time, is it worth it?
    I am eternally grateful for the hard work in their own spare time,( most likely with no time for their own modelling) to benefit other modellers big style.
    I collected my 2 sets and lightbars at York and am patiently awaiting the screws to fit them arriving. Mike says they have not all been sent out yet.
    Come on people, lets get real at what has been achieved selflessly by them.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2018, 05:13:14 pm by PWayman »

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2620 on: June 19, 2018, 07:27:41 pm »
As nearly all the sets have been sent out is there any idea if there will be any “left overs” (I know you guys are busy with the other projects and deliveries), when I ordered mine from Rapido the only DC 11 car set left was the poppylino, just wondering if I should keep funds for maybe one more or spend them on a 321 and 92s.

Also and sorry for this being OT, any closing dates for the KFAs and 92s?

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Offline Bob Tidbury

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2621 on: June 19, 2018, 10:33:55 pm »
I know some of you modern modellers will think this a stupid question but here goes ,I know that Virgin had some class 57 locos to rescue a broken down Pendolino and that they were called thunderbirds and named after the characters in the series and they had a different coupling but my question is did the 57s ever PUSH a Pendolino ?
Bob Tidbury

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2622 on: June 19, 2018, 11:09:43 pm »
Good question. :hmmm: I've only ever seen a T-bird (of whatever livery; Virgin, DRS) dragging a MU. The dynamics of pushing will be very different to pulling - is the coupler up to it?
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Offline acko22

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2623 on: June 20, 2018, 01:18:51 am »
I know some of you modern modellers will think this a stupid question but here goes ,I know that Virgin had some class 57 locos to rescue a broken down Pendolino and that they were called thunderbirds and named after the characters in the series and they had a different coupling but my question is did the 57s ever PUSH a Pendolino ?
Bob Tidbury

Hi Bob,

 On the mainline as far as I am aware never so I posed the question to a friend on the railways and his answer was that on a mainline service it will never happen, the Pendolino effectively becomes coaches just as a rake of Mk2 would, and that in the rule book the loco has to be a the front of the train for a mainline service. The biggest reasons been that if there was to be some form of malfunction at the controls such as:

The locomotive brakes working and the coach brakes not operating as normal - So the locomotive brakes can still be operated to bring the train to a safe standstill.

Failure in coupling between the train and locomotive - So as standard if the train does uncouple for any reason and the locomotive is at the rear its a question of braking distance as the brakes would slam on due to complete loss of pressure and the braking force per ton on the Pendolino is much greater than the locomotive so there is a massive risk that the locomotive especially on a downward gradient would rear end the Pendolino which has come to a stand still.

Failure in control - This one does have a question mark over it as he is unsure if you can control the locomotive from the Pendo cab! - But if you can and there is a failure in the control systems then you could end up with a loco not responding (brakes going on, etc) as required and there is no way to override it without getting off the train to get back on and this ins't going to happen at 50mph so by having the loco at the front you have the controls of the powering locomotive to any issues  can be dealt with in cab.

That is all on mainline running at speed they can however push the trains in shunting moves at low speed generally under instruction from staff on the ground, which does happen on a regular basis

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Re: Pendolino - a new approach
« Reply #2624 on: June 20, 2018, 01:44:17 am »
And the Pendo cannot be configured as a driving trailer.

 

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