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Your Layout and Models => Layout Planning => Topic started by: cornish yorkie on June 07, 2015, 02:37:50 pm

Title: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 07, 2015, 02:37:50 pm
Hello everybody, I reckon it`s time to share my ideas for the layout I hope to start building in the very near future. The layout will be housed in a 20x8ft shed & I have exclusive use.
   I love long fast passenger trains so lots of straight track is a must along with large stations. Absolutely nothing wrong with the smaller interurbans to add variety along with a couple of steamers & maybe even some freight but most importantly totally rule one.
  I have read many times start small & I intend to build in sections but I need a plan to aspire to.
   Kato is my favorite for track as well as stock, I also have a small amount of Peco so this may feature as well.
   Any & all comments are very welcome good or bad

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/23/thumb_25721.jpg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=25721)

Hope the track plan has uploaded

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Newportnobby on June 07, 2015, 03:03:02 pm
Sorry, Derek, but no sign of the track plan :(
It sounds like you have an envious amount of space to model in. My first comment (without sight of the plan) is that such trains look better traversing sweeping curves so don't be tempted to have parallel tracks to baseboard edges but create some nice curves. I always find picturing Liz Hurley helps me with that :D


I love long fast passenger trains so lots of straight track is a must along with large stations.

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 07, 2015, 03:21:32 pm
Hi NN thanks for the reply will try & get the track plan uploaded asap.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Sprintex on June 07, 2015, 03:28:10 pm
Hi Derek,

Your trackplan uploaded OK but for some reason the image link wasn't in your post above. Have corrected it for you :thumbsup:

Nice plan! :)


Paul
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 07, 2015, 03:33:28 pm
 :thankyousign: Cheers Sprintex I am slowly getting there.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on June 12, 2015, 05:52:15 pm
Looks a great plan but as NN said sweeping curves look good, too late on my layout which is a lot smaller anyway but at this stage you are going to be attracting loads of advice. All the best keep us all updated, George.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 13, 2015, 12:11:00 am
Hi George thanks for your input, it is much appreciated. Still. thinking so watch this space
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 19, 2015, 11:12:35 am
 :hellosign: everybody  :sorrysign: for the gap but been on holiday (to IOW) and work keeps getting in the way of play. Still doing lots of thinking and planning on Scarm, nearly get a trackplan I really like then start to find silly errors so start again time. Ok better on my computer than on real wood and track and love to play on Scarm.
   Right silly question time, I plan to use Kato track with No4 points and if Ibuild a loop would any sidings loops or passing places be safe to store trains as long as points are straight. I know it should be obvious but I need to know  :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 27, 2015, 10:40:59 am
   :hellosign: Been on holiday again, (Blackpool, first time seen new trams, very impressed) & what with work not had a lot of time for my plans. Had lots of ideas & I think we have come up with a track plan which ticks all the boxes. Thanks to Railsquid & G Scale Bruce for the brilliant idea of Ikea Ivar shelving units although the Hejne range looks a lot more flexible. Has anybody any experience of these units please ?. Also after meeting Martin (Port Perran) at the Hayle show & seeing Trepol Bay his brilliant layout in action I Know DCC is not a priority, again many thanks Martin. I will try to upload new track plan later.  :NGaugersRule:
regards Derek.   
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on September 27, 2015, 12:23:46 pm
   :hellosign: Been on holiday again, (Blackpool, first time seen new trams, very impressed) & what with work not had a lot of time for my plans. Had lots of ideas & I think we have come up with a track plan which ticks all the boxes. Thanks to Railsquid & G Scale Bruce for the brilliant idea of Ikea Ivar shelving units although the Hejne range looks a lot more flexible. Has anybody any experience of these units please ?
It's G Scale Bruce you need to thank, I got the idea from him. Only difference is my shelves are 30cm rather than 50cm deep, as otherwise they'd be a bit big for the room. Still surprising how much space there is to fill...
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 27, 2015, 12:51:10 pm
   :hellosign: thanks for the reply. Both the Ivar & Hejne range are available in 30cm or 50cm widths the only downside I seen in Ivar is the uprights invade the shelf space, could you please tell me how far this is.  :sorrysign: to be a pain but my nearest Ikea is 150 miles away.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on September 27, 2015, 01:05:56 pm
   :hellosign: thanks for the reply. Both the Ivar & Hejne range are available in 30cm or 50cm widths the only downside I seen in Ivar is the uprights invade the shelf space, could you please tell me how far this is.  :sorrysign: to be a pain but my nearest Ikea is 150 miles away.
regards Derek.
No problem - the Ivar uprights are 32mm deep and 44mm wide.

The downside of the Hejne range for me is that while the uprights don't intrude onto the shelf space, they're a bit more "store room shelf" in character and just wouldn't look so good in the space I have; and they're less versatile in terms of height adjustment (which is important for me). Also the uprights seem much wider than the Ivar ones, possibly blocking some viewing angles. But that's just my opinion  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 27, 2015, 01:23:59 pm
  :thankyousign: Railsquid for your quick reply, that information is very interesting I will have another look at the Ikea website, thanks again.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 27, 2015, 03:31:56 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: My latest track plan still will be Kato track, the unfinished line is a possible tramway/ LRV it is all work in progress. The pink boxes are 2 800x800mm end modules & 2 700x1550mm modules for the main station. The blue are Hejne shelving units from Ikea that fit perfectly into the space. Any all comments welcome.
regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on September 27, 2015, 04:07:56 pm
  :thankyousign: Railsquid for your quick reply, that information is very interesting I will have another look at the Ikea website, thanks again.
regards Derek.
Oh, the other thing you may want to think about - regardless of which kind of shelf you go with - is lighting; in my setup the next shelf up is about 35cm over the layout shelf, which kind of puts it in the shade. At the moment I can light up the layout with my workbench lamp but thinking about getting some kind of led light strip (possibly with variable luminosity) for permanent use.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on September 27, 2015, 07:06:09 pm
 :thankyousign: Railsquid, I had not thought about the extra lighting that would be needed for under shelving, I agree LED strip light or similar will be needed.
  regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: GScaleBruce on October 04, 2015, 11:00:57 am
Just to add to Railsquid's measurements, on my current layout, I decided to have the baseboards entirely within the uprights so I could run a backscene straight along the back of the layout. Railsquid has taken the other path (as I did on my last layout) and used cutouts to accommodate the uprights and then build scenery round them. You can see this better in this post (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=24671.msg317137#msg317137).  I've ended up with a maximum baseboard width for the main boards of 22.5cm, which is 1cm less than the maximum inner width available so that the boards can, in theory, be twisted onto their sides and removed from within the uprights. Whether I'll ever actually do that now the scenery is taking shape, I doubt! It also means by layout is fully 7.5cm narrower than the uprights would actually accommodate. However, I then found I had to extend backwards to get my return curves in anyway, so I've ended up with a wiggly backscene and a bug ugly arrangement (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=23998.msg336694#msg336694) for the loops; I would have liked to use the 50cm shelves but I just don't have the space.

If all that sounds slightly obsessive over the measurements, it was, in order to get the maximum railway in the space available!

Lighting is an issue. I've used Rolson LED lamps, powered off a Maplins transformer rather than batteries, but tbh they're not great - I could do with a more even spread of lighting. I've arranged the lighting so that it's in sections and I can still remove the individual shelves to which it is fixed if I need to. Ikea do a couple of LED lighting strips, including one called Dioder, which looks useful, but like you I live a fair way from an Ikea, so I've not actually seen one for real.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 04, 2015, 11:25:41 am
Oh, somewhere I got the impression you were using 50cm shelves, maybe I got confused by the return loops (which I don't need as what I'm doing is making an extension from what will be the main layout. It's not designed in any way to be moved so I'm using all the available space and just pretending the uprights aren't there. I might paint the ones at the rear to better match the scenery; the base of one will be disguised by a building.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 04, 2015, 11:34:36 am
Lighting is an issue. I've used Rolson LED lamps, powered off a Maplins transformer rather than batteries, but tbh they're not great - I could do with a more even spread of lighting. I've arranged the lighting so that it's in sections and I can still remove the individual shelves to which it is fixed if I need to. Ikea do a couple of LED lighting strips, including one called Dioder, which looks useful, but like you I live a fair way from an Ikea, so I've not actually seen one for real.

I've strung up some LED fairy lights from IKEA as they were dirt cheap and I thought they might be useful for lighting structures, but they're a bit clunky for N. Unfortunately they don't really make much difference. I actually need one more shelf plate (they were out of stock last time I went) so I might pop along sometime soon-ish and take a look at their other options (if I time it carefully it's one train ride and one trip on a monorail).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 04, 2015, 01:54:26 pm
Talking of IKEA shelves, here's a section I customised earlier:

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/16/thumb_30087.jpg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=30087)

I'll be connecting the main layout with this section, and need some extra height between shelves.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 04, 2015, 11:33:48 pm
 :hellosign: Bruce, thanks for the imput it is really appreciated, if all goes to plan I will be lucky enough to have the space for 500mm shelves.
    :greatpicturessign: Railsquid thanks for sharing & you are so lucky living in Japan.

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2015, 12:01:57 pm
   :hellosign:  At last had chance to update SouthEast corner of the LRV/ Tram terminus part of the layout. I have used Anyrail as Scarm has no Kato tram on the track list.(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

  The plan is this will be in a mainly office area of a city. The main lines will circle on viaduct. Any/all comments or if anybody sees a glaring error would be very much appreciated. More to follow as I have weekend off :claphappy:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 08, 2015, 12:18:48 pm
Double track tram return loop? Looks electrically a bit scary. I'd go for a simple dumbell to keep things simple, and also reduce the risk of collisions, but that's just me.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2015, 12:33:43 pm
  :hellosign:  Railsquid, thanks for the reply. Yes I agree a double return looks electrically interesting but my theory is as I plan to only operate one train at once I am hoping the other track is for layover.  If I have this all wrong I stand to be corrected.    :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 09, 2015, 07:32:10 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 09, 2015, 07:45:36 pm
   :hellosign:  Above is the latest version of my track plan. I have finished the LRV/ Tram line but am not totally happy with the station in the return loop. Maybe try using Anyrail & use Tram lines from Tomix although satisfied Kato looks good there again a mix could be the answer. As always any comment or suggestion, good or bad are welcome.
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 09, 2015, 08:26:49 pm
Thanks for the updates Derek.
Hopefully, you will soon have a track plan with which you are happy.
Martin
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 09, 2015, 08:39:04 pm
  :hellosign:  Martin, thanks for looking, yes I now believe the plan is really taking shape.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 11, 2015, 01:02:29 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: Thanks Railsquid for the idea of Tomix track. This the latest idea & we now have a tram terminus within a shopping area of a large town, again the main lines circle on viaduct but this is descending clockwise. The rest of the plan remains unchanged as I happy with this. I welcome all comments or suggestions,
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 11, 2015, 01:42:25 pm
Glad to be of help  :D Can I have some of your space?  :'(
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 11, 2015, 03:21:24 pm
  :hellosign:  If only I could,I am very fortunate to have large garden for shed & very understanding wife.  Must find time to sort gravel and order shed  :(

regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 11, 2015, 03:26:59 pm
It will be good to get the shed in place before Winter sets in Derek.
If you can get it lined and add some heating it should be really cosy !
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 11, 2015, 03:35:24 pm
 :hellosign:  Thanks Martin fingers are crossed.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on October 11, 2015, 03:39:48 pm
  :hellosign:  If only I could,I am very fortunate to have large garden for shed & very understanding wife.  Must find time to sort gravel and order shed  :(

regards Derek
Well I have one of those two at least  :D On the plus side, I do have space for a reasonable-sized layout in my railway room home office so shouldn't complain too much.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 11, 2015, 11:41:49 pm
  :hellosign: you are doing a superb job of your layout in your limited space.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 25, 2015, 09:32:42 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
  :hellosign: That work keeps getting in the way of serious playing/ planning, & no sign of shed yet but
been doing lots of thinking & thought a lot about this plan I created a while a go. The more I look the more I like, this time 2 large stations, much longer run although narrower boards & shelves & less scenery. Kato track on Ikea Hejne shelving or plywood boards topped with foam, cork or similar. This plan has the crazy but not impossible idea of a helix in the South East corner up to a higher level. All comments & suggestions good or bad are most welcome.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 26, 2015, 08:55:05 am
Not sure if it's just me but I can't open that image Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on October 26, 2015, 10:04:10 pm
Not sure if it's just me but I can't open that image Derek.

No, not just you. I can't see it either.
John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Caz on October 27, 2015, 10:25:08 am
I can see it fine.  It is in the Windows Bitmap format .bmp, maybe that's the problem?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Ditape on October 27, 2015, 10:40:33 am
I can see it fine.  It is in the Windows Bitmap format .bmp, maybe that's the problem?

No problem seeing it here either.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on October 27, 2015, 04:57:33 pm
All I can see is a small square with another black square inside it with a greyish X  on it... if I click on it IE 11 takes me to a blank page with the same small square & X on it.

Might I need to be trying a different browser rather than IE?

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Ditape on October 27, 2015, 07:10:17 pm
I am having no problems using Firefox, it seems to be the favoured browser for most forums.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on October 27, 2015, 07:41:13 pm
I am having no problems using Firefox, it seems to be the favoured browser for most forums.

I've not used Firefox in a long time!  Might give it a go if it is compatible with Windows 10.

John

Edit:  It works in Chrome!  Just IE then by the looks of it!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Sprintex on October 27, 2015, 07:49:17 pm
All I can see is a small square with another black square inside it with a greyish X  on it... if I click on it IE 11 takes me to a blank page with the same small square & X on it.


Same here on the laptop (Win7, IE11) but I can see it fine on the Blackberry.

Guessing it's the same format problem we get with PNG files too  :hmmm:


Paul
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on October 27, 2015, 08:50:53 pm
I can see the plan and it looks good to me, well done post as it progresses.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Ditape on October 27, 2015, 09:17:47 pm
I am having no problems using Firefox, it seems to be the favoured browser for most forums.

I've not used Firefox in a long time!  Might give it a go if it is compatible with Windows 10.

John

Edit:  It works in Chrome!  Just IE then by the looks of it!

Firefox works with windows 10
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 28, 2015, 01:43:10 am
   :hellosign: I tried to upload in JPEG as previous but kept getting invalid extension message. Thanks to all for looking.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 14, 2015, 07:40:25 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
  :hellosign: all, time off hideous work so had chance to put my latest ideas on to Scarm. I have decided to keep the two stations, although both smaller in about the same place. The major difference is the centre return loop is now enlarged & moved to the side of the entrance, so the central units are only 300mm wide enabling this width of unit all around the shed. The new plan has just one main running loop with stations on the side, the planned second loop will drop from above the top station with a large return loop or central station stop. This is still very much work in progress, with the high level to be decided & maybe a Tram/LRV line. This new approach means the build can be in stages with trains running sooner. Thanks for looking & all comments suggestions more than welcome.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on November 14, 2015, 08:13:24 pm
For what is worth I thought your first plan was better. Anyway good luck I am sure it will be great.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on November 14, 2015, 08:13:47 pm
Looks excellent Derek.
Is that a door between the two loops in the pink sections ?
If so , that is excellent use of space,
Very much looking forward to seeing this develop.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 14, 2015, 08:45:10 pm
For what is worth I thought your first plan was better. Anyway good luck I am sure it will be great.
  :hellosign: George, the first plan had the shed door on the end & now common sense in the garden dictates otherwise. Thanks for looking.
Looks excellent Derek.
Is that a door between the two loops in the pink sections ?
If so , that is excellent use of space,
Very much looking forward to seeing this develop.

:hellosign: Martin, yes the entrance is between the Pink sections which are Ply. The grey are Hejne shelving sections. Thanks for looking.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 28, 2015, 12:07:28 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: Still making steady progress with the latest plan. I have added tram / LRV lines to link two new tram /trolley circuits on each of the return loops which will feature city shopping/ buisness districts. Lots more to add as I have weekend off. Any & all comments or suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 29, 2015, 03:06:58 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: Another update to the latest plan which sees the higher level with sidings for freight or possible small container transhipment depot leading to a large return loop. I have swapped Hejne shelving in the two northern corners as the upright supports would interfere with the track & plan for these boards to be Ply, I can then place legs or supports where required. The central return loop will have Tomix tram track, the idea for the plan came from the highly recommended Tomix Trolley web site, I changed slightly then added the return loop for the LRV/ Tram line. Any & all comments & suggestions are always welcome, thanks for looking.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 13, 2015, 02:50:08 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: Still doing lots of thinking  :hmmm: the latest idea rearanges the track routes to keep high level at the rear as far as possible, the logic being the trains are in view more of the time. The lower LRV/ Tram lines will be close to the front & link to tram/ trolley circuits in the two Towns.  Still like the idea of multi-level for extra mileage, will add that part of the plan as i work it out. More importantly building in sections will allow running trains sooner  :claphappy:
Any & all comments & suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking.
regards Derek.   
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on December 13, 2015, 03:21:05 pm
Great layout there Derek. Planning is EVERYTHING enjoy.

I ave spent three weeks deciding what to do with Geominster and I have decided to start over having learnt a lot over the past three years. I am going to end the thread shortly, regards, George.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 13, 2015, 03:32:31 pm
Looks pretty good to me Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 13, 2015, 11:28:03 pm
 :hellosign: George, thanks for looking, yes I do enjoy planning but can't wait to start building


 :hellosign: Martin, thank you, seeing Port Perran is a great inspiration.
regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 28, 2015, 10:54:48 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: all hope you had a good christmas & best wishes for the New Year.
My latest update adds the Tram/LRV lines using Tomix track but this time linked onto the town centre sections & 2 mid-way stations. Not totally happy, is this too much track even for me ?. As always please feel free to comment or suggest or even criticise & thanks for looking.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 29, 2015, 07:57:45 am
Still looking very interesting Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 29, 2015, 01:25:37 pm
 :hellosign: Martin , thanks for looking, I took another critical close look & if you realise the track will be on 3 seperate levels hopefully it should`nt  look too overcrowded.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 29, 2015, 02:56:01 pm
Looking very good. Time spent planning such a complex layout will not be wasted, I'm sure. Even when you begin tracklaying allow for any changes once you've actually begun testing it!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 29, 2015, 06:54:37 pm
  :hellosign: Thanks for looking Chris, your advice will be well heeded, I am always on the lookout for my silly mistakes. Also a big thank you for part in the  N. Cornwall tales, very entertaining.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 29, 2015, 07:16:59 pm
  :hellosign: Thanks for looking Chris, your advice will be well heeded, I am always on the lookout for my silly mistakes. Also a big thank you for part in the  N. Cornwall tales, very entertaining.
regards Derek.

 :thankyousign: My pleasure, Derek. Cant Cove is a very simple layout but I spent a LOT of time organising the track layout, on paper, first, and it is, largely, based on a former station on the Bude line so I was NOT starting from scratch. The more time you spend running trains on your proposed layout before you fix all the track down the better, in my opinion, as with something so complex I'm sure that you'll find details you'll want to change. Scenery can be added as you 'sign off' each section! 8-) There's nothing worse than ripping up track, damaging points, and demolishing scenery!

Cant Cove was always meant to have a very detailed back story and, eventually, the 'Little People' (most of them already bought) will appear / reappear (some I cannot find, at present). I write the stories really for my own amusement and interest (doing the research, online, is easy; plus, at home, I have many books.)

When you're ready for 'through' running we'll be very happy for you to join in, if you wish, and are modelling some time period from the late 1950s to late 1960s! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 29, 2015, 09:24:08 pm
 :hellosign: Chris &   :thankyousign: as I live in Cornwall it would be fun to join in, however at the moment I cannot decide on a era or location to model. Keep up the good work  :beers:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 29, 2015, 09:33:00 pm
:hellosign: Chris &   :thankyousign: as I live in Cornwall it would be fun to join in, however at the moment I cannot decide on a era or location to model. Keep up the good work  :beers:
regards Derek.

 :thankyousign: Derek. The location is not so important as we can run enthusiast specials and special goods trains but the period is more important. I go from the BR Crimson & Cream Early Crest through to the early BR Blue & Grey (Blue D locos.) period. John (Claverdon) does, too.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 29, 2015, 10:53:13 pm



 :thankyousign: Derek. The location is not so important as we can run enthusiast specials and special goods trains but the period is more important. I go from the BR Crimson & Cream Early Crest through to the early BR Blue & Grey (Blue D locos.) period. John (Claverdon) does, too.
[/quote]

 :hellosign: Thanks Chris, I have a varied rosta from around the world & like most early diesels & some steam so as my ideas develop I will give this some deep thought  :thankyousign:

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on December 29, 2015, 11:28:53 pm
I too will be attempting to participate in this project from a fictitious location at the Birmingham end of things.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 30, 2015, 12:49:13 am
   :hellosign: Railsquid, look forward to developments , I feel some changes to my track plan may happen soon  :hmmm:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 30, 2016, 08:13:14 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)


 :hellosign: Everybody, took a lot of thinking what I really want from a model railway, quite possibly I have finally achieved my goal.  No 1 is space to run long fast trains, No 2 the large stations are on view storage, I don`t think I want a fiddle yard, No 3 lots of running line so we plan to go upward, the A is to next level & most importantly to be built in sections to allow running trains sooner :claphappy:  There will be space to add LRV/ Tram line under the centre station if desired. I think Kato track is my way forward & still like the idea of Ikea shelving, especially the legs, Celotex has many fans on the forum so sounds good for narrow or odd shaped boards. Thanks for looking & please feel free to comment or suggest
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 07, 2016, 10:49:30 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: All, really put the thinking cap on  :doh: & came up with my latest  :idea: The shape stays the same but I think making better use. The whole layout is going modular, more space on the bottom sections & less on the centre so still have walk around space. Also thinking would it be a good idea to have the narrow sections on brackets attached to the walls? Any comments and/or suggestions always welcome, thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 08, 2016, 07:28:56 am
Each iteration looks better than the last, Derek. My only comment would be to ensure that the visible curves (except, maybe, on the branchline?) are as gentle as possible and even hidden curves should be no tighter than they have to be, given the space you have. Being able to walk around the centre of the layout easily is, definitely, a big advantage. Having the narrow sections attached on brackets to the walls might well make sense.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: TylerB on February 08, 2016, 07:25:38 pm
Interesting design, I've only skipped through the previous designs so I apologize if this has been covered, but, are all lines going to be bi-directional or are you going to be running things as if it were a double/quadruple track main line, i.e having up and down lines, fasts and slows or whatever?

I noticed in an earlier thread you mentioned something about only running one train at a time, this seems a bit of a shame on a layout as extensive as this, if it was me I would love to see the four track bits being used all four lines at the same time, like the busy bits of the West or East Coast Main Line, have fast expresses overtaking slower coal trains while a local service passes by in the opposite direction, and a light loco idles on the slow line etc.

But nice to see that you are developing the idea, I suppose one advantage of using mostly Kato track is that you can lay it all out and get it running before you need to fix it down, therefore you can adapt the plan and move tracks around if you find bits aren't working how you would hope?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on February 08, 2016, 07:37:52 pm
I like it Derek.
As I think I said before, it is a good plan to be able to have a continuous run for when you want to sit and watch trains pass by with the option of each one reversing into the fiddle yard to be replaced by a different one. Plus, of course, you are accommodating a very good sized terminus station.
Very much looking forward to developments.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 08, 2016, 10:48:57 pm
Each iteration looks better than the last, Derek. My only comment would be to ensure that the visible curves (except, maybe, on the branchline?) are as gentle as possible and even hidden curves should be no tighter than they have to be, given the space you have. Being able to walk around the centre of the layout easily is, definitely, a big advantage. Having the narrow sections attached on brackets to the walls might well make sense.
:hellosign: Chris, your good advice is really appreciated I plan to use curves no less than 315mm & there won't be too many hidden thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 08, 2016, 11:01:53 pm
Interesting design, I've only skipped through the previous designs so I apologize if this has been covered, but, are all lines going to be bi-directional or are you going to be running things as if it were a double/quadruple track main line, i.e having up and down lines, fasts and slows or whatever?

I noticed in an earlier thread you mentioned something about only running one train at a time, this seems a bit of a shame on a layout as extensive as this, if it was me I would love to see the four track bits being used all four lines at the same time, like the busy bits of the West or East Coast Main Line, have fast expresses overtaking slower coal trains while a local service passes by in the opposite direction, and a light loco idles on the slow line etc.

But nice to see that you are developing the idea, I suppose one advantage of using mostly Kato track is that you can lay it all out and get it running before you need to fix it down, therefore you can adapt the plan and move tracks around if you find bits aren't working how you would hope?


 :hellosign:TylerB, thanks for looking the original idea is to have 2 long mainlines that are end to end but with loops for continuous running. I have been thinking of DC only but your comments about quad tracks make me thinking again. Kato track is so easy to work with so can't see that changing
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 08, 2016, 11:17:21 pm
I like it Derek.
As I think I said before, it is a good plan to be able to have a continuous run for when you want to sit and watch trains pass by with the option of each one reversing into the fiddle yard to be replaced by a different one. Plus, of course, you are accommodating a very good sized terminus station.
Very much looking forward to developments.
o

 :hellosign: Martin thanks for looking , yes continuous running is probably my number 1 importance for my layout . At the moment a fiddle yard as such is not planned , hopefully the stations will hold most of the stock but more ideas are in the pipeline. Hope to start construction soon
regards Derek,
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on February 10, 2016, 08:53:57 am
I like it Derek.
As I think I said before, it is a good plan to be able to have a continuous run for when you want to sit and watch trains pass by with the option of each one reversing into the fiddle yard to be replaced by a different one. Plus, of course, you are accommodating a very good sized terminus station.
Very much looking forward to developments.
o

 :hellosign: Martin thanks for looking , yes continuous running is probably my number 1 importance for my layout . At the moment a fiddle yard as such is not planned , hopefully the stations will hold most of the stock but more ideas are in the pipeline. Hope to start construction soon
regards Derek,
Apologies, I thought the section in the middle was a fiddle yard. My mistake.
It really does look good though and am looking forward to seeing it take place in due course.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 10, 2016, 02:48:49 pm
If I were you (which, of course, I'm not), I'd consider adding (or how to add) a fiddle yard, Derek, as it is amazing how quickly stock increases! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 10, 2016, 11:21:28 pm
 :hellosign:  Martin & Chris, I take insperation from a Japanese layout I have seen on the JNS forum, which has a large yard in the centre where the trains are held in full view in between turns. I have previously designed fiddle yards on the lowest level but seem to look over the top, even for me. I envy the Trepol Bay fiddle yard as everything just nicely fits. I may have to try again as I have a large wish list
regards Derek.























regards Derek
















 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 13, 2016, 11:06:57 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: All, I have taken on board the good advice from Chris in Prague & Port Perran   :thankyousign: gentleman. Had a think & come up with an additional station at the bottom with one track leading to a Helix down to a fiddle yard in progress.

(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

Want to try to keep it simple, still thinking about turning steamers (have 3 so far) but have lots of room to play but will try to avoid going over the top, thanks for looking
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 14, 2016, 06:35:50 am
Thanks for the latest update, Derek. I am sure that you'll be pleased to have a fiddle yard. Once you have the station locations fixed you may find that you have room for a turntable with coaling and watering facilities in a corner area?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on February 14, 2016, 10:03:06 am
Thanks for the update Derek.
Keep up the good work.
Martin
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 14, 2016, 01:22:34 pm
 :hellosign: Chris & Martin thanks for the advice & encouragement it's really appreciated. I have been thinking again  :doh: then it struck me, why does the centre board have to be a station? Why not a yard, Martin your pure genius thank you  :beers: I can then double the storage with ease. More to follow when back on PC later
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 14, 2016, 01:32:27 pm
Hi, Derek, using the centre board as a (behind-the-scenes) fiddle yard (to represent 'elsewhere') is, indeed, an excellent idea, IMHO. If you want another station how about adding a country halt or small country station, elsewhere?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 14, 2016, 07:38:49 pm
 :hellosign: Chris thanks for your suggestions I have taken it all on board & will be making changes to the track plan although using the same modules in the same order, will update as soon as time allows, again :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on February 14, 2016, 07:43:07 pm
How about a fiddle yard above the middle station ?
If you widen the baseboard a little, you should have room for 5 or 6 sidings ?
Alternatively, 5 or 6 sidings from the left loop(bottom right)  rejoining the main line at top right.  That way you could have several trains made up for circuitous running (in either direction) and run one train after another.
Just my thoughts.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 14, 2016, 07:57:33 pm
 :hellosign: &  :thankyousign: Martin I will give these suggestions consideration as soon as am back on Scarm on the PC
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 25, 2016, 09:04:38 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: I have been thinking again  :hmmm:  & here is my latest ideas for the lower section. The main feature is a port & ferry terminal on the centre section also a turntable & sidings. The helixes brings the modern line down for a long run although not (at the moment)  linked. I have included a run round loop for continues running & a small (fiddle) yard in the top corner. I like this a lot & any comments or suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 25, 2016, 09:10:07 pm
Hi Derek,

Yes, this looks very good. The harbour reminds me a bit of Padstow. It might be worth looking at a trackplan of Padstow: http://www.freetrackplans.com/images/x_Padstow_2.jpg (http://www.freetrackplans.com/images/x_Padstow_2.jpg)

You could fit in a single platform station, like Padstow, up from the ferry terminal, at the end of the straight section, I think?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 25, 2016, 10:09:29 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, thanks for the Padstow track plan, gives more food for thought.  :hmmm: My idea would see two platforms leading to the station building joined to the ferry terminal building. Hope this makes sense. I would imagine this to possibly be in a similar location to Holyhead or Heysham pre 1970 just my thoughts
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 25, 2016, 11:10:56 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: I have taken on board the good advice & think this is definite progress. I really like the curved station so this is a must, the station in the centre is now a (fiddle) yard for my EMU/DMU`s, I have added a station in the bottom for the loop which now goes via 2 helixes & the lower section to the curved station. The second main line shares the new yard but will have it`s own station on the next section, still under  :hmmm: thought. Any comments or suggestions are as always most welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 26, 2016, 09:07:46 am
Hi Derek,

Two platforms leading to the station building joined to the ferry terminal building makes sense. However, I was thinking that, alternatively, the second platform and the new construction ferry terminal building could be opposite the original single platform and old station building (like Padstow). An inspiration for the new terminal building could be:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Ferry_terminal_and_former_Quay_railway_station,_Weymouth_-_geograph.org.uk_-_1735473.jpg (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Ferry_terminal_and_former_Quay_railway_station,_Weymouth_-_geograph.org.uk_-_1735473.jpg)

Seaward side:
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59489000/jpg/_59489520_59489519.jpg (http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59489000/jpg/_59489520_59489519.jpg)

In use, with fuel tankers for the ferry and ferry:

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg)

Note Class 03 shunter in the distance.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: MrDobilina on February 26, 2016, 01:34:01 pm
Great reference pics :claphappy:

I can just imagine a car chase going on through there haha - yeah my brains weird.

Took me a while to realise the station was disused and was wondering why someone would park like that.

I like the idea of a dock side station, my friend is building a freight dockyard scene, will suggest he takes a look at this thread for some passenger options for workers to get to the docks.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 26, 2016, 11:57:04 pm
Hi Derek,

Two platforms leading to the station building joined to the ferry terminal building makes sense. However, I was thinking that, alternatively, the second platform and the new construction ferry terminal building could be opposite the original single platform and old station building (like Padstow). An inspiration for the new terminal building could be:

[url]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Ferry_terminal_and_former_Quay_railway_station,_Weymouth_-_geograph.org.uk_-_1735473.jpg[/url] ([url]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Ferry_terminal_and_former_Quay_railway_station,_Weymouth_-_geograph.org.uk_-_1735473.jpg[/url])

Seaward side:
[url]http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59489000/jpg/_59489520_59489519.jpg[/url] ([url]http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59489000/jpg/_59489520_59489519.jpg[/url])

In use, with fuel tankers for the ferry and ferry:

[url]http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg[/url] ([url]http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg)[/url]

Note Class 03 shunter in the distance.

 :hellosign: Chris, thanks for the links, Weymouth, inspiring ideas, back on Scarm on Sat or Sun
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 27, 2016, 03:28:35 pm
Once the docks and associated businesses are up and running, the "Castle Estates" top salesman, Brandon Williams, (also working, on commission, for the Alliance of West Country Breweries and "Sam's Cider" plus other North and West Cornish businesses, as a business 'hunter') will be paying a visit!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 12:28:39 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: All, my latest updated plan has tweaked the boards slightly hopefully to optimize space. The ferry port & docks are much tidier & we have a station in where the town will be. Extended the modern track by using one double helix, & return loop, I am thinking this track will be at least 100mm higher & totally separate. Much more detail to add but the basics I feel look good. As always comments, suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 03, 2016, 06:04:29 am
Looking better and better, Derek. I'd consider making the sidings at the ferry port & docks a bit longer so that they can accommodate a second passenger train and various wagons and vans, including alongside the dock edge, Conflats which can have their Containers loaded onto / unloaded off a ship alongside.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 03, 2016, 08:41:58 am
Hi,

Just to say great you're having docks and a ferry port.

I haven't really read the whole thread through as in what you want to run but agree with Chris in Prague (if this is what he meant) that the lower little siding could go along the dockside ie start at the entrance.

You could then shorten the second siding down for a shunter or whatever and put a platform after it.

Anyway, looking forward to the build.

Cheers weave.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 10:21:24 am
 :hellosign:  Chris & Weave, thanks for looking. You are both spot on, I have over simplyfide the port making the sidings too short.   :hmmm: Back to Scarm later today & move things around, the imput is most welcome  :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on March 03, 2016, 04:32:16 pm
Looking forward to ships sailing from Trepol Bay to your harbour.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: MrDobilina on March 03, 2016, 04:33:33 pm
What kind of scenics are you planning for the right hand board in the loop?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 05:04:27 pm
Looking forward to ships sailing from Trepol Bay to your harbour.
:hellosign: Martin, Thanks for the imput, sounds good to me hope it woun`t be too long. At the moment I am thinking NW England ish but this could change
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 05:14:43 pm
What kind of scenics are you planning for the right hand board in the loop?

 :hellosign: MrDobilina, thanks for looking, latest ideas are for countryside with maybe woodland to screen the storage/ fiddle yard
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 03, 2016, 06:48:09 pm
If you settle on NW England, Derek, the "Castle Estates" top salesman, Brandon Williams, (also working, outside Cornwall, on commission, for the Alliance of West Country Breweries, "Sam's Cider", and North and West Cornwall rail-served businesses as a business 'hunter') will be catching a train up there with a van of product samples attached! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 03, 2016, 09:09:27 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: I have been thinking again  :hmmm:  & here is my latest ideas for the lower section. The main feature is a port & ferry terminal on the centre section also a turntable & sidings. The helixes brings the modern line down for a long run although not (at the moment)  linked. I have included a run round loop for continues running & a small (fiddle) yard in the top corner. I like this a lot & any comments or suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking
regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

As I said earlier, I hadn't really read the thread properly and don't want to put a spanner in the works but like this design for the docks more as hadn't seen it.

Also have you decided on an era, location yet? You've said NW possibly but I'd go SW. The Weymouth or Poole or Plymouth or Falmouth to Port Regleun train ferry or just passenger ferry would be great.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Sorry, been on the Sam's cider! hic!

PS Mean it about the layout design. The ferry concept not so sure although like the Rule 1 idea of it.

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 03, 2016, 09:19:45 pm
It's absolutely your layout, Derek, but like my namesake, Chris (Weave) and Martin (Port Perran, Trepol Bay) we'd welcome a S. Cornish rail-served port for the 'through' Cornwall to Brittany service, not to mention coastal and cross-Channel shipping from Trepol Bay and Penmayne. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 10:46:29 pm
 
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: I have been thinking again  :hmmm:  & here is my latest ideas for the lower section. The main feature is a port & ferry terminal on the centre section also a turntable & sidings. The helixes brings the modern line down for a long run although not (at the moment)  linked. I have included a run round loop for continues running & a small (fiddle) yard in the top corner. I like this a lot & any comments or suggestions are more than welcome, thanks for looking
regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

As I said earlier, I hadn't really read the thread properly and don't want to put a spanner in the works but like this design for the docks more as hadn't seen it.

Also have you decided on an era, location yet? You've said NW possibly but I'd go SW. The Weymouth or Poole or Plymouth or Falmouth to Port Regleun train ferry or just passenger ferry would be great.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Sorry, been on the Sam's cider! hic!

PS Mean it about the layout design. The ferry concept not so sure although like the Rule 1 idea of it.


:hellosign: Chris (Weave), thanks for your input, I moved on to New anywhere to accomodate the extra station & double track helix, also changed the board sizes to try & simplyfy construction. Yes I also liked this plan  :beers:

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 11:01:48 pm
It's absolutely your layout, Derek, but like my namesake, Chris (Weave) and Martin (Port Perran, Trepol Bay) we'd welcome a S. Cornish rail-served port for the 'through' Cornwall to Brittany service, not to mention coastal and cross-Channel shipping from Trepol Bay and Penmayne. 8-)

 :hellosign: Chris (in Prague), I do like the real Weymouth with the street running which I have unfortunetly only seen in operation in pictures. Did visit about 15 years ago on holiday, & made the family walk the line to watch the fast ferry leave early morning. May be move this idea to Penzance area, will upload latest ideas shortly
regards Derek.








 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 03, 2016, 11:14:01 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: All, I have changed the port & added a little more detail of my ideas, I have tried to make it interesting while operationally possible. Thanks for looking & please feel free to comment
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 04, 2016, 12:03:59 am
It's absolutely your layout, Derek, but like my namesake, Chris (Weave) and Martin (Port Perran, Trepol Bay) we'd welcome a S. Cornish rail-served port for the 'through' Cornwall to Brittany service, not to mention coastal and cross-Channel shipping from Trepol Bay and Penmayne. 8-)

 :hellosign: Chris (in Prague), I do like the real Weymouth with the street running which I have unfortunetly only seen in operation in pictures. Did visit about 15 years ago on holiday, & made the family walk the line to watch the fast ferry leave early morning. May be move this idea to Penzance area, will upload latest ideas shortly
regards Derek.

Unfortunately never got to see it too but as an aside my mate borrowed a van from work in the 80's in Surrey for the weekend as he said he wanted to move some of his mother's furniture locally.

The boss agreed, he then went on a jolly with girlfriend and other mates and did similar to this (first few pics)....


https://www.flickr.com/photos/55746092@N00/galleries/72157623828177139/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/55746092@N00/galleries/72157623828177139/)

The Police couldn't move the van for ages for some reason and it was on the News. The boss asked him on the Monday if he'd used the van for anything else that weekend. After a no and being shown the morning paper (can't find pic) he was sacked.

Anyway, think we might be luring you into the West Country. Have a pasty, a few ciders and you'll be hooked.

Cheers weave  :beers:







 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 04, 2016, 12:20:13 am
 :hellosign:  :beers: Cheers Chris (weave) fantastic set of photos, thanks for sharing. I live in Hayle, (more brilliant railway history) & like a pasty now & then, & yes, have been known to drink cider :)
regards Derek.













Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 04, 2016, 08:49:49 am
Thanks, Derek for the latest version. Weymouth Quay is a very interesting prototype to model. A fictional port like Weymouth in southern Cornwall would have a variety of passenger and goods trains. Falmouth only had a local passenger service but did have a variety of goods traffic for both Cornwall and abroad with a steam saddle tank shunting loco. working into, I think, the 1970s. It also had a yellow diesel shunter. I think a Sentinel 0-4-0. https://www.flickr.com/photos/colcam/15172272839 (https://www.flickr.com/photos/colcam/15172272839)

Thanks, Chris (Weave), for the pictures link. I also walked along the tramway after the trains had ceased to regularly run so I also did not see the trains running through the streets. My late father, though, remembered driving around a corner and finding a pannier tank heading towards him with its train.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 04, 2016, 10:07:40 pm
 :hellosign: Chris (ip), sorry late in replying but that hideous work thing gets in the way.  Thanks for pic of the shunter in Falmouth docks, another interesting possibility for location in South West Cornwall. Will upload more on the plan as soon as more worth showing.
regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 04, 2016, 10:33:07 pm
No problem, Derek. I'm now very busy and will be until mid-June. The NGF is my chance to relax. I'm trying to finish off the remaining wagons and vans before I have to clear my kitchen work table. Alas, no time at all to work on Cant Cove.

A combination of Falmouth Docks and Weymouth Quay would give you the best of both: local and long-distance passenger trains and plenty of goods traffic, too: oil for the ferries,  fresh fruit and vegetable imports and exports, steel (for shipbuilding and repair; plus imports and exports), timber (imports), etc.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 04, 2016, 10:51:08 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for your ideas Chris, I had forgotten how big & busy Falmouth Docks were.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 13, 2016, 05:54:45 pm
 :hellosign: All, this week on holiday on the Isle of Wight & just spent day in Ryde. Watching the trains on the pier has me thinking of ideas for the layout. Two separate ports, one for ferry & cargo or containers at the other. A town station then street running on to a pierhead, meanwhile freight trains on separate line to avoid the town.  This idea I will have look at when we return home & back on Scarm
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 13, 2016, 07:04:07 pm
That sounds a very attractive and interesting new arrangement, Derek. I look forward to the latest revised plan. At this stage, you should not settle on a final plan until you're 100% sure that you're really happy with it. Only then should you lay track and even then be prepared to make changes before fixing everything down. There is nothing like running real model trains on track to test out operability and scenic possibilities! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on March 13, 2016, 07:06:48 pm
Sounds a good idea Derek.
Hope you managed to fit in a visit to the IOW Steam Railway.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 13, 2016, 09:05:40 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, I have lots of ideas for the final track plan, as soon as shed is built I will have to get serious & choose. So far the port is set in stone & I really like the curved station on the next section. Fingers crossed the shed should be up for summer. Thank you for your imput, 
regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 13, 2016, 09:20:55 pm
 :hellosign: Martin, we have all week but unfortunately the Steam Railway is only operating on one day this week, so not guaranteed, hopefully so. Will be back on Scarm next weekend so hope to formulate my latest ideas then
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 22, 2016, 12:54:54 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign:  Everybody, home again & the layout gets another update which I think is a big improvement. Most important, the main central board is wider so we have town, tramway, helix & goods avoiding line without going overboard on track. The port goes back as previous, except we now have station on pier, inspired by Ryde. The all important continues loop remains, but with a bridge instead of at grade crossing. The other main board is now two storage yards.
Not shown is the modern line witch will be at least 200mm above but still round the walls from & back to the helix. As always comments are more than welcome & thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 22, 2016, 07:55:16 am
Hi,

Really looking forward to the pier station build. I live in Hampshire now but haven't been to the IOW for a long time. I must go again soon.

Used to go as a young teenager from Surrey and loved the trains on the pier. It was the only thing that kept me going from Ryde beach to the Pompey ferry as my dad always made us walk (said it was good exercise but in hindsight think he'd spent too much money on ice creams  :D).
 
Plan looks great to me.

Cheers weave
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Greybeema on March 22, 2016, 08:05:39 am
I want to see this develop too.  As a boy we used to holiday in IOW.  Train to Brighton, change for Portsmouth Harbour then ferry (or in later years side wall hovercraft) over to Ryde.  Bus or taxi to Guesthouse. 

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 22, 2016, 03:14:40 pm
 :hellosign: Weave & Greybeena, thanks for looking, we also love the IOW, although always taken the car ferry from Southampton.                                    I hope to create a pier station not too dissimilar to Ryde but am not aiming to make a copy. If all goes to plan should start construction early summer

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 22, 2016, 06:49:45 pm
Good evening Derek,

Thanks for the latest update. I also remember holidays in the Isle of Wight in the 1960s and Ryde Pier, the trains and the ferries.

I think this latest version combining elements of Weymouth and Ryde should look very good and have plenty of interesting operating possibilities.

I look forward to seeing it develop over the Summer (when I hope to get back to work on Cant Cove).

When you're ready to start receiving 'through' services, some Cornish wagons and vans, including "Castle Estates" will, I'm sure, be on their way. 8-) When you have decided where your port is located, maybe, the ferries will go to Britanny? In which case, through passenger train will travel from North and West Cornwall and the "Chelsea Girls" will come, there, too. 8-)

Best regards,
Chris
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 22, 2016, 08:10:25 pm
 :hellosign: thanks for looking Chris, I think this could be the plan to go. Looking forward to possible through workings from North Cornwall & further afield.
    Considering possibly a train ferry to add interest but like the plan at present, so many ideas. If all goes to plan will start construction early summer
regards Derek.





























i
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 22, 2016, 08:44:39 pm
Thanks, Derek. A train ferry as well might be too much unless it is at the end of the pier?! Goods and containers can be shipped as well as foot passengers into a conventional ferry at the harbourside.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 22, 2016, 09:29:42 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, thanks for your imput, will think again as don`t want to overdo track & latest plan looks good
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 29, 2016, 07:09:28 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign:   Have a had a re-think about the port & the result is above. Keeping all the main features but moving things around makes room for the train ferry, without I think overdoing track. The return loop for continuous running will be hidden under the bay. Thanks for looking & as always comments & suggestions are always welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 29, 2016, 07:34:55 pm
Many thanks, Derek. Th latest version incorporates the best features from the previous one whilst simplifying the various elements.

I would add a passing loop on the single-track train ferry line near the end so that unloaded wagons can be off-loaded and placed out of the way of those being loaded. The land end of the loop could be extended into a dead-end siding for 'damaged' vehicles requiring attention before onward travel and / or use of the train ferry pilot loco. where its crew could have a mess hut with a bench outside so that they could watch the port whilst enjoying their tea and sandwiches.

I presume that the Container Transhipment area is for ISO containers for modern container ships?

Having the return loop hidden under the bay is an excellent idea but I would not bring its far end up out of the sea (I'm sure I'm badly mis-reading the map) and onto the pier but hide its emergence behind some low relief building at the back from where it could join the tramway at an angle?

After leaving the station and before it reaches the river, the tramway could have a siding serving some industrial premises in the town for added operating interest?

I'm not sure what the grey oblong is across the river at the end of the goods yard?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 29, 2016, 08:14:26 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign:   Have a had a re-think about the port & the result is above. Keeping all the main features but moving things around makes room for the train ferry, without I think overdoing track. The return loop for continuous running will be hidden under the bay. Thanks for looking & as always comments & suggestions are always welcome
regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

Looks great to me. Much better than my ideas  :(.

I know Chris has mentioned a passing loop which is fine but if you're actually having a train ferry which is double track think you need to put the point on the approach further to the right as you'll need two locos to pull the wagons, coaches out at the same time so it doesn't tip over, so length of the ferry.

Has been mentioned before and might not always be the case but just saying. Really looking forward to the build and giving me inspiration to do something better.

Thanks weave  :beers:


Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on March 29, 2016, 08:20:25 pm
Good 'point', Chris (Weave). I'd forgotten that, the goods passing loop on the pier needs to be extended into a twin line which will connect with the train ferry's hold tracks. Then loading and unloading can be done, in parallel, as Chris (Weave) points out. The goods loop can also be used for four-wheel LWB rail fuel tankers to supply the storage tanks used to refuel the ferries. (There was a similar arrangement at Weymouth Harbour.)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: MrDobilina on March 29, 2016, 09:06:44 pm
Looking great! My only concern is a tunnel underneath paintwork. With motors for the point it might cause issues if you need to replace the motor or height wise for enough space for the tunnel underneath.

Please feel free to disregard if you've got other plans I just thought it might cause an issue or two :)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on March 30, 2016, 12:16:44 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign:   Have a had a re-think about the port & the result is above. Keeping all the main features but moving things around makes room for the train ferry, without I think overdoing track. The return loop for continuous running will be hidden under the bay. Thanks for looking & as always comments & suggestions are always welcome
regards Derek.

Hi again,

Wasn't reading it properly as usual and also didn't see the 'hidden under the bay' bit on the map. I presume the grey bit is a bridge or causeway so thought it would look better if the 'hidden under' went up and over if you've got enough length for the incline or with maybe a swing bridge and causeway either side or something like that.

Just a thought.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on March 31, 2016, 12:01:11 am
 :hellosign:  & good evening, many thanks for the imput & the interest. Thanks for pointing out the return loop issue in the middle of the bay, not my best idea so will look at that again- continuous running is important but not impossible to live without. Chris (iP), the plan is for this section of the layout to be totally pre 1970ish so I think the containers were craned direct on to ships, please correct if I am wrong, also thanks Chris (Weave), the grey oblong is a bridge. 
  MrDobilina I plan to be using almost exclusively Kato track & points so point motor issue should not be a problem.
  Also agree the line to the train ferry needs to be doubled to allow engines to run round. Have been watching You Tube videos of the Messina ferry in Italy & this shows just one engine re-coupling the train by shunting the sections directly off the ferry deck, have I missed something ?. My idea is the train enters the line to the ferry, is un-coupled & runs in the siding, then a shunter pushes the coaches in. The engine reverses back to the siding (not yet on plan), to await the next arrival. Again thanks for looking
regards Derek.















































 
 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 01, 2016, 09:24:40 am
Hi Derek,

Think all train ferries are different with the tidal height difference being the main concern. A lot have the points on the ferry, hence the single track approach in Sicily. However, I think they can do that as the ferry has 4 tracks and it's a passenger train.

When I went on it, it was shunted on into one of the middle 2 tracks, 4 coaches removed, reversed out, back in, other middle side, then outside left, then right, you get the jist so reasonably stable. Also think the shunter had another coach with it which stayed on land. Might be wrong, twas a long time ago.

As mine is 2 tracks it's makes sense to have the points on land and for the French layout it'll be mainly freight so heavier and that's where the double pull out thing came from. Think that's what they're doing at Dover.....

http://www.phantasrail.co.uk/HH/Phantasrail%20HH213v.jpg (http://www.phantasrail.co.uk/HH/Phantasrail%20HH213v.jpg)

Not sure what you're doing ferry wise but hope some of that helps.

By the way, I've sort of been cursing you (no offence) with your design ideas as now want to put my town up on the hill and have more port space but then where does the cider farm and the fishing village and the beach and whatever else  goes through my mind go. So little time, so little space  :(

Cheers weave  :beers:



Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 02, 2016, 12:13:59 am
Hi Derek,

Think all train ferries are different with the tidal height difference being the main concern. A lot have the points on the ferry, hence the single track approach in Sicily. However, I think they can do that as the ferry has 4 tracks and it's a passenger train.

When I went on it, it was shunted on into one of the middle 2 tracks, 4 coaches removed, reversed out, back in, other middle side, then outside left, then right, you get the jist so reasonably stable. Also think the shunter had another coach with it which stayed on land. Might be wrong, twas a long time ago.

As mine is 2 tracks it's makes sense to have the points on land and for the French layout it'll be mainly freight so heavier and that's where the double pull out thing came from. Think that's what they're doing at Dover.....

[url]http://www.phantasrail.co.uk/HH/Phantasrail%20HH213v.jpg[/url] ([url]http://www.phantasrail.co.uk/HH/Phantasrail%20HH213v.jpg[/url])

Not sure what you're doing ferry wise but hope some of that helps.

By the way, I've sort of been cursing you (no offence) with your design ideas as now want to put my town up on the hill and have more port space but then where does the cider farm and the fishing village and the beach and whatever else  goes through my mind go. So little time, so little space  :(

Cheers weave  :beers:






 :hellosign: Thanks for the explanation & photo Chris, the video I saw had the points on the ferry- a real challenge to model in N, like your layout two tracks & points on land seems the way to go.
    Space my friend is something we all could do with more of & not cursing you for the idea of the train ferry  :thankyousign:

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 10, 2016, 10:14:08 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: Good morning all, have taken on board all the latest good advice & have updated the plan. There is now double track to Train ferry, although not sure about the curve & crossover. The continues return loop is now an extension from the centre track of the town station & over the turntable on to a bridge to the non-scenic fiddle yard section (in green). The silver track on the outside is the very top of the modern return loop, with a helix under the Town station. This latest idea places the port back on the top of the grand master plan. Thanks for looking & as always suggestions/ comments welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 10, 2016, 11:44:32 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: Good morning all, have taken on board all the latest good advice & have updated the plan. There is now double track to Train ferry, although not sure about the curve & crossover. The continues return loop is now an extension from the centre track of the town station & over the turntable on to a bridge to the non-scenic fiddle yard section (in green). The silver track on the outside is the very top of the modern return loop, with a helix under the Town station. This latest idea places the port back on the top of the grand master plan. Thanks for looking & as always suggestions/ comments welcome
regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

What I meant was have the lower point halfway along from the right of the train ferry, as long as the ferry load, so you could have a double pull before the point. Basically, just elongate the bottom track along to the right and have that point wherever it can take the ferry load. Hope that makes sense.

Hope helps weave.



Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 10, 2016, 12:21:24 pm
 :hellosign: Chris many thanks for your imput, I think this is better?

(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

  regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on April 10, 2016, 12:30:56 pm
Looking very good now Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 10, 2016, 12:46:09 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for looking Martin, yes like this myself, this could be the one
 :thumbsup:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Kris on April 10, 2016, 01:36:13 pm
The route through the turntable is strange and not something that you would find on the prototype.
I would be very wary of it in model form as it is more likely to cause derailments.

You will need to put some electrickery in place to deal with the return loop that you have created.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 10, 2016, 02:09:51 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for the imput Kris, agree strange idea to run through the turntable,  :thankyousign:

 Possibly not my best idea, will look again
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 10, 2016, 10:11:21 pm
Hi Derek,

Train ferry approach looks much better. With regard to the turntable thing, could you just have the lowest track solely going over the bridge and raise the turntable on the plan slightly with curves from the other tracks to go next to the tramline.

Just a thought.

Please get started soon as sometimes more excited about your build than mine  :)

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 10, 2016, 11:42:07 pm
 :hellosign: & thanks for your interest Chris, the turntable will be moved as soon as back on Scarm (on tablet now). The idea of putting the turntable at rear of station to turn locos & not locking them in looked good. Will move things around but not too much.
   Hoping to start construction in early summer I too can't wait
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 14, 2016, 12:06:22 am
 :hellosign: All, more excellent advice sees the plan change, the turntable curves slightly to allow access to the return loop. A new siding for a shunter & new run round for diesel locos, all advice or comments welcome & thanks for looking(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 17, 2016, 06:49:16 pm
I really think that this latest version is the one, Derek. Plenty of operating interest and scenic possibilities without over-complicated track or unrealistic arrangements. It was well worth all the iterations to get it 'right'. That said, I would lay out all the track once you have the baseboards ready and run a few trains to see how everything works and looks before fixing anything permanently in place. The only thing I can think of is adding a very small goods yard to the left of the Town station with a couple of sidings for coal wagons and vans with miscellaneous goods but that would depend on the period being modelled. With ISO Containers (late 1960s) such a small goods yard would have been lifted leaving just the short siding, as shown, for the station pilot to stable in out of the way. But the lifted, abandoned , overgrown tracks would make  a nice scenic feature.

Now, to decide where it is located and a suitable name? 8-) It could be WR or SR and anywhere in SW England, I think. (Of course my preference would be S. Cornwall. 8-) ) It has strong elements from Weymouth, of course, but that was GWR, BR WR, then BR SR, which gives a nice mix of possible steam and diesel era trains. Weymouth saw both types into the late 1960s.

As Chris (Weave) wrote, I look forward very much to seeing this develop. Your first diesel loco. should be a Clas 03 or 04 for the tramway! 8-) (And, maybe a 57XX 0-6-0PT for earlier?)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 17, 2016, 10:31:35 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, thanks for your interest & encouragement, lots of final decisions to be made although S W Cornwall is favourite for location & the era around mid to late sixties. My current stock is mostly modern, for the lower parts of the plan, which i am finalising. My wish-list is long & varied but includes Westerns, Hymeck, class 47,31,25 etc. All will. be revealed presently
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Webbo on April 18, 2016, 01:16:10 am
Hello Derek and others

I've had a read through this thread and it is a nice example of layout design evolution. I particularly like the station/town/ferry terminal areas - should look very good when in operation. Excuse me if the following suggestion has already been discussed and rejected, but I wondering about the arrangement of the sidings in the fiddle yard. In particular if the sidings on the left side of the non-scenic area fanned off the sidings on the right hand side, then they could be made a bit longer. Also, a reverse loop track could be easily installed in this area by running a line from the end of the siding branch on the right hand side to the track on the other side. Having a reversing loop would eliminate the need for the turntable.

Just a couple of thoughts.
Webbo
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 18, 2016, 07:34:48 am
Thanks, Derek. I guess the turntable is for turning steam locos. and is also a scenic feature?

If you decide to place the layout in SW Cornwall then quite a few of us who model railways in Cornwall and the SW would be pleased to run "through" trains there. 8-) (I will have a rake of "Castle Estates" goods stock, including two types of Ferry Wagon, ready, this summer, and wagons and vans in various PO liveries from North and West Cornwall can also be arranged. The "Chelsea Girls" can also visit on their way to / from Britanny. 8-)

Regarding locos. if it is located in SW Cornwall, BR SR can have inherited running rights from Wadebridge-Newquay-Truro over BR WR and on to your port. If your period is the late 1960s all of the following copuld be run: diesel Classes 03, 04, 14 ('Rule One', but one is in North Cornwall and one in West Cornwall), 22, 33, 35 "Hymek", 42 "Warship", 47, and 52 "Western". Class 121 and Class 122 diesel railcars plus, using 'Rule One', ex-GWR ones (again, one is in North Cornwall (Cant Cove & Penmayne) -- with two more to come, plus a parcels railcar -- and one in West Cornwall, Port Perran). Class 25s and 31s would be a posibility, later, as they replaced the Class 22s and 35s. However, they could also appear on inter-Regional specials, particularly on Summer Saturdays. SR BR Standard 4MT 2-6-4Ts (less likely), SR BR Standard 5MT 4-6-0s and Bulleid Light Pacifics could also run up to the end of SR steam on 9th July 1967. BR WR Steam finished in the Southwest in the early 1960s (steam traction finishing on WR in September 1964) so, unless preserved no GWR steam locos. in th emid- to late 1960s. That said, GWR 4079, 4555, 7029, and 7808 all ran on BR WR in preserved GWR livery around the mid-1960s. So, plenty of choice for locos. Regarding carriages, BR Maroon and BR Blue and Grey would be the most likely liveries plus some BR SR Green and a few surviving BR WR Chocolate & Cream coaches, too. Diesel railcars and locomotives would be, mainly, in BR Green but some in BR Blue.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on April 18, 2016, 09:22:50 am
 :hellosign:  Just a quick question.  What trains will be using the line that runs over the bridge at the bottom right corner (the lift up / lift out section by the rooms doorway)?  I only ask as it is only appears accessible from the stations through line making it impossible for any passenger trains to call at the station.  :hmmm:
Apologies if I have missed something earlier in the thread.
John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 18, 2016, 11:21:30 pm
:hellosign:  Just a quick question.  What trains will be using the line that runs over the bridge at the bottom right corner (the lift up / lift out section by the rooms doorway)?  I only ask as it is only appears accessible from the stations through line making it impossible for any passenger trains to call at the station.  :hmmm:
Apologies if I have missed something earlier in the thread.
John

 :hellosign: 25901jfm thanks for looking, the second line over the doorway bridge is the continuous loop for my modern stock, the plan is for a helix under the town station. All will hopefully be revealed presently
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 19, 2016, 12:16:06 am
 :hellosign: Webbo your imput is gratefully received, the turntable is for operational interest, the continuous loop joins the yard return loop from the bridge over the doorway. Have tried to keep the yard simple but useful
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 19, 2016, 12:25:36 am
 :hellosign: Chris in P, again a big thanks for the wealth of information it is all greatly appreciated. In your opinion is the turntable wrong or wrongly placed, starting to re-think this now :hmmm:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 19, 2016, 06:52:57 am
:hellosign: All, more excellent advice sees the plan change, the turntable curves slightly to allow access to the return loop. A new siding for a shunter & new run round for diesel locos, all advice or comments welcome & thanks for looking(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

Hope you don't mind but just quoting you to put your plan on the same new page as other's comments to save me going back each time to see what they mean. There's probably an easier way of doing that but I seem to like doing everything the hard way.

Cheers weave.



Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 19, 2016, 09:05:58 am
:hellosign: Chris in P, again a big thanks for the wealth of information it is all greatly appreciated. In your opinion is the turntable wrong or wrongly placed, starting to re-think this now :hmmm:
regards Derek.

Hi Derek,

It's my pleasure. I'd love to have a layout as extensive as yours with a tramway and dockside lines. I think the turntable is fine where it is for turning around arriving steam locos. on trains which either terminate there or have the mainline loco. replaced by a shunter to take the train along the tramway. I would though, as has been mentioned, add a set of points (about where the road overbridge is) to the through line to the tramway to link it to the adjacent terminating line so that a train, e.g. goods, arriving on the centre track can easily have its mainline loco. released and a shunter substituted. For the line going into the turntable, if this area will include coal and watering facilities (which would make sense), there should be a separate siding off it the length of your longest steam loco. plus a bit more and a a bufferstop. This coaling and watering siding could be parallel to the through tramway line. If there is enough room add enough track to this siding for an old wooden bodied 7-plank wagon half-full of locomotive ash from cleaned out fireboxes. (SR steam locosheds seem to often have this feature.) With a link added between the through line and the stabling sidings (before the bridge over the entrance) a loco. coming off the turnrtable only has to run through the station then through the points outside the station to get back to the stabling sidings. The light engine movements will add to the operating interest and are another good reason for the through line's existence, apart from goods trains.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 19, 2016, 10:42:56 pm
 :hellosign: Chris (Weave), of course no problem pleased you enjoy looking

 :hellosign: Chris (IP), thanks for your imput , am working silly shifts this week but before the weekend be back on Scarm  & have serious look at your thoughts. Would mainline locos not run down the tramway? am thinking of photos of Weymouth

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 20, 2016, 06:28:51 am
:hellosign: Chris (Weave), of course no problem pleased you enjoy looking

 :hellosign: Chris (IP), thanks for your imput , am working silly shifts this week but before the weekend be back on Scarm  & have serious look at your thoughts. Would mainline locos not run down the tramway? am thinking of photos of Weymouth

regards Derek.


Hi Derek,

With regard to the tramway locos I presume Chris (IP) is talking about steam locos. I've had a look, as I'm sure you have too, but can only find steam shunter photos of Weymouth, one example....

http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-GC4.jpg (http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-GC4.jpg)

I don't know the steam/diesel crossover dates in Grande Bretagne but presume large steam mainline locos couldn't cope with the tramway, hence the shunter, but the smaller mainline diesels later could.

Might be talking rubbish (everyone in the pub says I do  :)) but good excuse for a photo.

Cheers weave
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 20, 2016, 10:11:33 am
Hi Derek, Chris, I have a book, "The Weymouth Tramway", John Lucking (1986), OPC, bought in W.H. Smith's, in Weymouth, back in 1988. In steam days, only GWR tank (0-4-0, 0-4-2, 0-6-0), saddle (0-6-0, in BR days, 1361) then pannier tanks (0-6-0, 1366 and 74XX classes; later also 57XX, 8750 classes), then the pannier tanks replacements, SR Ivatt 2-6-2Ts, were allowed on the Tramway. In BR days, ex-GWR pannier tanks and SR Ivatt 2-6-2Ts were replaced by what became BR Class 04 and, later, 03 diesel-mechanical shunters, although SR Class 11 152XX diesel-electric shunters were used, too, (being air-braked, until dual-brake-fitted Class 03s returned) but not BR Class 08s. Later (1980s), in BR days, Class 33s were passed for the Tramway (after a some track upgrading) and replaced the Class 03s. Class 73 Electro-Diesels were also used. I think Class 31s may also have worked over the Tramway, too? But certainly nothing larger, like Class 42, 47s, and 52s. Nor Class 35s. BR and SR DMUs certainly did, though. From an operational point of view, it's more interesting to replace the mainline loco. in the station with a shunter, steam or diesel. Larger steam and diesel locos. would have to be replaced anyway.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 20, 2016, 11:49:24 pm
 :hellosign:  Chris (Weave) , nice photo, thanks for sharing  :thumbsup:

 :hellosign: Chris (in Prague) very useful Information  :thankyousign: once again, this clarifies a point I never considered. I feel a station expansion could be on the cards
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 21, 2016, 06:22:57 am
:hellosign:  Chris (Weave) , nice photo, thanks for sharing  :thumbsup:

 :hellosign: Chris (in Prague) very useful Information  :thankyousign: once again, this clarifies a point I never considered. I feel a station expansion could be on the cards
regards Derek.

I think with the addition of a pair of points and a coaling and watering siding (as I have suggested) the station layout should be fine, Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 22, 2016, 10:29:24 am
 :hellosign: & good morning, following more sound advice, & a bit :hmmm: time this is my latest idea
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

  some slight changes to help make better use of the turntable, looking better maybe cramped in the corner but should all work.

To give an idea of my master plan & long term aim here is the plan for the next level down
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

still lots of detail to fill in but like the centre station & continuous loop round helix & up to top level.  As always comments & suggestions are more than welcome, & thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: MrDobilina on April 22, 2016, 10:52:56 am
This makes me want to be able to do a tour visiting people with amazing/huge layouts.

Looks great! Have you made a watery area before?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 22, 2016, 11:38:01 am
Thank you, Derek, for the latest update. The turntable area looks much better. Timetables could be located in quite cramped areas in towns where land was expensive to purchase, so it looks fine. You now have a coaling and watering siding and an alternative route to / from the turntable which is good practice (in case one line gets blocked the locos. are not trapped) plus some sidings, to stable locos. and / or some loco. coal trucks, which are always useful. However, they do cross a side road (or will the road be on an overbridge?). It looks like you may have to move part of the main road down a bit to allow the side road which joins the harbour tramway to have a not too steep incline down from the road junction.

I'd also, as in Weymouth, continue the road along the harbourside at least to the edge of the orange area to give access to the harbourside businesses and pubs.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on April 22, 2016, 12:01:32 pm
Hi Derek,

Looks fantastic and still can't get my head round the complexity of it all.

So thought I'd keep it simple and ask, hope hasn't been before, are you going to change the name of the layout at all? Also, is your train ferry coming my way? Confused.com.

I often don't have access to the computer so when waiting for layout stuff to stick, I like to plan for proper timetables, maps, places etc. for when we all get going.

Hope makes sense.

Cheers weave.

PS Buy some wood and get going!  :D







Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 22, 2016, 01:33:46 pm
 :hellosign: MrDobilina, thanks for looking, I have always been interested in railways & now with less family commitments I have more time. This will be my first go at a proper layout, water as everything else hopefully be no problem

 :hellosign: Chris (iP) , thanks again for your imput, all the roads are on over-bridges where crossing the track, the start of the tramway & road meeting is short because of the bridge over the river.  :hmmm: Could move river as the easiest option, will look again

 :hellosign:  Thanks for your encouragement Chris (Weave). I have tried to plan so as to run trains while building work progress`s & keep things simple  to operate. Interestingly nobody has questioned about the name, the idea for Any upon Ware is my love of trains worldwide & this is reflected in my present collection. I will be looking to operate Trainferry services to Brittany sourced from N. Cornwall & beyond & look forward to planning timetables maps etc with you & the other participating forum members
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: MrDobilina on April 22, 2016, 01:56:30 pm
With regards the water, I'd strongly suggest giving it a go first. I had a little go recently on a little test track Id been playing around with (straight line with scenics). Most of the stuff for the water seeped through a crack in the wood I had forgotten to seal up first. Second attempt dried bright white meaning I just threw it out (after retrieving what I could from the other parts).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 22, 2016, 02:21:53 pm
 :hellosign:  :thankyousign: MrDobilina, your words of caution will be well heeded, hope in future you have better luck, I have seen your thread & nice scenics taking shape
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 23, 2016, 10:19:17 am
 :hellosign:  & good morning everybody, I`ve been doing some serious  :hmmm: again (dangerous I know) & here is the result
  Sorry for some reason can`t upload right now so try later. Explanation, the main change is the container port & goods yard now have transformed into a Fish processing factory, of course rail served. The goods lines move more into the centre of the board to allow space.
  The river/ canal is now shorter to allow road longer ramp down to meet the tramway, the roads have slight new alignments but nothing major. It is decided the road/ tramway will have shops/ cafes on one side with the river fenced close on the other side.  :hmmm: maybe a wall like York behind the river & then bridges over the tramway at the ends. At the top the tramway & road part on a level junction, & finally the town is off scene behind the shops. Will try to upload plan as I am that would make it all clear, as always thanks for looking & any comments or suggestions more than welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 23, 2016, 02:32:46 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

AAH at last managed to upload, hope this makes sense now
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 10:56:26 am
Good morning Derek, thanks for the latest posts. Here are my thoughts (for what they're worth): moving the goods lines move more into the centre of the board to allow space to move around makes perfect sense. The Fish Processing Factory looks very large. I would reduce its length (by about 30-40%) and its width (so that it does not reach right to the water's edge) and restore at least one more general goods siding, not least to add to operating interest. I would also delete the R/H building to avoid making the area look too crowded. (Maybe, add a third, slightly shorter siding instead?) Fish traffic was already in steep decline after WW2

Padstow's former Fish Shed can be seen to the right of this picture:

http://www.northcornwallrailway.co.uk/pics/padstow-station-6.jpg (http://www.northcornwallrailway.co.uk/pics/padstow-station-6.jpg)

Moving the river and making it shorter to allow a longer road ramp down to meet the tramway makes excellent sense. As, unlike at York, there would unlikely to be flooding there would be no need for a wall along the harbour area but, where the line dips under the overbridge, yes:

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_05_2013/post-6669-0-98971500-1369216902.jpg (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_05_2013/post-6669-0-98971500-1369216902.jpg)

http://www.nwrail.org.uk/kr080612-tramway-weymouth.jpg (http://www.nwrail.org.uk/kr080612-tramway-weymouth.jpg)

For one of your planned overbridges:

http://www.rail.co.uk/images/7415/original/6-weymouth-Quay-line-by-Phil-Marsh.jpg (http://www.rail.co.uk/images/7415/original/6-weymouth-Quay-line-by-Phil-Marsh.jpg)

http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/02/95/56/2955630_3a080f22.jpg (http://s0.geograph.org.uk/geophotos/02/95/56/2955630_3a080f22.jpg)

Other side:

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zQnErNKZKTE/U4yHZ2PFjtI/AAAAAAAAGkA/9t-_1XqQUCQ/s1600/2.jpg (https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zQnErNKZKTE/U4yHZ2PFjtI/AAAAAAAAGkA/9t-_1XqQUCQ/s1600/2.jpg)

What I would aim for, all along the right-hand side of the tramway / road area in the top R/H corner, is a model scene like these:

http://www.davidheyscollection.com/USERIMAGES/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-C105.jpg (http://www.davidheyscollection.com/USERIMAGES/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-C105.jpg)

In late steam days:

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(geraldtrobinson3.7.1966)quay_old16.jpg (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(geraldtrobinson3.7.1966)quay_old16.jpg)

wey3.freepages.nostalgia.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cyberheritage/jpg

Interestingly, there seem to be BR SR Green Mark 1s behind the Engineer's Grey Class 33:

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/x6XEVvVRB_4/hqdefault.jpg (https://i.ytimg.com/vi/x6XEVvVRB_4/hqdefault.jpg)

As mentioned in a previous post, I would also extend the road at the top from the junction to the orange area to give, as at Weymouth, road vehicles access to the area, too.

As here:

https://farm4.static.flickr.com/3326/3555903659_0c93ef2183.jpg (https://farm4.static.flickr.com/3326/3555903659_0c93ef2183.jpg)

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5133/5577615312_f657f1bb8c_b.jpg (https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5133/5577615312_f657f1bb8c_b.jpg)

https://farm6.static.flickr.com/5302/5577035697_294598685 (https://farm6.static.flickr.com/5302/5577035697_294598685)

Martin, (Port Perran, Trepol Bay) describes how he achieved his water effect at Trepol Bay Harbour with different colours of paint overlaid with layers of yacht varnish and that works very well, I think, and avoids the problem of leaking 'water'. I will follow Martin's technique when I finish the water areas at Cant Cove.

Like Chris (Weave), I will be very happy to see trainferry services to Brittany sourced from North and West Cornwall and beyond, and look forward to planning timetables, maps, etc. with you and the other participating forum members in the early summer. I also plan to send you, about that time, some train ferry wagons plus a selection of Cornish PO wagons and vans, too. (Maybe, also, a set of the "Chelsea Girls" as ferry passengers.)

As well as Class 73s (and 33s):

http://table158photography.weebly.com/uploads/8/2/1/2/8212554/dpp_2839.jpg (http://table158photography.weebly.com/uploads/8/2/1/2/8212554/dpp_2839.jpg)

You can now add Class 37s to the list of diesels which worked over the Weymouth Tramway:

http://table158photography.weebly.com/uploads/8/2/1/2/8212554/dpp_2837.jpg (http://table158photography.weebly.com/uploads/8/2/1/2/8212554/dpp_2837.jpg)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8165/7698433362_edc18aeb86_b.jpg (https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8165/7698433362_edc18aeb86_b.jpg)

I think this will be a very attactive layout to look at and very interesting to operate, too.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 24, 2016, 12:46:45 pm
 :hellosign:  Thank you Chris for your thoughts, ideas & the superb photos. Your imput is very much appreciated. The idea behind the fish factory is I want a production factory in the town so being by the sea fish seemed logical & unloading from the dock side also made sense. It is a large building- the right hand smaller one for loading of local distribution by road.
   The wall is not for flood protection but old fortifications that are now a popular walkway, as in York- sorry no photos, a lot of my ideas come from memory- the bridges are very similar to my ideas. Most definitely stone & square with a road or a least a footpath going over. Like the idea of backs of shops for the top corner but bit tight for road in that area,  :idea: could have road bridge over tramway with swing bridge over river for car access about midway.
   Will be starting research for scenic ideas shortly & yes agree Martins water does look really good.
   Have always thought the 37 looks how a big powerful loco should & now the 73 is growing on me too, thanks for all the photos.
   Will be on Scarm soon
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 01:11:19 pm
My great pleasure, Derek. York is one of my favourite cities having spent quite a few very enjoyable weekends there. The original railway station penetrated the old city walls and, instead of one bridge, it might be possible to incorporate the tramway going through the city walls as at York:

http://yorkwalls.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Mystery14.jpg (http://yorkwalls.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Mystery14.jpg)

http://www.lostrailwayswestyorkshire.co.uk/images/misc/York/DSCN0065.jpg (http://www.lostrailwayswestyorkshire.co.uk/images/misc/York/DSCN0065.jpg)

And also have a lower, shorter section of walls with walkway. Here is York:

http://oi54.tinypic.com/uvr75.jpg (http://oi54.tinypic.com/uvr75.jpg)

Low relief buildings will help you in the top corner.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 24, 2016, 02:30:53 pm
 :hellosign: Yes thank you again Chris, spent many enjoyable days out in York- lived only 20-25 miles away for many years in Leeds then Selby.
   I feel the whole board needs a re-think to incorporate the latest ideas, the only thing definitely going is the fish factory- you are right- far too large  :thumbsup:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 03:00:33 pm
Hi Derek, I wouldn't agree that the whole board needs a rethink as many of the elements have been carefully considered and refined by you over various versions. If you were to have, instead of the fish factory, a dockside area a bit like at Padstow, you could still have a fish shed and a couple of goods sidings which, as with Padstow, could also be used for stabling coaches.

I would only include the two parallel (to the Fish Shed) quayside sidings in the diagram below:

http://www.freetrackplans.com/images/x_Padstow_2.jpg (http://www.freetrackplans.com/images/x_Padstow_2.jpg)

So, something like this but I would connect the two sidings at the far end to allow a loco. to run around its train. The dockside line could be used for timber imports, for example.

(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t449/chrisinprague/RLY%20-%20MODEL%20-%20Padstow%20Quay%20Sidings_zpsdkx8xiws.jpg) (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/chrisinprague/media/RLY%20-%20MODEL%20-%20Padstow%20Quay%20Sidings_zpsdkx8xiws.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on April 24, 2016, 03:04:30 pm
I agree that a simple fish shed alongside a harbour area would look very good indeed.
Chris' suggestion is simple - and seems sensible to me.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 03:05:05 pm
I found this very useful:

http://hoexbroe.tripod.com/train/id36.html (http://hoexbroe.tripod.com/train/id36.html)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 03:12:58 pm
If you imagine you're looking down from the end of the quay the two sidings and fish shed would look a bit like this:

(http://i1060.photobucket.com/albums/t449/chrisinprague/RLY%20-%20Padsow%20-%20Fish%20Shed%20with%202%20sidings_zps9wbvf2ew.jpg) (http://s1060.photobucket.com/user/chrisinprague/media/RLY%20-%20Padsow%20-%20Fish%20Shed%20with%202%20sidings_zps9wbvf2ew.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 24, 2016, 03:31:52 pm
There are some great tips for a Cornish quayside line plus building and sea tips if you look for: camel-quay-a-north-cornwall-inspired-layout-in-4mm/
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 24, 2016, 06:13:52 pm
 :hellosign: Thank you again for your imput Chris, I really do try to keep things simple, just get carried away when I have a  :idea: moment.

 :hellosign: Thanks for looking Martin, I agree simple is very sensible.

  Looking at latest ideas will share when happy- but the Fish Factory has to go
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 25, 2016, 12:10:27 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)
 :hellosign: Everybody a bit late tonight but after much good advice & :hmmm: an updated plan. No major changes, most important we go back to sensible goods yard & have the through continuous running loop having its own platform at the town station. The turntable goes back behind the station with sidings for coal & water, also the Train & Passenger Ferries swap around so the pier goes straight out to sea. Comments or suggestions are always welcome & thanks for looking
regards Derek.


Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on April 25, 2016, 06:42:58 am
Good morning, Derek, thanks for the latest update. I agree this looks much better and simpler. If you decide to add a third goods yard siding you have plenty of room left to do so. Or you can even show the remains of a lifted third siding if modelling in the late 1960s period. You might want to ease the curve just after the line to the goods yard leaves the mainline, by the end of the station platform, by moving the line slightly closer to the dockside.

You might want to extend the sea slightly more to the right between the train ferry and passenger ferry piers and extend the inlet of the sea opposite the goods yard so that it meets the top R/H end of the operating well, which will open up more photographic possibilities (towards the top R/H) as there will be fewer buildings (orange area) which also means less work building them. It might, if you want, also be possible to have a long, narrow beach area across the inlet opposite the goods yard? (It could be reached by a path from the road in the top R/H corner.

Some nice N Scale beach huts:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/n-gauge-beach-huts-train-set-layout-n-scale-x6-beach-huts/282015422279? (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/n-gauge-beach-huts-train-set-layout-n-scale-x6-beach-huts/282015422279?)

Weymouth beach with Victorian clock tower:
http://jurassicaccommodation.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Weymouth-tourism.jpg (http://jurassicaccommodation.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Weymouth-tourism.jpg)

You might want to leave out the buildings beyond the beach though which would block the view of trains on the train ferry lines. Maybe have sand dunes and pine trees at the back of the beach instead or raised ground with low granite cliffs between the back of the beach and the train ferry lines with a park with benches, walks, a bandstand and open air restaurant at the end, on top?

Another alternative is to model the train ferry lines going out to sea on a stone pier like this one at Newquay Harbour and have a small harbour for boats and a beach area, like here:

http://www.cornwalls.co.uk/photos/data/media/2/newquay-harbour-wide.jpg (http://www.cornwalls.co.uk/photos/data/media/2/newquay-harbour-wide.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 25, 2016, 06:10:32 pm
 :hellosign   Thanks for the latest photos & ideas Chris, like the sound of a beach area behind the goods yard &/ or in between the ferries possibly curving round the mouth of the river. Have kept the Trainferry dock on land so far, though maybe  :hmmm: two piers would make sense.  Down on Penzance beach this morning got me  :hmmm: that backdrop would be spot on where the main line heads away from the Town station. Thank you again Chris lots to think about
regards Derek 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Kris on April 25, 2016, 08:41:25 pm
Have you thought about placing the TT and associated yard to the left of the station to allow for both up and down line through running?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 25, 2016, 10:12:32 pm
 :hellosign: Kris, thanks for looking, I have thought of your suggestion but seem to struggle for space when I looked at the possibility. Also the layout is designed to be end to end but with a loop for continuous running.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on April 30, 2016, 10:24:42 pm
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)


 :hellosign: All, been all work & no play this week. Here is the latest update, more    :hmmm:  moves the goods shed parallel to the station, still one pier which both ferries share also added beach area with road access. Moved Town station access road to below the station, all in all a general tidy up which I like-could go with this. More details to add when more time. Thanks for looking & comments or suggestions are always welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on May 01, 2016, 09:30:21 am
Hi Derek,

I like it. Can't remember your layout dimensions or your potential train lengths but maybe a bit longer for the passenger ferry platform ie. the point starting further back.

 Am sure someone will comment that the loco will get trapped but I like that, it means another loco has to come and pull the coaches out so more operating potential, seen it done many times in France and Spain.

Sorry to frenchy on you but reminds me of pictures I've seen of Le Verdon up from Bordeaux .....

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/peclegg/sncf/pictures/pictures_articles/2005_01-3.jpg (http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/peclegg/sncf/pictures/pictures_articles/2005_01-3.jpg)

I like the idea of a beach too. Will attempt mine soon but not quite sure what I'm doing. I'll let you know how I get on.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 01, 2016, 11:04:50 am
Thanks for the latest update, Derek. This new version looks much simpler to build and operate whilst having more scenic possibilities. Having only a single track dead end line alongside the passenger ferry does mean that another loco. will have to release the train loco. but that adds to the operating interest and could be explained by late 1960s track rationalisation? Depending on the room and budget available I'd leave room for adding a second parallel line and a set of points at the end to allow a loco. to run around its train, instead, as was done at Weymouth Quay. Also, as there never seems to be enough siding space on all but the biggest layouts, I'd also, again depending on the budget available, leave room for at least a third (if not also a fourth) parallel siding in the goods yard as there seems plenty of space. At least one siding could be used for stabling terminating passenger trains.

This is an example of where laying out out all the track and having some running sessions to try out the track plan will come in very useful before fixing everything down. With terminating and departing BR SR, BR WR and (inter-regional in the Summer) passenger and goods trains, plus goods and passenger trains to the quay, you need to ensure that you'll have enough track for a peak Summer Saturday timetable to be operated. Before the 1980s rationalisation of Weymouth Town, it had plenty of track.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 01, 2016, 11:07:15 pm
 :hellosign: Chris (Weave), many thanks for your imput & the super photo, my thinking for the passenger ferry is a loco or shunter would stop, un-couple & run round the coaches & push them to the platform,(which could be longer), thank you for that.
   Looking forward to further updates on your layout.

 :hellosign:  Thanks for looking Chris (in P), will have another look at available space for extra sidings for the Town station. As explained above a loco can run around at the Pier station before the platform, hope this makes sense.
    I am looking forward to lots of practice sessions to ensure all is going to plan, more news on this soon
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 02, 2016, 08:38:08 am
:hellosign: Chris (Weave), many thanks for your imput & the super photo, my thinking for the passenger ferry is a loco or shunter would stop, un-couple & run round the coaches & push them to the platform,(which could be longer), thank you for that.
   Looking forward to further updates on your layout.

 :hellosign:  Thanks for looking Chris (in P), will have another look at available space for extra sidings for the Town station. As explained above a loco can run around at the Pier station before the platform, hope this makes sense.
    I am looking forward to lots of practice sessions to ensure all is going to plan, more news on this soon
regards Derek.

Good morning Derek. Thanks for your reply. You're quite right: the train loco. (shunter or larger) taking a train (which can be a goods -- Containers on Conflats, vans with fresh produce, fuel tankers for the ferry -- as well as a passenger one) alongside the passenger ferry can stop, uncouple & run round the coaches & push them to the platform,(which needs to be long enough for your longest passenger train). However, as at Weymouth Quay, another use for the runaround loop would be to stable the fuel tankers whilst the bunkering oil is pumped from them to the ferry (I can email you scanned pictures) and then whilst awaiting collection. Alternatively, you can model the sunken line minus points as being 'rationalised'.

On a busy Summer Saturday, you will appreciate plenty of siding space. Definitely, you should have plenty of practice sessions to ensure all is going to plan. If possible, try to get a copy of a Working Timetable (or, at least, a Passenger Timetable) for Weymouth Town and Quay for the 1960s to give you some ideas.

I'm looking forward to seeing your layout take shape.

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 02, 2016, 11:19:05 pm
:hellosign: Chris (Weave), many thanks for your imput & the super photo, my thinking for the passenger ferry is a loco or shunter would stop, un-couple & run round the coaches & push them to the platform,(which could be longer), thank you for that.
   Looking forward to further updates on your layout.

 :hellosign:  Thanks for looking Chris (in P), will have another look at available space for extra sidings for the Town station. As explained above a loco can run around at the Pier station before the platform, hope this makes sense.
    I am looking forward to lots of practice sessions to ensure all is going to plan, more news on this soon
regards Derek.

Good morning Derek. Thanks for your reply. You're quite right: the train loco. (shunter or larger) taking a train (which can be a goods -- Containers on Conflats, vans with fresh produce, fuel tankers for the ferry -- as well as a passenger one) alongside the passenger ferry can stop, uncouple & run round the coaches & push them to the platform,(which needs to be long enough for your longest passenger train). However, as at Weymouth Quay, another use for the runaround loop would be to stable the fuel tankers whilst the bunkering oil is pumped from them to the ferry (I can email you scanned pictures) and then whilst awaiting collection. Alternatively, you can model the sunken line minus points as being 'rationalised'.

On a busy Summer Saturday, you will appreciate plenty of siding space. Definitely, you should have plenty of practice sessions to ensure all is going to plan. If possible, try to get a copy of a Working Timetable (or, at least, a Passenger Timetable) for Weymouth Town and Quay for the 1960s to give you some ideas.

I'm looking forward to seeing your layout take shape.



 :hellosign:  Thanks for your interest Chris, my plan is for the tramway to move on to the pier on standard track so no sunken points, although I had`t considered this as an option  :hmmm: got me thinking again.
   I will do some research on 60s summer timetables asap but already thinking where I can add the sidings
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 03, 2016, 06:17:21 am
Good morning Derek, I'm looking forward to the next update.

After this month I should have time to scan and email you some useful pictures from the Weymouth Tramway book.

By careful positioning, it should be possible to avoid having to 'sink' any points into the road surface on the quayside.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 11:40:20 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: & good morning Everybody,after lots of serious   :hmmm:  time, here is the latest incarnation of the plan.  Many changes, but only re-locating to make better use of space. The addition of carriage sidings & moving the turntable I think tidies the town station, the goods shed & yard are smaller, all the roads will be narrower so no through traffic. I plan the beach to be prominent with sea wall & promenade the service road with hotels & cafes. In the centre a solid hill- that`s why the railway goes around- with possibly a look out or other feature on top but don`t want to block view of the station. I still love the idea of the pier so no change except for small service siding for the ferries & importantly made the passenger station platform longer- about 9 coaches I reckon. A big  :thankyousign: for those pointers.
   Most importantly the back end of the month should have good news on construction   :thumbsup: 
    Have tried to hatch a name for the station but nothing fits yet but watch this space. thanks for looking & as always ideas, suggestions & comments are welcome
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on May 08, 2016, 11:57:27 am
Looks very good indeed Derek.
I like the idea that the beach and sea wall will be a prominent feature and also like the idea of a hill to give the layout relief and height.
Looking forward to construction starting in earnest.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 12:29:43 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for looking Martin, I know it`s been said before but yes I feel this is could be the one to go
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 08, 2016, 01:19:13 pm
Yes, Derek, I agree this looks like the one. It's been well worth all the iterations to get it right and reduce over-complexity and expense in unnecessary points and trackwork. The addition of carriage sidings (still needed in Summer in the 1960s and will keep an 0-6-0 shunter occupied) and moving the turntable (it will be beside the sea, like Padstow's was, great for scenic photos.!) definitely tidies up the town station area.

The original Padstow railway turntable by the sea (I can email other photos. of the later one):

http://gb.fotolibra.com/images/previews/516249-padstow-railway-station-and-fishing-flee.jpeg (http://gb.fotolibra.com/images/previews/516249-padstow-railway-station-and-fishing-flee.jpeg)

The smaller goods shed (although Weymouth Town's was quite large) and yard are still enough for the latter half of the 1960s and can keep a second 0-6-0 shunter busy there and as the station pilot releasing mainline locomotives from their trains, marshalling goods, passenger and parcels trains, etc.

Having all the roads narrower is fine if you imagine the part of the town above the station dating from medieval times and looking like parts of York but stone-built rather than half-timbered -- which justifies having part of the stone town walls, at least on the seaward side and even the road going through a gateway, as we have discussed.

York, "The Shambles", but not as narrow to allow the railway to run past:

http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/5137949.jpg (http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/5137949.jpg)

Typical Cornish stone-built town houses:

http://hookedonhouses.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Oyster-Catcher-holiday-rental-in-Mousehole-Cornwall-Unique-Stays-41.jpg (http://hookedonhouses.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Oyster-Catcher-holiday-rental-in-Mousehole-Cornwall-Unique-Stays-41.jpg)

http://www.lantoom.co.uk/media/wysiwyg/Cornish_stone_house.jpg (http://www.lantoom.co.uk/media/wysiwyg/Cornish_stone_house.jpg)

Plus, in a similar style to this?

http://www.alexmcintyrearchitects.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/New-Build-Leicestershire1.jpg (http://www.alexmcintyrearchitects.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/New-Build-Leicestershire1.jpg)

Combinations of these plus some pubs and warehouses will give you plenty of ideas, I'm sure.

http://www.hondawanderer.com/37407_Weymouth_Quay_1995.htm (http://www.hondawanderer.com/37407_Weymouth_Quay_1995.htm)

I agree with Martin, having the beach prominent with a sea wall and promenade one the seaward side of the road with hotels and cafes on the other will look very attractive. Having a solid hill in the centre to justify having the railway goings around is an excellent idea. I would definitely have a lookout tower (I will have one, at Cant Cove, on a hillside, converted from the base of a German water tower) or other feature (a Roman lighthouse like the Pharos at Dover but restored -- so easier to model -- by some local Victorians?) on the top but agree that it should be placed so as to not block the view of the station.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/de/3/3a/%C3%96stlicher_Pharos_Dover.png (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/de/3/3a/%C3%96stlicher_Pharos_Dover.png)

Unrestored but with Saxon Church (quite easy to model as it is, mostly, straight lines):

https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/images/a/a8/Dover_St_Mary-in-Castro_Kent.jpg (https://familysearch.org/wiki/en/images/a/a8/Dover_St_Mary-in-Castro_Kent.jpg)

If you like buses, the Weymouth Quayside line, soon after leaving the Town station passed the Southern National 'bus garage which could be modelled in low relief. It's very easy to model:

https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5035/5887797748_0d5d086b49.jpg (https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5035/5887797748_0d5d086b49.jpg)

The pier is fine but, I agree, adding a short siding for tank wagons to fuel the ferries is an excellent extra and adds to the variety of trains using the quayside branch (Class 33s plus LWB modern 4-wheel tankers were used into the 1980s, at Weymouth, I think).

Here are some at the modern quayside station (the building being rectangular, should be easy to model from layers of outer plasticard over a clear plasticard shell).

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(john_mann1.1969)quay_old23.jpg)

Making the quayside passenger station platform long enough for about 9 coaches should be more than enough. In real life, in the early 1980s, a typical boat train (up to a dozen coaches at its peak) consisted of a mixture of BR Mk 1 and 2 stock with a Buffet Car and a couple of bogie luggage vans which were in blue/grey or all-blue livery. Earlier, the coaches would be in BR SR Green (Mk 1s and Bulleids). In BR WR days, the coaches would be in BR Maroon or for the boat trains, WR Chocolate & Cream. You can, of course, have both BR SR and WR trains using your station even though it is in South Cornwall as, in 'our' Cornwall, some SR trains run from Wadebridge down to Truro. (I will update the local history and map, later.)

A WR pannier tank with BR Maroon GUV and BR SR Green Bulleid on the quayside line:

http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-GC4.jpg (http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/000-0-a-rs-greenwood-GC4.jpg)

Class 03 D2397 with a BR SR Boat Train formed of what looks like a Bulleid followed by a Maunsell (?) coach:

http://www.asgq57.dsl.pipex.com/3218/1960s/630730-0239-D2397-WeyTramway.jpg (http://www.asgq57.dsl.pipex.com/3218/1960s/630730-0239-D2397-WeyTramway.jpg)

We will all be looking forward to construction commencing.

For the town name, some variation of 'mouth' or 'bay' might be appropriate? Look at local river names in South Cornwall and try adding mouth, bay or port?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 08, 2016, 02:58:51 pm
Modelled in Cornish stone such a medieval gate could be made big enough for a train to pass through the centre arch as well as road vehicles:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/33/King's_Lynn_South_Gate_-_geograph.org.uk_-_365129.jpg
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 03:10:07 pm
 :hellosign:  :greatpicturessign: & lots of inspirational ideas Chris for which I am most grateful,  :thankyousign: .  My thoughts are for the sea wall to extend past the carriage sidings, thinking inspired by Long Rock TMD just outside Penzance.
  I totally agree stone buildings will look good with a stone walkway bridge over the road & tramway in the top right corner, this would follow the river & cross with the narrow road then continue up the hill. Then steps down the other side & lead to the promenade then coast path past the carriage sidings, should be easy to model & look good.
  Yes love buses- drive them all day & have a large "00" model collection. As many bus stations & garages used to be located right in the centre of towns we will definitely find space. 
   Again the dis-used Weymouth quay station is an excellent example, the jury is still out on stone vs wooden pier although the former we be an excellent breakwater for the beach.
    Will be on the lookout for MK1`s &2`s in the various liveries as soon as serious construction starts & maybe a sleeper train in BR Blue & a French set too for the boat train?
      Will be updating as soon as the ports name is revealed & thank you again for your interest & all your thoughts
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 03:14:14 pm
Modelled in Cornish stone such a medieval gate could be made big enough for a train to pass through the centre arch as well as road vehicles:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/33/King's_Lynn_South_Gate_-_geograph.org.uk_-_365129.jpg
:hellosign:  :thankyousign: again Chris, Kings Lynn South gate is an excellent example of what I have in mind
  regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 08, 2016, 03:52:30 pm
Delighted to help, Derek. I only wish I had such space. For tips on how to model Cornish stone buildings, Martin's two layouts are full of excellent examples. By avoiding curved and very ornate buildings construction can be quite quick. Cornish stone buildings are angular and you can avoid too much ornamentation to keep construction simple. The older the building the easier it is to model. Roofs need care as they are very visible in N Scale.

Extending the sea wall past the carriage sidings, like Long Rock TMD just outside Penzance is an excellent idea. As long as you keep to Cornish stone (similar to granite but not, technically, granite: I'd use various styles of plastic embossed stone plastic sheets but others prefer cardboard and printed stone paper) you can take examples of suitable medieval and later buildings and medieval walls from anywhere in England, I think. If you make rough mock-ups out of cereal packet card you can try out various configurations around the tracks -- once they are all fixed as you want -- until the location, heights and width look fine. Then make the actual models once you're sure that everything "works". Don't forget to allow for interior lighting and, where necessary, to be able to remove them, if necessary for access (so they will need to have their walls sunk below road level).

The Great Yarmouth harbour tramway went past a medieval tower (part of the old town walls) and I've often thought that would make a nice scenic feature, too. (When I find a picture, I'll send it to you.)

If you want to model a stabling point for your diesel shunters, the single road shed and fuelling point that was at Kings Lynn would make an easy to construct model, I think.

http://www.westernthunder.co.uk/index.php?threads/kings-lynn-stabling-point-1980s.1773/ (http://www.westernthunder.co.uk/index.php?threads/kings-lynn-stabling-point-1980s.1773/)

But you'll have to do a Google Image search to find the originals, I'm afraid.

It could be placed at the end of the carriage siding nearest the sea?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 08, 2016, 04:37:32 pm
When you're ready, I can post you a cosmetically damaged (since replaced) 'British Loading Gauge' Lima CIWL "Pullman" coach for gauging purposes, Derek, plus a list of the short rake of Lima CIWL coaches Chris (Weave) and I have. (Don't buy the more expensive "Orient Express" coaches as they are not suitable.)

A portion of the "Night Sleeper" from Paddington to Penzance, detached at the mainline junction station: two Sleeper coaches (a Mk 1 Sleeper Second, SLSTP, plus a Sleeper Composite, SLC, together with a Mk 1 BCK (for the guard and seated passengers), plus a Siphon G (or, later a GUV or BG), for the overnight mail, would be more realistic than a long through Sleeper train. (I can work out the timings, later.) The SR never had any Sleepers (except one that Bulleid built for Directors' use).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 07:50:51 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks again Chris, I wasn't aware of the King's Lynn tramway , will research this further sounds interesting.
    :thankyousign: for your offer of the coach I will let you know when  construction is underway. I was thinking of  sleeper coaches for a possible cross-channel boat train service. This could originate from Bristol to Paris avoiding London, just a idea to consider?  Overnight mail would also be a good idea, thanks again for all the info
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 08, 2016, 11:39:54 pm
 :hellosign: Chris (iP)   :searchingsign: for Kings Lynn tramway  a big :smackedface: . Found Great Yarmouth tramway, very interesting  :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on May 09, 2016, 09:50:16 am
Hi Derek,

I like the new plan a lot. No pressure but am still looking forward to the build very much. I'm taking ages. I think the sand I'm putting down at the moment was created faster than I'm sticking it!

Regarding the name, as you mentioned Penzance and Newlyn, thought maybe Penlyn or Port Penlyn. Think the 'Pen' means point or head and the 'Lyn' means pool but not sure. Just an idea.

Like the thought of your Bristol service to Paris although I was thinking more of a western France connection to justify the long ferry ride. Apparently Bristol is twinned with Bordeaux....

https://www.bristol.gov.uk/museums-parks-sports-culture/bordeaux-and-bristol (https://www.bristol.gov.uk/museums-parks-sports-culture/bordeaux-and-bristol)

 so potential 'through' trains there.

Went on a day trip from Dover to Calais (booze and ciggies  :D)on Saturday and got some more inspiration for port defences and scales (which I'm having trouble with) although everything's so big I'll just have to have the train ferry at the back and a fishing port with some yachts at the front.

Anyway, keep pressing on and don't lose the faith.

Cheers weave  :beers:

PS Lots of Breton cider  :pint:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 09, 2016, 10:14:14 am
:hellosign: Chris (iP)   :searchingsign: for Kings Lynn tramway  a big :smackedface: . Found Great Yarmouth tramway, very interesting  :thankyousign:
regards Derek.

My apologies, Derek. I meant the Kings Lynn Harbour branch as well as the rather better known Great Yarmouth Harbour Tramway (pictures of which are on line) which I remember from the late 1970s. Both used Class 04s then Class 03s. I have just bought "Diesels in East Anglia" published by OPC (a book which I once owned) which has a picture of a Class 04 with a goods train by one of Great Yarmouth's medieval town wall towers (part of which is also on the book's dust cover). When I get the book, I'll scan and email you the picture for additional inspiration plus from the OPC "The Weymouth Tramway" book by John Lucking.

I'll post the list of Lima CIWL coaches, soon. Don't buy the expensive "Orient Express" ones by Kato and others or the larger scale German ones. I do, however, have a German-made CIWL "Sleeping Car" coming which I will see if it fits in with the other CIWL (Lima) coaches (which both Chris -- Weave, and I have).

Once the CIWL train has left Cornwall, it goes to Britanny but beyond that it depends on what is realistic for such a fictional operation! Connections with the CIWL train are made in Britanny (e.g., at Port Regleun) and at the BR WR junction station for your port on the mainline to Penzance. The CIWL train is also, at present, a Summer timetable only service and may not be daily to save on the number of British Loading Gauge CIWL coaches required to operate it. The justification is that, being ex-Broad Gauge, the ex-GWR lines had a slightly larger loading gauge, so the Lima British Loading Gauge CIWL coaches can be justified as running through without hitting anything! (Although one did in the West Midlands, on tour . . .) The CIWL train is aimed at tourists as a kind of luxury Rail Cruise. However, discussions are continuing . . .

I like Penlyn but Port Penlyn is also good. Anyway, it's your layout so I, also, look forward to your decision and work commencing.

Must get back to work! Only a couple more weeks to go!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 09, 2016, 01:56:24 pm
Hi Derek,

I like the new plan a lot. No pressure but am still looking forward to the build very much. I'm taking ages. I think the sand I'm putting down at the moment was created faster than I'm sticking it!

Regarding the name, as you mentioned Penzance and Newlyn, thought maybe Penlyn or Port Penlyn. Think the 'Pen' means point or head and the 'Lyn' means pool but not sure. Just an idea.

Like the thought of your Bristol service to Paris although I was thinking more of a western France connection to justify the long ferry ride. Apparently Bristol is twinned with Bordeaux....

https://www.bristol.gov.uk/museums-parks-sports-culture/bordeaux-and-bristol (https://www.bristol.gov.uk/museums-parks-sports-culture/bordeaux-and-bristol)

 so potential 'through' trains there.

Went on a day trip from Dover to Calais (booze and ciggies  :D)on Saturday and got some more inspiration for port defences and scales (which I'm having trouble with) although everything's so big I'll just have to have the train ferry at the back and a fishing port with some yachts at the front.

Anyway, keep pressing on and don't lose the faith.

Cheers weave  :beers:

PS Lots of Breton cider  :pint:

:hellosign:  thanks for looking Chris (Weave), Bordeaux would be an excellent choice of destination.
Enjoy your Cider  :beers:  & never lose faith you are very creative.
Hope to start construction soon as now really happy with the plan


 :hellosign:  Chris (IP), no problem I now know a lot more about King's Lynn & thanks the Great Yarmouth site gives Lot's of inspiration.
    Will be looking at suitable rolling stock as soon as construction is underway. The name will probably be made from places I have a deep connection to but thoughts on this are on going & thanks again for all your help
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 15, 2016, 09:59:00 am
Good morning Derek, next month I should be able to do a lot of book illustrations scanning so can email you (please, PM me) photos. from "The Weymouth Harbour Tramway" and "Diesels in East Anglia" books.

Good news, if you want to run a full-length train of BR Sleeper Coaches: in 1965, a special train run for a conference of travel agents in Jersey, ran from Paddington to Weymouth Quay formed of 10 mixed LMR & WR Sleeping Cars plus one brake-end coach and was double-headed by two Class 04 diesel shunters! That would make an interesting train to run (but with fewer coaches, of course).

More thoughts on the Town Wall, if there was a harbour for the Cornish tin trade (which dates back to pre-Roman times) then in late Roman times, to protect what would have been a wealthy town, the inhabitants would have had protective stone walls built to protect them from sea-borne Saxon raiders. The stone walls, towers, and gates could have been further strengthened in post-Roman (e.g. in King Alfred's time for protection against the Vikings) and Medieval times (for protection against the French, like the Cinque Ports) with 'restorations' (like at York) in Victorian times. The port's long history would also explain the suggested Roman lighthouse, should you want one?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 15, 2016, 06:26:37 pm
 :hellosign:  :thankyousign: again Chris, I would appreciate any information on the Weymouth tramway & the shunters used, although U Tube  videos are really good sources of inspiration.
   That special sleeper train sounds spot on for my layout & now is on the wish list. I am thinking ferries to the channel Islands would be part of the services offered.
I agree about the stone town walls, the town would have always justified protection, like your thinking Chris thanks again  :pmsign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 15, 2016, 08:02:46 pm
My pleasure, Derek. I hope that, next week, i will be able to get down to some serious scanning!

For shunters on the quay tramway, in BR Green days you need a Class 03 and a Class 04 0-6-0, for BR Steam days, a BR Black livery pannier tank. In BR Blue days, a Class 03 (but under 'Rule One' you could, also, have a BR Blue Class 04, too).

BR Black pannier tank and BR Green Class 04 at Weymouth Quay Station:
 http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/00-b-hilton-UW11-9620.jpg (http://www.davidheyscollection.com/userimages/00-b-hilton-UW11-9620.jpg)

BR Black pannier tank on goods train on Weymouth Quay Tramway:
http://www.asgq57.dsl.pipex.com/3218/1960s/630730-0241-7782-WeyTramway.jpg (http://www.asgq57.dsl.pipex.com/3218/1960s/630730-0241-7782-WeyTramway.jpg)

Two BR Green (one with wasp stripes) Class 04s at Weymouth Quay station:
https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7006/6438050461_298734f2bf_b.jpg (https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7006/6438050461_298734f2bf_b.jpg)

BR Green Class 03 D2398 with interesting parcels train:
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(6.1964)quay_old28.jpg (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/w/weymouth_quay/weymouth(6.1964)quay_old28.jpg)

For shunters in the goods yard and as station pilots, a second model of any of the above would be fine. Under 'Rule One', you could also have a BR Green or BR Blue Class 08. Better, would be a kit-built SR Class 12 diesel shunter with dual air and vacuum brakes in BR Green (built on a Class 08 chassis) as they worked over the Weymouth Quay Tramway and shunted the yard, too.

A BR Black Late BR Crest Dapol Ivatt 2-6-2T would also be good in BR SR Steam Days for working over the Tramway.

I'm glad that you like my 'back story' for the Old Town Walls.

Here is a picture of Roman Portchester:
http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/images/Britain/Romans/Portchester_SaxonShore02_full.jpg (http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/images/Britain/Romans/Portchester_SaxonShore02_full.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 15, 2016, 08:48:22 pm
Although it's the main gateway into Carisbrooke Castle, this would make a fine Medieval stone gateway and, if the gateway was widened, could allow the harbour tramway and the road in which it would be embedded to pass through the Old Town Walls:

http://www.coolplaces.co.uk/system/images/1290/iow-carisbrooke-monuments-1290-large.jpg (http://www.coolplaces.co.uk/system/images/1290/iow-carisbrooke-monuments-1290-large.jpg)

Of course, if you prefer York there is the Bootham Bar:

http://www.rickneal.ca/travelblog/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Bootham-Bar.jpg (http://www.rickneal.ca/travelblog/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Bootham-Bar.jpg)

Your gateway could combine features from both?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 15, 2016, 09:32:33 pm
 :hellosign:   :greatpicturessign:   :thankyousign:   :thumbsup: lots of very interesting pictures, unfortunatly the last image has given me an errror message.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 15, 2016, 09:48:16 pm
:hellosign:   :greatpicturessign:   :thankyousign:   :thumbsup: lots of very interesting pictures, unfortunatly the last image has given me an error message.
regards Derek.


Thanks, Derek. Sorry about that; I just checked the link and it works fine for me.

http://www.rickneal.ca/travelblog/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Bootham-Bar.jpg (http://www.rickneal.ca/travelblog/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Bootham-Bar.jpg)

Maybe you have to paste it all as one long line?

Here's a simpler, lower Barbican gateway, on the quay, at Sandwich, the Fisher Gate, enlarged in 1581:

http://www.hettyhikes.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/S1057720-copy.jpg (http://www.hettyhikes.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/S1057720-copy.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 15, 2016, 10:08:55 pm
 :hellosign: Chris my apologies, the link with the error is Porchester, will have to check the site , looks brilliant. At the moment something close to York is my favorite but plenty of good examples, thanks again
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 16, 2016, 01:09:24 am
(Sorry, but you are not allowed to access the gallery)

 :hellosign: & Good morning, a bit early or late but just looking at the plan had to tidy up the approaches to the Town station. Added a scissor crossing, & points to join to rest of plan (will show when happy with it) but no other changes to main board. The non scenic board gains a helix to replace under the station this time going up. Still happy with the overall plan, just moved part 3 to bottom, think it all goes together better. As always comments & suggestions are more than welcome & thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 16, 2016, 08:22:34 am
Good morning Derek, thanks for the latest update. The fine-tuning of the track seems fine to me.

With the Porchester link, maybe you have to cut and paste it all as one line?

http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/images/Britain/Romans/Portchester_SaxonShore02_full.jpg (http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/images/Britain/Romans/Portchester_SaxonShore02_full.jpg)

The lift-out (lift-up at one end?) bridge is a very practical solution but I would try to incorporate an automatic power cut-off either side of the bridge for when it is not in position to prevent trains accidentally plunging to their doom!

The Sandwich Barbican Gate and bridge would be a good prototype for the road bridge across the inlet of the sea linking the Old Town area with the New Town on the other side of the road and harbour tramway.

The bridge, here, is part medieval stone bridge and part iron bridge. It would, of course, be easier to model the stone arched toll bridge.

http://c8.alamy.com/comp/AJ674J/uk-kent-sandwich-quay-cyclist-crossing-former-toll-bridge-over-river-AJ674J.jpg (http://c8.alamy.com/comp/AJ674J/uk-kent-sandwich-quay-cyclist-crossing-former-toll-bridge-over-river-AJ674J.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 16, 2016, 11:04:32 pm
 :hellosign: &  :greatpicturessign:  Chris, thanks again for your ideas, the bridge at Sandwich is a indeed very interesting design, as you say not easy to model but would look good. I really do need to do lots more research, as you are miles ahead for ideas.
regards Derek.














i
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 22, 2016, 05:09:21 pm
It's my pleasure, Derek. It provides a nice break from work. (I have had an idea for a similar sort of line within a walled medieval town for many years.)

Some quick updates from further study of "The Weymouth Harbour Tramway" book. A train of Pullmans (like the old GF ones) visited the quay at least once (behind a BR Blue Class 33) so you can add those to your list.

A train of Channel Island fresh flowers in the BR Steam Era was formed of various SWB brown vans, an ex-SR CCT, a BR Standard BG, a Siphon G (the Lima type)and an ex-SR BY bogie van. (All are available as N Gauge models.)

A Siphon G (like the Dapol WR one) was used back in the 1950s as part of a Channel island Boat Train.

Have you decided which period to model? I model from about 1956 to 1967; Martin about 1956 to 1964?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 22, 2016, 09:04:08 pm
 :hellosign:  Thanks again Chris, lots more very interesting & useful Information. As my main interest is although not exclusively Diesel & Electric I am thinking of 1965-1970 for this part of the layout, I do find it difficult to decide on era or location & am definitely rule one for rolling stock. No panic lots of alternative track planned for my modern trains which I will share when looking good

regards Derek   
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 23, 2016, 01:19:52 pm
 :hellosign: Derek,
Thanks for the update. 1965-1970 is, in my opinion, an excellent choice as it covers the very end of WR steam (1965) plus that of SR steam (1967) whilst overlapping between the BR Green / Maroon and BR Blue / Blue & Grey livery periods. You can, for example, run mixed BR SR Green and BR Blue & Grey coaches plus BR Maroon and BR Blue & Grey ones, or even, occasionally, all three liveries within one rake and the loco. can be BR Green or BR Blue or a SR steam loco.! It certainly fits in with my usual limit of 1967 (but I can extend to 1970 as I have a limited amount of suitable rolling stock) plus Martin's (just, I think he finishes around 1965) and is 1970 is just within the beginning (I think) of Weave's (Chris) timescale. John covers the whole period and before and after. So a wide variety of "through" trains are possible.

I look forward to the next update and the railway's name!  :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 23, 2016, 08:58:02 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for more information Chris which is really appreciated. The Western in BR maroon with a rake of coaches in same livery is one of my favourites, & good to know my layout will fit in.
   Doing lots of work in garden ready for shed as on holiday this week so should have lots to report at weekend
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 23, 2016, 09:03:51 pm
My pleasure, Derek. I also have a BR Maroon "Western" (an old GF one bought because it was DCC-fitted) and it does look fine at the head of a rake of WR BR Maroon Mark 1s. (So, that will be one "through" train.)

I look forward to the next update on the shed. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on May 23, 2016, 09:05:33 pm
:hellosign: Thanks for more information Chris which is really appreciated. The Western in BR maroon with a rake of coaches in same livery is one of my favourites, & good to know my layout will fit in.
   Doing lots of work in garden ready for shed as on holiday this week so should have lots to report at weekend
regards Derek.
Don't forget it's Hayle show this weekend Derek. I'm not exhibiting but will probably pop in sometime to have a look and see if I can pick up a bargain or two.
The following weekend it's the West Cornwall Show at Carn Brea on the Sunday. Mrs PP and I will be there for that one with Trepol Bay and Descanso Farm.
Martin
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on May 23, 2016, 10:23:42 pm
 :hellosign: Martin, thanks for the heads up I will try to get down to the Hayle show but can only manage Saturday as start of summer bus service on Sunday.
   In theory Carn Brea should be no problem as I have alternate weekends off will certainly be good to see you, Mrs PP & the layouts again, fingers crossed
regards Derek.











































Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on May 24, 2016, 08:14:26 am
:hellosign: Martin, thanks for the heads up I will try to get down to the Hayle show but can only manage Saturday as start of summer bus service on Sunday.
   In theory Carn Brea should be no problem as I have alternate weekends off will certainly be good to see you, Mrs PP & the layouts again, fingers crossed
regards Derek.
I look forward to meeting up again Derek. Not sure what time we'll be at Hayle on Saturday but will probably see you at Carn Brea anyway.
Martin
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 24, 2016, 08:24:02 am
I'm sure that you'll pick up a lot of very useful tips, Derek, from Martin, that will help you to get your layout off to an excellent start. The Hayle and Carn Brea shows should be very enjoyable, too, I think. (I look forward to seeing some photos., if possible.) Maybe you'll be able to pick up some bargains, too?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 04, 2016, 01:49:39 pm
 :hellosign: Everybody, good afternoon, still making slight adjustments to the plan & have made almost definite decisions.
  First unfortunetly wont make Carn Brea tomorrow as planned   :'(   , the reason is I need to swop weekends at work as the builders are putting down the shed base next Saturday   :claphappy: , praying the weather stays dry.
   The layout is going to have the port & town at the top, so all trains run sooner & have chose West Porthsea Central & Pierhead for the two stations. This latest plan is pretty much set in stone, the only real changes is the helix enters on the non scenic board but will be underneath so not intrusive & the bridge over the entrance will probably not need to lift out as this will be the highest point on the layout.
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/40/4216-040616130355.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=40451)
  To try give an idea of my grand master plan here is the next level
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/40/4216-040616131855.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=40452)
   There is a large modern station (unnamed) as the main central feature with a  tramway running underneath & then round the city centre. The helix taking trains down to 1 will be hidden behind a  building, thinking shopping or other large complex. The non scenic board has stabling for goods trains & the helix up to 3

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/40/4216-040616133533.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=40453)

  The bottom level features a smaller station (again unnamed) with the centre board the EMU/DMU yard, probably non scenic. The plan is to get only the main line up & running from top to bottom first, then serious work on the port, with trains running.  As always any ideas or suggestions are more than welcome, & thanks for looking.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on June 04, 2016, 02:16:32 pm
Looks good and looking forward to seeing your layout develop.
No worries about missing the show - I'll try to get some photos anyway.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 04, 2016, 08:09:37 pm
Good evening Derek,

Thanks for the latest update. I'd be very happy if I just had space for the first layout let alone Levels 2 and 3. Completing just Level One will certainly take a while. However, I realise that you can lay the track on Levels 2 and 3 and then add the scenic elements as time and budget allow. Unlike me, you could get the platforms all constructed relatively quickly which would give your trains somewhere to stop and be photographed at!

I'll email you two scanned photos of an urban coal yard branch next to a medieval tower, at Great Yarmouth, which ended at a level crossing and would be a great scenic attention to the town area? It closed in the early 1970s and Class 04s with rusty steel mineral wagons were the sole traffic.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 04, 2016, 10:47:52 pm
 :hellosign:  :sorrysign: Martin I will not see you at Carn Brea, hope you & Mrs PP have a wonderful day.

 :hellosign: Chris hope all went well with the electrics today, something else I am still thinking about.
    :sorrysign: the plan is not very clear, bad choice of colours especially 1&2. There is only one double main line running over all three levels & as I will be using Kato track this should be straightforward & allow trains to run while the scenic elements & other track are added. Look forward to photos & thank you for your interest
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 05, 2016, 10:25:39 am
Thanks, Derek. I hope we'll be able to complete most, if not all, the track electrification, this afternoon. Maybe not the programming track?

On another occasion, and a much simpler task, we'll wire up the platform lamps. Maybe, also some in the goods yard?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 16, 2016, 09:55:18 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening all, no more work for a few days so time for an update.   
    Last Saturday was a total load of  :poop:. The builders were no shows so  :veryangry: &  :censored: at them. Is the large shed a pipe dream, I hope not. However there is a plan "B", so trains WILL run this summer as there is the much smaller shed, but that needs a serious clear out before I can claim. OK rant over & hope to have the alternate plan or even better news very soon. Thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 16, 2016, 10:13:00 pm
Very sorry to read that, Derek. I do hope that you will be able to get the large shed ready for the layout, this summer. However, your Plan B sounds good especially as there is a train of CIWL Ferry coaches plus British and Continental wagons and vans, here, ready to leave in a week or less! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 16, 2016, 10:20:33 pm
 :hellosign: Chris,   :thankyousign:  Yes determined to have something up & running soon
regards Derek.












Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 17, 2016, 07:10:00 am
:hellosign: Chris,   :thankyousign:  Yes determined to have something up & running soon
regards Derek.

Good to read that, Derek. Cant Cove is also behind schedule because of: a) continuing work, b) DCC wiring delays, and, more positively, completing the painting of a very large batch of containers, wagons, and vans. But, 'through' trains will be running soon!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 19, 2016, 10:52:57 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/41/4216-190616223734.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=41228)
  :hellosign: & good evening everybody, above is first draft of plan B.
     The plan is very similar to the original idea but space is about halved so a bit of a squeeze to fit everything in. This level starts off between the helix`s on a bridge across the doorway entrance, past the sidings & re-located turntable then through the station on to the tramway. At the far left will be a quayside instead of pier, still with train ferry & passenger ferry terminals. Lots & lots of detail to fill in & as always any suggestions, comments are more than welcome. Thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 23, 2016, 11:27:48 am
Thanks for the update, Derek. It still looks a very interesting layout to build and operate. I hope you'll be able to make a start soon.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on June 24, 2016, 11:03:24 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for your interest Chris, will find time soon to start, but busy at work  :'(   this week, the small shed is almost ready just need more hours in the day
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on June 25, 2016, 10:04:02 pm
:hellosign: Thanks for your interest Chris, will find time soon to start, but busy at work  :'(   this week, the small shed is almost ready just need more hours in the day
regards Derek.

Thanks, Derek. That's good news. I look forward to the coming updates. I do understand. I now have some more free time, at last. Several trains are awaiting departure from Wadebridge Yard sidings. 8-)

Best regards,
Chris
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 03, 2016, 02:51:47 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/41/4216-030716143533.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=41599)
 :hellosign: & Good afternoon, have been lots of thinking & here is my latest ideas for the small shed. Again no radical changes, trying to make better use of the available space. Think I figured out the lift bridge, Kato extendable track in theory when connected the electric flows (I hope).
   The dark boards are Ikea Hejne 780x500 shelving units (which are on order for next week)  :claphappy:  the other boards will be Celotex or something very similar.
    The better news is the large shed could be a go again, all I am buying will be good for either so trains WILL be RUNNING SOON.
    As always comments & suggestions are always more than welcome & thanks for looking
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on July 03, 2016, 03:14:36 pm
One suggestion - when you do get the layout boards in place, spend some time just looking at it and thinking, maybe mocking up ad-hoc scenes with bits of track, cardboard, polystyrene etc. to get a feel for the space available and how the trains etc. fit.

Having spent much mental energy planning my own layout, after finally getting the boards in place and mocking it up, I realised it wouldn't work from a scenic point of view (too many elevated tracks and inclines at odd angles), but pootling about with track and stuff is bringing forth new inspiration.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 03, 2016, 03:33:03 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Railsquid that is good advice which I will sure to follow, so true what looks good on the computer screen sometimes does not look right in reality.  :thankyousign:
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on July 03, 2016, 04:05:48 pm
Thanks, Derek. Looking very good. Trains are waiting in Wadebridge Yard to depart! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 03, 2016, 05:50:14 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, thanks for looking, & a big  :thankyousign: for your patience
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 15, 2016, 12:35:50 am
 :hellosign: & Good morning, A quick but important update. Things are finally under way in the small shed, Henje shelving units arrived spot on date & have now assembled the first five, then come back to Scarm & re-arranged so will assemble no6 in the morning then hopefully up to B&Q for the fill in sections. More to follow with (hopefully) pictures soon. Thanks for looking
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on July 15, 2016, 01:06:45 am
Sounds good, looking forward to photos  :claphappy:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on July 15, 2016, 06:37:45 am
Good morning Derek, thanks for this very positive update. I'm very glad that, at last, you (and we) will be able to see some physical evidence of progress after the long wait. Looking forward to the pictures and the announcement of the name of your town and rail ferry-port. I know that Chris (Weave) has given you advice on ferries and I'm happy to send you scanned pictures of Weymouth Quay and Tramway when you're ready. Will you have a coal yard behind a pub like at Great Yarmouth?

As soon as you've some track down it would be good to see the arriving goods and CIWL trains, too.

I'm looking forward to the opening celebrations to which the "Chelsea Girls" will definitely want to come. 8-)

If you need any advice on scenery, I'm sure Martin or I would be happy to help. For DCC, Lil' Chris and DCC Dave have been very helpful to me.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 15, 2016, 03:15:20 pm
 :hellosign: Railsquid & Chris (IP), Thanks for your interest, getting to grips with the Henje shelving again today. It`s amazing how walls & doors change their measurements from computer to real thing so not straightforward, but it is very definite progress. Hope to have some photos as soon as something to show
 :thankyousign: again I`m sure there will be lots of questions presently
   regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on July 15, 2016, 05:52:17 pm
Very much looking forward to progress Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: railsquid on July 16, 2016, 06:30:49 am
:hellosign: Railsquid & Chris (IP), Thanks for your interest, getting to grips with the Henje shelving again today. It`s amazing how walls & doors change their measurements from computer to real thing so not straightforward, but it is very definite progress. Hope to have some photos as soon as something to show
Yup, it's fascinating how the best made plans of men with mice never seem to quite match reality... But things can always be bodged into place somehow, I find.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 16, 2016, 04:01:21 pm
:hellosign: Railsquid & Chris (IP), Thanks for your interest, getting to grips with the Henje shelving again today. It`s amazing how walls & doors change their measurements from computer to real thing so not straightforward, but it is very definite progress. Hope to have some photos as soon as something to show
Yup, it's fascinating how the best made plans of men with mice never seem to quite match reality... But things can always be bodged into place somehow, I find.
:hellosign: A big 10.4 on that one Railsquid, a little bit of bodging going on but overall very pleased with the Hejne units
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 17, 2016, 02:41:28 pm
 :hellosign: As promised a few photos of progress so far

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/42/4216-170716142959.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=42059)
The empty space cleared & painted

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/42/4216-170716143210.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=42060)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/42/4216-170716143358.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=42061)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/42/4216-170716143508.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=42062)

The Hejne shelves in position, the middle unit under the window was altered to fit. Overall very happy so far.


(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/42/4216-170716143855.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=42063)

The view from the window, the 150 on the GWR timed it perfectly.
  thanks for looking
         regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on July 17, 2016, 02:57:07 pm
Looking good Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on July 17, 2016, 11:07:44 pm
Very good to see some progress, Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on July 18, 2016, 05:04:54 am
Hi Derek,

As said, looking good. It's great to have some sort of board base down to fire enthusiasm.

We were moving, not moving, moving etc and it did my head in with no permanent board.

 Very jealous of your view. We nearly bought a place in Haslemere with a view of the railway 100 yards from my allotted train room window and a lovely country pub across the road but too many complications so a no go  :'(

We're settled now and I have my train room so shouldn't complain. Keep up the good work and looking forward to more progress as always.

Cheers weave  :beers:

PS. Slightly concerned that in the last picture you've nailed a dead cat or maybe raccoon to your fence just up from the bench  :D Prob my eyesight.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on July 18, 2016, 07:26:41 am
I hadn't noticed that.
Looks worrying  :D :D
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on July 19, 2016, 10:03:08 pm
 :hellosign: Chris & Martin the object on the fence is a an old Croc (footwear) with a plant. Yes we are really lucky to live here & a fantastic view.
    Back at work today,  :veryangry:  then away to IOM at the weekend so progress will be slow for the rest of the month  :'(  .  As always thanks for looking

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on July 30, 2016, 08:40:14 am
Enjoy the break. Union Mills is in the IoM and produce some very nice steam locos. Nothing really suitable for you though, alas, I think?

I hope to have completed the basic scenic work at Cant Cove by your return.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on August 14, 2016, 06:05:28 am
Hi Derek,

Just seeing how the layout's progressing (nosey, nosey). Hope you had a good time in the IoM. Presume you mean the Isle of Man. I've never been but hope you got some good ideas for the port area.

I don't live too far from the sea (in Hampshire) but need to go to a harbour soon for detail inspiration. Googling pics isn't the same as the real thing. Really need to go to Brittany again but with the house move, dogs, money etc. maybe next year.

Also, are you calling the port West Porthsea? I want to do maps and timetables and signs eventually. I might have asked before but have the memory of a fish.

Hope all's well and the 'dead cat croc shoe plant' is surviving the hot weather.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on August 14, 2016, 11:43:02 am
 :hellosign: Thanks for your interest Chris, unfortunately nothing new happening with the layout at the moment, work, holidays & general life means all model railway time is on Scarm. Still loving the planning, the overall plan is complete, just tweaking when & where needed.
 Isle of Man was excellent, lots of train & tram rides, first time for me also, now could be Spain next month (passport virgins).
   Yes the idea for West Porthsea comes from Hornsea on the East coast of Yorkshire, I have checked & it is fitchional. Dead cat doing well & hope to have progress on the layout to report soon
regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on August 17, 2016, 10:14:23 pm
Where are you thinking of going in Spain?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on August 17, 2016, 10:30:54 pm
 :hellosign: Just booked 4 nights at Internacional de Calonge in the Costa Brava.
   First time for us outside UK so this is a tester
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on August 17, 2016, 10:52:13 pm
Pity. That's a bit too far to visit. I live about 500km further South. Next time!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on August 17, 2016, 10:58:14 pm
 :hellosign: Never say never Brian, would always be good to meet other forum members
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 01, 2016, 10:27:57 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening all, first  :sorrysign:  , been a while but got in to the shed at last today. Typically work just keeps getting in the way- good job it pays for my hobby & the recent wet weather here in Cornwall means have been un-able to cut wood.
  Have started to build the frames to connect to the Ikea shelving, have decided on Ply for the most part & so far it is going well (my woodworking skills are zero). Pictures to follow as soon as something to show
   regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 02, 2016, 06:44:18 am
That's good news, Derek. I hope the ply won't warp in damp? I look forward to photos. in due course. Are you going to use cork underlay? I used some but also cardboard strips wider than the tracks to provide a marker for the ballast shoulder. Don't ballast until all the electrics are done and tested and do invest in (and use -- I, temporarily mislaid mine and it shows -- a straight Tracksetta).

If you can get some trains running by Christmas we can have some 'through' trains, including Christmas Specials. I won't have much free time until December 20th / January 1st (I'll be away for Christmas itself). For goods trains, I have a spare full set of duplicate BR livery brake vans (Graham Farish, Minitrix and Peco) like Brian, John, Martin, and I have). Over the autumn there will be more PO goods stock available, especially Martin's. But I guess you're eager to buy (and run) some locos., first! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 02, 2016, 09:43:49 am
Morning Derek,

Glad you've got going again. Don't rush it though. With work and DIY orders from SWMBO I haven't had too much time on the layout but have rushed things recently, when I had the time, and regretted later.

Again, looking forward to the build. Supposed to be nice weather today so hope you make progress.

Cheers weave  :beers:





Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 02, 2016, 09:48:50 am
I definitely agree, Chris: whenever I have rushed things, when I had the time, I often regretted it later (not straight track because I mislaid the straight Tracksetta, broken point because I had not ensured that it opened before the ballast set, paint splashed carelessly because I was in a hurry . . . ).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 02, 2016, 10:33:06 am
 :hellosign: A very good morning Chris (IP), & Chris (Weave), thanks for your excellent advice I definitely wont be rushing the build although I want to see my trains running again, it seems forever.
  The weather here is sunny this morning so will be back with the layout shortly.
   I devised my plan using Kato track so a Tracksetta probably wont be needed, although I have a small supply of Peco code 80 including Flex-track which would be silly not to use so again never say never. The original idea was to go with Celotex foam board, (might still) although 5mm Ply has been purchased so will see how it all looks & sounds before discounting Cork underlay. Thanks for your interest

regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 02, 2016, 10:57:39 am
A very good morning to you, also, Derek,

I must have forgotten that you were (mostly) going to use Kato. However, a straight Tracksetta will still, as you've mentioned, be very useful for those lengths of Peco Code 80. If any trains were able to run at speed through Cant Cove, I'm sure they would wobble alarmingly on the 'straights' which aren't quite!

If you're using foam board I would guess that cork underlay would be unnecessary but strips of it can still be used to mark out the edges of ballast shoulders giving a sunken cess to either side. With Kato it can be used to build up the surface on either side of the track. Time to experiment with a short length once you've got the baseboards fitted.

Very much looking forward to seeing your layout take shape.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 03, 2016, 07:13:15 am
Morning Derek,

Hope you got some things done on the layout yesterday.

 I wanted to but was dragged kicking and screaming  ;) down to Old Portsmouth for a roast and several ciders at the Still and West pub.

It's very near the harbour entrance, overlooking the water, right by the Isle of Wight car ferry terminal. Gosport ferries and IOW mini seacats as well. The Brittany Ferry 'Normandie' passed twice and we had to park a bit away near the IOW hovercraft port so have put it all down to 'research'.

With regard to Kato Unitrack, I use a tracksetta. I might be wrong (and probably am) it depends on how you want to fix it in place. I did an earlier layout with double sided sticky tape, firstly longways but then easier crossways. Worked OK but advice on here was little dabs of glue every so often on the sides of the ballast. Holds in place but easy to ping up if you go wrong.

I then do it slowly, piece by piece with the tracksetta between the joins. Have tried a straight edge but then you can only glue one side at a time.

As I said, probably doing it wrong. That's just for straights mind, curves are OK without as the eye (well mine) doesn't pick up on the imperfections.

I'll stop waffling now.

Hope makes sense. Keep on sawing and sticking.

Cheers weave  (with another hangover)  :beers:



Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 03, 2016, 09:42:33 pm
 :hellosign: Chris, sounds like excellent research was had.
      Managed to cut most of the Ply yesterday, & amazingly still got 10 fingers. Then tried to assemble a frame on my own but run out of arms so must wait till assistance is available, still happy with a little progress.
       I am thinking if the first straight piece of track is laid ok in theory the rest should follow, my eyes are not brilliant either so  here's hoping all goes to plan when I start track laying. Not really thought about fixing track down yet, investigation required & advice gratefully received.
   Back at work now but will update  with progress
 regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 03, 2016, 09:55:01 pm
Hi Derek, I would use white PVA glue and / or trackpins to hold the track in place until you're 100% happy all is fine. Some people use screws, I believe, fine for track that won't be seen. I drew pencil lines to try to ensure the track was aligned properly. I tried my best but I still have a gap between a point and a straight track that will, eventually, have to be fixed by tracklifting and laying new track. Fortunately, it is close to the broken point that will have to be replaced. So, as you'll have a LOT of track spend as much time and care as you can and look very carefully close-up at every join!

Looking forward to progress photos.

Best wishes,
Chris
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 03, 2016, 10:18:07 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for excellent advice Chris, I have lots of patience but want to crack on with it if that makes sense
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 03, 2016, 10:33:38 pm
:hellosign: Thanks for excellent advice Chris, I have lots of patience but want to crack on with it if that makes sense
regards Derek.

Glad to be of help. I do, fully, understand, Derek. As long as nothing is permanently fixed down, you can lay track quite quickly as it is still possible to adjust it, as required.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 04, 2016, 08:06:29 am
looking forward to seeing track laid Derek.
I use Copydex for fixing track as it's easy to peel off if you eventually need to lift any sections.
I also use screws on my fiddle yard.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 19, 2016, 09:42:13 pm
 :hellosign: Good evening all, first a big thank you to Chris in Prague for the latest stock which arrived safely today  :thumbsup:
   The extra hands were there to help today so lots of progress in the shed ,All the framework is now complete & started laying the 5.5mm ply for the boards, hopeful that next update will have trains running on the lower level. Pictures to follow when next time off
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 19, 2016, 09:51:15 pm
:hellosign: Good evening all, first a big thank you to Chris in Prague for the latest stock which arrived safely today  :thumbsup:
   The extra hands were there to help today so lots of progress in the shed ,All the framework is now complete & started laying the 5.5mm ply for the boards, hopeful that next update will have trains running on the lower level. Pictures to follow when next time off
    regards Derek.

Thanks for these two excellent pieces of news, Derek. I'm really glad that you were able to get the help needed to move on to the next stage. Seeing trains running, soon, will be great. I hope there will be some "through" trains before Christmas. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 19, 2016, 09:53:43 pm
Looking forward to the pictures Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 20, 2016, 12:59:57 am
Good news Derek,

We'll have to liaise on the 'through train' runnings soon. Those North Cornish folk seem to think that we in Port Regleun just drink Calvados and cidre breton all day and lose track of what's going on. :D

They're right of course but that's another story. :worried:

Seriously, glad things are going well at West Porthsea and look forward to pics and progress.

Sante weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on October 20, 2016, 05:19:30 pm
There's some Sam's Cider and Creech Ales lined up for delivery to West Porthsea as soon as Durscombe yard manager recieves instructions. Unlike those from the other side of the Chanel the citizens of Somerset are a sober lot and drink scrumpy only for medicinal reasons. :D :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 20, 2016, 09:26:04 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for all encouragement, hopefully yes we will have trains running before Christmas. Agree about the Cider, but unfortunately not very often (diabetic) :beers:
   Still a long way to go, but very definite progress on the layout, look forward to serious discussion on through running
     regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 20, 2016, 10:44:07 pm
Excellent news, Derek. As soon as you're ready we can all begin discussions about "through" trains. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 21, 2016, 10:11:50 pm
 :hellosign: Good evening all, if I got this right pictures of the latest woodwork in the shed. I am no carpenter so my methods may be a little unconventional but so far all is good.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/44/4216-211016215645.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=44736)

This is looking from the doorway, the nearest board is for the helix, then joining the Ikea shelving.
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/44/4216-211016220350.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=44737)
Now looking toward the door the opposite helix board in place.


(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/44/4216-211016220729.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=44739)

Another look at the same board from the doorway & yes bricks make ideal weights while the glue dries.
Any & all comments more than welcome & thanks for looking
   regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on October 21, 2016, 10:40:48 pm


([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/44/4216-211016220729.jpeg[/url]) ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=44739[/url])




A suggestion. The supporting wood should be turned through a right angle so the longer sides are vertical. It makes the structure stronger. The left hand support looks as if it's bowing already. That ought to be fixed to the wall.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 21, 2016, 10:54:28 pm
 :hellosign: & thanks Brian, rightly or wrongly I am trying to avoid fastening to the wall just in case of a move, (the big shed is not impossible, but not soon).
I will have to seriously look at extra support for that piece  :thankyousign:
    Also  the two second photos are same, sorry
  regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 22, 2016, 06:26:38 am
Thanks for this update, Derek. Very good to see the boards in place. However, it is very important that the baseboards be as level as possible before any tracklaying is done (otherwise, you will have problems with derailments which will be very difficult to fix) so you need to check everywhere with a spirit level (or whatever the latest version of these is called) and that all the necessary supports are, as Brian (Mito) says, correctly placed. Well worth spending the time, now, to get everything right.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 22, 2016, 10:28:53 am
 :hellosign:  :thankyousign: You are correct Chris, trying not to rush but want to see trains running. I realize unchecked mistakes at this point will lead to disappointment later. Next shed time I will check levels & all supports before continuing construction, thanks again for your & Brian`s good advice
   regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 22, 2016, 10:58:16 am
As always, glad to be of help, Derek. I fully understand that you're very eager to have trains running but N Gauge rolling stock really needs level track, so it's well worth the extra time and work to ensure that the baseboards are completely level and even.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 22, 2016, 08:57:46 pm
Ive been away for a few days and glad to see progress being made Derek.
It is important to keep things as level as possible, a problem for me as we live in a 200 year old cottage and the railway room floor is all over the place.
It's a treat when I take the layout to an exhibition with a flat floor!
Anyway, take your time. I'm looking forward to seeing tracks laid.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 23, 2016, 11:28:36 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Martin, we have  definite progress
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 30, 2016, 08:57:08 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening all, have taken on board all the good advice  :thankyousign:
   All the boards are level & have added extra support where needed, had to re-locate one of the uprights to allow easier access.
   Work as usual is getting in the way  :'(  so progress has slowed again, but lots of thinking time.
regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 30, 2016, 08:59:26 pm
:hellosign: Good Evening all, have taken on board all the good advice  :thankyousign:
   All the boards are level & have added extra support where needed, had to re-locate one of the uprights to allow easier access.
   Work as usual is getting in the way  :'(  so progress has slowed again, but lots of thinking time.
regards Derek.
Thanks for the update. Glad you managed to get the boards level.
Track soon?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 30, 2016, 09:14:44 pm
That's good news, Derek. You won't regret the extra work. I fully understand how work gets in the way of railway modelling!

With Jason's help, a short rake of Peco "Railfreight" goods stock for "through" running to Hood-dale and ("Tarpaulin" opens to Port Regleun, too) plus, when I slip into the BR Blue era, Cant Cove, is being assembled for you to run as soon as you have some tracks down! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 30, 2016, 09:53:58 pm
:hellosign: Good Evening all, have taken on board all the good advice  :thankyousign:
   All the boards are level & have added extra support where needed, had to re-locate one of the uprights to allow easier access.
   Work as usual is getting in the way  :'(  so progress has slowed again, but lots of thinking time.
regards Derek.
Thanks for the update. Glad you managed to get the boards level.
Track soon?

  :hellosign: Really hope so Martin, have the list for the lower level ready for official approval
  regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 30, 2016, 10:12:01 pm
That's good news, Derek. You won't regret the extra work. I fully understand how work gets in the way of railway modelling!

With Jason's help, a short rake of Peco "Railfreight" goods stock for "through" running to Hood-dale and ("Tarpaulin" opens to Port Regleun, too) plus, when I slip into the BR Blue era, Cant Cove, is being assembled for you to run as soon as you have some tracks down! 8-)
:hellosign: Thanks Chris, look forward to through running very soon.
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 05, 2016, 01:36:03 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/45/4216-051116130237.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=45169)
 :hellosign: & Good afternoon everybody, above is my idea for the Helix.(s)
    The theory is all straight cuts keep it simple, 5mm ply for the base & using timber blocks for the spacers between the decks. The track will be Kato double 282/315mm viaduct the extra 62mm (also viaduct) track bring the radius to almost the same as ground level 348 & 315mm, with the added advantage of sidewalls for protection.
     I have a MDF board just waiting for experimental cutting although may look at threaded steel rods through the holes for the overhead catenery.
     Nothing new I know but having watched several You Tube videos & saved a fascinating article-" Sumida Crossing"   :hmmm: maybe don`t need a kit after all. Any & all suggestions or possible pitfalls most appreciated & thanks for looking
     regards Derek.
 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on November 05, 2016, 05:46:15 pm
You might find it easier to cut the inside as a hexagonal like the outside and have 6 smaller pieces rather than 3 much larger ones. Using threaded rod will make it much easier to adjust the gradient and I think you'll need some reinforcing as MDF could bend or warp. Not a helix expert but I'd use ply. Have fun making it! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 05, 2016, 06:00:09 pm
You should ask the 'Helix King', Derek: Maurits71
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1374 (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=1374)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 05, 2016, 11:12:21 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Brian & Chris, the idea for the Octagon was based purely on the 8 pieces of curved track to make the circle. I also envisaged cutting a full circle as one piece, may re-think, just need no rain to cut wood, will update as this develops
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 17, 2016, 04:24:04 pm
 :hellosign: All, been awhile but at last stopped thinking & now could be Some upon Ware. Today laid a loop of track- mostly Kato & now know why, so quick & simple to use. Had to fill the gap with Peco setrack & had very mixed results.
First up was Tomix Henry- the easiest box to open, not bad but really stuttered on the Peco section. Next up was my GF class 60 which although running light romped around with no problem-  :claphappy: well pleased.  :hmmm: Let`s try a DMU, my Dapol 5 car Super Voyager which although no problem on the Kato track De-railed & took a tumble on the Peco section & unfortunatly couldn`t stop the lead car hitting the floor. The front bogie took the brunt, but hopefully not terminally.  :'(    So lesson learned need more Kato track soon, will try for photos when better light
   regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 17, 2016, 04:59:46 pm
Many thanks for this update, Derek. Very sorry to read about your Voyager's tumble though. Always ahve protection along baseboard edges! I would avoid Peco Setrack though and only use Code 55 (it is possible to use with Kato, I understand, if you have card underneath the Peco track to raise it to the right height where they join).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 17, 2016, 11:07:01 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for your words of wisdom Chris, hopefully the Voyager is not damaged, all gone back together so first to run next shed time.
     The Setrack is two boxes of the Peco starter sets given as presents a few years ago, used briefly on the table before discovering I like long trains & needed more space. To align the track heights 3mm MDF was chosen, but alas no guard around the edges so have learned the hard way.
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 20, 2016, 05:39:45 pm
Glad you have managed a bit of running Derek. Hope the Voyager is ok.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 01, 2017, 01:03:09 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/46/4216-010117125701.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=46758)
Hellosign
A big happy New Year to all
    am trying to upload photos, if successful this should of Manchester Airport last September on the second leg of return from IOM.
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on January 01, 2017, 01:20:34 pm
I can see it just fine Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 01, 2017, 10:45:53 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for that Martin
         regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 05, 2017, 07:40:35 pm
 :hellosign: & Good evening, just a quick update. First & most important the Voyager seems to be running OK after a bit of TLC. Lesson learned we now have a continuous loop of Kato track running in a large dogbone around the shed to seriously test my stock & also sort any issues . More to follow with  photos (hopefully) soon
        regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on January 12, 2017, 07:06:14 am
Hi Derek. Lost track of your thread but found it again. Are you still going to make the helix? If so try threaded rod for the riser supports, neater and better than blocks and of course adjustable as well. Make sure you have a nut above and below each board and you can adjust easily. You may recall my first layout had a helix but I needed to start over with the main plan so the helix was abandoned in the replacement layout in favour of the newly manufactured Nelevator. All the best, George
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 12, 2017, 11:43:58 pm
 :hellosign:  Thanks for your imput George, it is really appreciated. I certainly intend on building a helix & latest idea is to use 1/8" threaded rods through Kato viaduct track. I have found a very interesting article about the layout Sumida Crossing & the helix featured looks amazing. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 11, 2017, 08:37:59 pm
 :hellosign: & a very Good Evening to everybody.   :sorrysign:  It has been a month since my last post, that  :censored: work just keeps getting in the way of serious play.  Still lot`s of thinking & planning time, just wish I had more than just a circle of track to show before now. My latest idea is the helix ( again, I want it right). 

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/48/4216-110217201441.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=48482)

   Hopefully is the latest rendition which at last has grown to sensible 1200x900 mm, using Kato viaduct track 381mm & 348mm "30" curves & then 4 186mm & 2 62mm straights to have a nice long run as I like long trains.
5mm ply will be cut in 4 pieces & assembled using eight 8mm threaded rods. The ply will be joined with small 3mm ply (the yellow squares) in the centres, the white circles represent the rods,  :hmmm: too big.
     Thanks for looking & as always comments &/or suggestions are more than welcome. & yes this is FUN too
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 11, 2017, 09:30:41 pm
Thanks for the update, Derek. We have two resident helix experts but I'm not one. However, it does look suitably impressive.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on February 11, 2017, 09:47:19 pm
8 or 10mm threaded rod is OK but I think 3mm ply is too thin. As Chris says, look at the helix threads, they have got it down to a fine art.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 11, 2017, 10:12:00 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening & thank you Chris & Brian.I have spent quite a long time looking at helix on the NGF & Youtube & thought yes I could build that, who needs an expensive kit  :-\  I kept the joining pieces down to 3mm to try & avoid height issues with tall trains, the level between decks is planned at 50mm. Thanks for looking
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on February 11, 2017, 10:48:58 pm
I wasn't thinking so much about kits, rather the ideas and construction methods used by others here on the forum. I think you would get better results if the helix was circular rather than oblong. There is too much stress introduced into the ply in your design, the ply will have a tendency to twist. I'll try and explain. If you take one edge of your designed board and keeping one edge horizontal and raise the board vertically, the face that is going to join the next piece will not be horizontal. It will have to be twisted slightly to become horizontal so that the next piece can start horizontal. This will happen for every piece of ply you use in the helix. The threaded rods are going to have to compensate for this twisting. Possibly the easiest way would be to use 6 pieces each of a length equal to the radius you want cut at 30º each end. this will cause much less twisting. I hope this helps or give food for thought. :)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 11, 2017, 11:11:47 pm
 :hellosign:   :thankyousign: Brian you are making good sense. My reasoning is to use oblongs it would be easier to stay square when joining sections together & my logic says only the first four boards would be twisted as hopefully the climb is then constant. I have looked at Michiel & Maurits helix on the NGF & hope to build something similar, as for kits expensive yes but could be a godsend, again many thanks for your imput, I will have a good think
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on February 12, 2017, 09:21:29 am
Sounds like a good idea Derek.
Work definitely gets in the way - hopefully you can engineer some modelling time soon.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 22, 2017, 08:22:40 pm
 :hellosign:  & Good Evening, finally found some shed play time today. The good news is GF in the shape of the the EWS class 60 romped around the Kato test circuit followed by the short (3+2) 125 set in Swallow livery. Then the first of my DMUs to make the grade was the First Scotrail 3 car 170, so very very pleased. Sorry no photos until more light is added, the test track is on the bottom level so very little natural light.
    Most important the first 1200x900mm board is ready for track, progress is slow at the moment  :sorrysign:  but will move soon
      regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on February 22, 2017, 08:25:06 pm
Many thanks for the update, Derek. I look forward to some photos. in due course.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: georgehgv on February 22, 2017, 08:33:20 pm
Many thanks for the update, Derek. I look forward to some photos. in due course.

Even a video? ;D
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on February 23, 2017, 09:21:23 pm
Many thanks for the update, Derek. I look forward to some photos. in due course.

Even a video? ;D
:hellosign:   Thanks Chris & George, will try to sort the lighting on next day off, then you never know
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 08, 2017, 12:39:02 pm
Good afternoon, Derek. I hope you're fine. I'm rather puzzled by the D that has just appeared?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 12:44:57 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for looking Chris I am trying again & failing  :dunce: to upload photos, I will persevere & be back soon
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 08, 2017, 01:00:39 pm
Hi Derek,

Don't Panic! They're a pain the backside. Take your time but very much looking forward to your progress (although NOT if it's more than mine  :D).

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 01:07:21 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Chris (weave) yes I thought I cracked it then downloads would`t upload. For various reasons progress has been slow but hopefully my latest ideas will soon come to fruition, thanks for your interest
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 08, 2017, 01:59:49 pm
Hi again,

I would love to help with your pic problems but apart from taking the pics in the first place and then adding the image from My pictures on Windows 7 I haven't a clue. I'm more of a station pilot at both ends with the 'Good Wife in I.T. Express' doing the long journey from Layout to Forum  :).

Anyway, good things come to those who wait.

Good luck and hope all goes well.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 08, 2017, 02:53:15 pm
Hopefully you get some pictures up soon Derek.
It's easy with the add image button just above the text box.
I'll send you a pm withdetails of how of you need.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 10:56:34 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/56/4216-081017225540.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=56472)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 11:10:15 pm
 :hellosign: Finally sussed the photo uploading. Many thanks Chris in Prague for the vast majority of the above wagons waiting patiently for track & traction. I have moved the track to the top level of the shelving so lots of natural light for photos of stock as the layout takes shape. Lots of ideas been formulated on "Scarm" so hoping to make a start before back to work on Tuesday, thanks for looking
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 11:12:35 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/56/4216-081017231215.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=56473)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 08, 2017, 11:13:41 pm
 :hellosign: Finally sussed the photo uploading. Many thanks Chris in Prague for the vast majority of the above wagons waiting patiently for track & traction. I have moved the track to the top level of the shelving so lots of natural light for photos of stock as the layout takes shape. Lots of ideas been formulated on "Scarm" so hoping to make a start before back to work on Tuesday, thanks for looking
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 09, 2017, 06:55:29 am
Morning Derek,

Glad you sussed the pics thing  :claphappy:, even my Mrs I.T. has trouble with it so thank you for those.

Sounds like the ball is rolling so looking forward to more.

I lose track of my own layouts, let alone others, so just seeing/ checking if you are still going ahead with the Porthsea Quay thing etc.? It's been a while and people change their minds. Not a problem, just asking.

Good luck with today's endeavours on your day off.

Cheers weave (no beers, just coffee for you!  :D)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 09, 2017, 08:24:35 am
Great to see some photos. up, Derek. Yes, there is a lot of BR, Continental, and "Castle Estates" goods stock running to and from West Porthsea Town & Quay, with the 'Ferry' stock running through to and from Britanny, France, and beyond. There are new BR Blue Class 04 diesel shunters on sale, new, for under GBP 60, to marshall those wagons and vans and take them to and from the Quay, if you don't already have one? Martin is also finishing his new PO livery goods stock and we've not forgotten you, so some can also appear on your layout, in due course, when you're ready.

I do hope that, after your long wait, you'll be able to get to work on the layout, very soon.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 09, 2017, 08:31:49 am
Good to see that you cracked the photo proble,m and great to see some progress.
Keep up the good work.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 09, 2017, 09:46:34 pm
Hello, thanks Chris (weave), Chris (I P) & Martin. Hopefully can make a serious start on the layout on my next day off, (today was family time). Work is a pain but means we can afford a few extras so I can live with it.
      The plans for the layout still very much involve West Porthsea in the mid to late 60s & have plans on Scarm  which I will share when I make definite progress. Sorry for being slow to start, thanks for your interest
         regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 09, 2017, 09:54:58 pm
We eagerly await the SCARM plan and tracklaying. I do appreciate that, like me, your spare time is very limited but all the long hours of work do help us to afford our hobby. I really admired the previous plans but I would imagine they might have been a little over-ambitious? Better to start simpler but leave room for adjustments before fixing anything firmly in place. BR in the 1960s was already rationalising trackwork.

If you cover from roughly 1960 to 1968, with a temporal extension into the 1970s and the BR Blue years, you should keep a lot of us very happy, Derek. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 09, 2017, 10:24:48 pm
Hello, Yes days off always seem few & far between especially as Steph (my good  lady) also works, so time together is precious.
       Having looked at my latest plans I am definitely thinking of steady expansion as at the moment everything will be concentrated in the small concrete shed (2.6x2.3m approx.)
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 20, 2017, 01:17:26 pm
 :hellosign: WOOD BUTCHERY COMMENCES. 
       Finally got some dry weather with a day off so have made a fresh start cutting the boards & hopefully learning from past mistakes. Photos & track plan soon as something to show. 
       Yes Chris (IP) always thinking big, but this time working in small carefully planned sections   :angel:
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Newportnobby on October 20, 2017, 02:00:57 pm
Finally got some dry weather

Dry weather? ??? Whassat?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 20, 2017, 02:14:24 pm
That's excellent news, Derek. I look forward to seeing some photos.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 20, 2017, 06:00:28 pm
Bit nasty weather wise at the moment Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 20, 2017, 06:20:07 pm
Bit nasty weather wise at the moment Derek.

I hope all will be well, there, Martin. Mainly cold and grey, here.

Looking forward to running 'through' trains, Derek. 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 21, 2017, 09:05:58 pm
Finally got some dry weather

Dry weather? ??? Whassat?
  :hellosign: OK Mick it was only for a few hours on Friday morning
Bit nasty weather wise at the moment Derek.

I hope all will be well, there, Martin. Mainly cold and grey, here.

Looking forward to running 'through' trains, Derek. 8-)
:hellosign: Storm Brian is making driving interesting this weekend.
     Thanks Chris & Martin for looking hope to show more soon
     regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 23, 2017, 10:12:35 pm
 :hellosign: Getting new gas boiler & pipes fitted so no more shed time, but have a Scarm plan idea which I think looks good so far

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-231017220104.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57138)
  The Pink boards are for West Porthsea Town Station, the idea is these are to be developed but also portable for future plans. The Red track is for exotic visitors only so will be hidden through the station. The small Blue curve is where the line round to West Porthsea Quay station leaves the main line. As always comments &/or suggestions are more than welcome.
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on October 23, 2017, 10:19:59 pm
Derek

Is the Quay station for passenger traffic?

Best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 23, 2017, 10:45:42 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for looking, sorry I didn`t explain my plans more fully. The Quay station will be for both goods & passenger traffic to load on the train ferry to Brittany & also passenger ferries to the Channel Islands from a fictional location in South West Cornwall imagined close to the old Marazion Station.
     I will post a Scarm plan for the Quay station shortly & hopefully try & explain so it all makes sense. 
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 23, 2017, 11:54:28 pm
 :hellosign: As promised the latest idea for West Porthsea Quay Station.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-231017233951.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57141)
On pink boards again as the idea is to develop then be able to split & insert a further board to gain protypical length for the Quayside. These boards will be at least 50mm above the track on the left hand side of the layout, hense the need for a long steady slope, hope this all makes sense. Sorry as I have not yet updated Scarm to full capacity they are separate plans
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 24, 2017, 07:58:13 am
Thanks a lot for the plan updates, Derek. I think they are very reasonable in that they won't take too much time to achieve but still leave room for further developments. Of course, I particularly like West Porthsea Quay Station and hope that it won't take too long before that is ready to accept trains.  8-)

How many coaches long is the platform in the main station, please? (I suddenly had an idea that the main station trackplan could be modified to be like Exeter Central with central crossovers (see photo. in the link below) half-way along to allow trains to be split and joined. One portion would go to / from West Porthsea Quay and the other the WR mainline, including, via Truro, to Newquay, Port Perran, Trepol Bay, Wadebridge and Penmayne (calling at Cant Cove).

http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/gallery/exeter-suburbs/exeter-central-35025.jpg (http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/gallery/exeter-suburbs/exeter-central-35025.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on October 24, 2017, 09:57:06 am
Morning Derek,

Glad your making some headway. All looking good.

 Because I'm doing the Principat d'Izaro layout (slowly) at the moment, the Port de Regleun Brittany one is further behind than yours but I hope to make a start in January as should be having an ankle operation then which means I probably won't be able to get under the Izaro board with my ski boot thing for 3 months but if I get organised beforehand I can work on the Brittany port as easily accessible (if I can get up the stairs  :D).

Looking forward to more of your plans. I'm going to have to plan mine very carefully due to space restrictions.

Hopefully we can both have the ferry service up and running next year.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on October 24, 2017, 09:09:53 pm
:hellosign: Thanks for looking, sorry I didn`t explain my plans more fully. The Quay station will be for both goods & passenger traffic to load on the train ferry to Brittany & also passenger ferries to the Channel Islands from a fictional location in South West Cornwall imagined close to the old Marazion Station.
     I will post a Scarm plan for the Quay station shortly & hopefully try & explain so it all makes sense. 
      regards Derek.

Hello Derek

I think that it might be helpful to have a crossover at the right hand end of the platforms so that trains for the branch can use the 'correct' up and down platforms in the through station.  Chris (in Prague) has an even better and more elegant idea in a later post!

Or... placing the junction on the single line after the loop points has the same effect.  Dingwall is a good example of this.  Crianlarich, too, but with an island platform.

All the very best.

John

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 24, 2017, 11:50:35 pm
Hello & good evening, thank you Chris (IP), Chris (Weave) & John I have had a very busy day so will be checking out these interesting ideas when next on Scarm (on my PC tomorrow evening) any suggestions are always welcome
     regards Derek.0
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 25, 2017, 02:48:29 pm
John's solution would be simpler and cheaper, Derek. I just like the look of those crossover points that used to grace Exeter Central. More fun for shunting stock, too! Once train portions were no longer divided and added (as they had been in BR SR days), the WR soon removed them and installed a simpler track layout.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on October 25, 2017, 10:00:04 pm
John's solution would be simpler and cheaper, Derek. I just like the look of those crossover points that used to grace Exeter Central. More fun for shunting stock, too! Once train portions were no longer divided and added (as they had been in BR SR days), the WR soon removed them and installed a simpler track layout.

The P Way people don't like scissors crossovers.  I understand that, for years, the operators had to fight hard to keep the one at the east end of Platform 11 at Waverley.  But they were proved right and there is now another one at the remodelled (with additional platforms) North Side of the station.  It is always fun to run over it, particularly on a down HST bound for Aberdeen.   As Chris (IP) says, they look good, too!

All the best.

John

 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 25, 2017, 11:38:51 pm
Thanks a lot for the plan updates, Derek. I think they are very reasonable in that they won't take too much time to achieve but still leave room for further developments. Of course, I particularly like West Porthsea Quay Station and hope that it won't take too long before that is ready to accept trains.  8-)

How many coaches long is the platform in the main station, please? (I suddenly had an idea that the main station trackplan could be modified to be like Exeter Central with central crossovers (see photo. in the link below) half-way along to allow trains to be split and joined. One portion would go to / from West Porthsea Quay and the other the WR mainline, including, via Truro, to Newquay, Port Perran, Trepol Bay, Wadebridge and Penmayne (calling at Cant Cove).

[url]http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/gallery/exeter-suburbs/exeter-central-35025.jpg[/url] ([url]http://www.avocetline.org.uk/wp-content/gallery/exeter-suburbs/exeter-central-35025.jpg[/url])

 :hellosign: Thanks for the photo Chris, agreed crossovers look go am looking at incorperating in on the next idea. The platforms will take around 7 coaches + loco so with a little  :hmmm:
     
:hellosign: Thanks for looking, sorry I didn`t explain my plans more fully. The Quay station will be for both goods & passenger traffic to load on the train ferry to Brittany & also passenger ferries to the Channel Islands from a fictional location in South West Cornwall imagined close to the old Marazion Station.
     I will post a Scarm plan for the Quay station shortly & hopefully try & explain so it all makes sense. 
      regards Derek.


Hello Derek

I think that it might be helpful to have a crossover at the right hand end of the platforms so that trains for the branch can use the 'correct' up and down platforms in the through station.  Chris (in Prague) has an even better and more elegant idea in a later post!

Or... placing the junction on the single line after the loop points has the same effect.  Dingwall is a good example of this.  Crianlarich, too, but with an island platform.

All the very best.

John
 :hellosign: Thanks John
     regards Derekl.

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 26, 2017, 10:45:29 am
Thanks, Derek. I believe Peco make a scissors crossing in N Gauge. Trains could be in 4- and 3-coach portions or, off-season, 3- and 2-coach portions.

Some possibilities are:

BCK, BSK (especially for overnight parcels / mail / newspapers), may also work through to West Porthsea Quay with added parcels stock, such as an SR or BR CCT.

Portions NOT going through to / from West Porthsea Quay:
BSK, CK, BSK
BSK, SK, BCK
BSK, SK, CK, BSK
BSK, SK, CK, BCK

BSK, SK, CK, SK, BSK (substitute a RMB Mini Buffet for a SK for trains travelling longer distances)

Plus various longer formations, without a portion to / from West Porthsea Quay (substitute a RMB Mini Buffet for a SK) such as:

BSK, 4 SK, 1 CK, BCK
BCK, 5 SK, BCK (for excursions)
BCK, 3 SK, BCK, BG (luggage)
BCK, 2 SK, 1 CK, 1 SK, BSK
BSK, 2 SK, 2 CK, 1 SK, BSK

If you want to run a full Restaurant Car (RU) then substitute the RU for one of the SKs, at peak times also add an SO or RFO (for prestige trains), (less likely a FO) for serving meals, and take out a SK or the second CK.

The West Porthsea Quay portions would be:
BCK, SK
BSK, CK
BSK, CK, SK
BCK, BSK (especially for overnight parcels / mail / newspapers), may also work through to West Porthsea Quay with added parcels stock, such as an SR or BR CCT.
BSK, CK, SK, BG / GUV (for parcels / mail / luggage)
BCK, SK, BG / GUV / Siphon G / Fruit D / SR or BR CCT (especially for overnight parcels / mail / newspapers)

For peak times and through trains:
BSK, SK, CK, SK
BSK, SK, CK, BCK
BSK, SK, CK, SK, BSK
BSK, SK, CK, SK, BCK

The Mini Buffet and Restaurant Car sets would be unlikely to work through to West Porthsea Quay except in through / special trains.

Most would be WR mainline services but some portions / shorter rakes (usually, 1 off-season (BCK); 2-3 coaches) could be WR from Wadebridge / Port Perran, Newquay, Truro; and some SR from Penmayne, Wadebridge / Trepol Bay, Newquay, Truro.

Special trains could, of course, come from anywhere in the UK or the Continent (UK Loading Gauge stock, which Continental N Gauge stock, being smaller, usually is.)

The 'Wagons Lit' train would be formed of a CIWL Sleeping Car (may not run off season), CIWL Saloon, CIWL Dining Car, and BR BCK (could be alternate days SR or WR which would not be loaded onto the train ferry). If there was a lot of luggage / mail, a Continental / CIWL Luggage Van would also be added at the other end. At peak times a BR SK could be added in front of the BCK, (again, could be alternate days SR or WR and would not be loaded onto the train ferry).

Hope this helps.

BR, Chris (in Prague)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 26, 2017, 10:07:53 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Chris for lots of information & ideas
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 27, 2017, 07:16:57 am
:hellosign: Many thanks Chris for lots of information & ideas
    regards Derek.

My pleasure, Derek. The scissors crossing should be able to cope with adding / separating a 3-coach 'Quay' portion to / from a 4-coach 'through' one.

Best regards,
Chris
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 27, 2017, 11:17:34 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-271017230631.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57412)
 :hellosign:   Hopefully above you see my latest plan for West Porthsea Town Station, the most important I am now thinking today & not next year. The station buildings either in the foreground or possibly on a bridge over around the scissor crossover  :hmmm: .  The furthest line on the right is the branch round & up to the Quay station. Comments & suggestions are more than welcome
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on October 28, 2017, 08:45:03 am
Derek, I think that this is a splendid plan and will give you hours of fun.  I assume that it is now a double-track main line.  This will be terrific for just watching the trains go by.

Maybe one suggestion.  The platform at the top of the layout would make a good platform for certain local trains to the Quay Station, if you reversed the arrangement and had its turnout off the Quay branch.  Then turntable to the left and engine sidings (?) to the right - the mirror image of what you have at present.

That would give four main traffic flows:-

Main Line Up/Down
Main Line to Quay Branch
Quay Branch to Main Line
West Porthsea Town to Quay local service.

Plus, maybe, one little fun extra - assumes no turntable at the Quay Station - tender locomotives working through to the Quay Branch off the Main Line reverse light engine to West Portsea Town to turn and take water (maybe coal as well).  Having the points at the right hand end would let you complete this movement while trains run along both Main Lines.  At present, access to the turntable is from a main line.

It might be worth drawing it to see if any of the above rambling makes sense.

This is certainly my kind of layout - lots of 'play value' if you will kindly forgive my use of that phrase.

Best wishes.

John

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on October 28, 2017, 09:26:37 am
Looks good Derek.
The only very small item that I might add is a short siding to house a station pilot or standby locomotive.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 28, 2017, 11:16:35 am
I fully agree with John's very detailed suggestions and Martin's excellent addition. You would have to move the Town station more to the left and, perhaps, the crossover, too, as the Quay branch would then be to the right. I would recommend taking Exeter Central as your inspiration for buildings. It had a very distinctive goods shed, for example, which would not be particularly difficult to model (not exactly, of course). I would have the main station buildings on the platform at the bottom as this has room for an approach road. Access to the goods yard and loco. turntable, etc, could be by road underpasses (for which you'd have to allow cutouts in the baseboard, of course).

Exeter Central goods shed and yard:
http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_01_2013/post-7081-0-41957000-1358794882.jpg (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_01_2013/post-7081-0-41957000-1358794882.jpg)

Exeter Central station exterior:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bb/2008_at_Exeter_Central_station_-_Queen_Street_entrance.jpg (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bb/2008_at_Exeter_Central_station_-_Queen_Street_entrance.jpg)

As the Quay Station would not have a turntable, coaling or watering (or diesel fuelling), (no space), just a set of points allowing loco. release, John's suggestion is a great one. Weymouth Town and Weymouth Quay operated in just this way with coaling, watering, and diesel fuelling facilities all being at Weymouth Town MPD. Steam lasting there until 1967, I think. You may need to add a coaling and watering siding and one for diesel fuelling (this might be a loop line at the very top) to which could be added a short loco. stabling siding to show off your locos.! 8-) The station pilot could 'rest' there, too, and, being a loop line, would not be 'trapped' behind other stabled locos.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 28, 2017, 10:55:38 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks John, Martin & Chris for your very helpful imput.
       John, yes the plan is a double main line as I also like just watch the trains go by, but a little shunting is also fun so I am trying to operate the best of both. In my previous plans I was too ambitious in thinking too far ahead, but funny enough I originally had the station facing in the opposite direction as you suggest, the problem being I need a long run to gain height for the branch line as it will be 50mm above the lines on the left side. Hope all this makes sense
       Martin & Chris, I have put in the top left hand sidings thinking of coal, water & fuel, maybe another siding with shed for the shunter?
         Thank you Chris for the photos, lots of inspiration from Exeter Central, & also yes operating very similar to Weymouth/ Weymouth Quay is the plan.
       regards Derek.   
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 28, 2017, 11:29:21 pm
It's my pleasure, as always, Derek. If you want to have a small loco. shed it would, probably, be a modernised brickbuilt steam era one, like at Worcester Shrub Hill from the 1960s (but smaller) or, like at Exeter one with the roof removed but, again, smaller.

http://www.derbysulzers.com/46052exetershed83.jpg (http://www.derbysulzers.com/46052exetershed83.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 28, 2017, 11:52:08 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for the photo Chris, yes a little smaller but spot on
             regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on October 29, 2017, 08:56:59 am
In my previous plans I was too ambitious in thinking too far ahead, but funny enough I originally had the station facing in the opposite direction as you suggest, the problem being I need a long run to gain height for the branch line as it will be 50mm above the lines on the left side.

Many thanks, Derek (and Martin - your suggestion for a siding for the station pilot is excellent).

Sorry, my ramblings were not clearer, I didn't propose having the station facing the other way - only the access to the turntable and the sidings.  Instead of having the turnout giving access to the turntable and sidings on the main line at the left-hand side of the station, as per the plan, I wondered if you could have the turnout on the branch line (which I assume is the outside track on the right-hand side).  Looking at this again, I think I would keep the sidings where they are and put the turntable below them, there seems to be lots of space.  That might give room for a siding for the pilot roughly where the turntable is now.

I hope this is a little clearer.

All the very best.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 29, 2017, 10:20:07 am
Good morning, Derek, finally, I managed to find a photo. of the modernised loco. shed at Worcester in the diesel era. The side windows were bricked up and a new corrugated roof with skylights fitted. A single or twin-road (maybe with one entrance bricked up like the third one at Worcester) shed like this should be ideal. You can adjust the length and width to fit the space and with plastic brick sheets, plastic brick arches and plastic corrugated sheets plus some clear plasticard for the skylights, it would not be difficult to build nor to fit LED strip lighting under the centre of the roof for interior illumination. You could also add a side-lighted inspection pit on one road and raised access on the other (like the converted works at Newton Abbot).

Worcester shed building in the diesel era.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6055/6344657954_c3b7878ac6_b.jpg (https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6055/6344657954_c3b7878ac6_b.jpg)

Newton Abbot diesel shed interior (a converted steam loco. works):

https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3321/3305307840_a15fe7f813.jpg (https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3321/3305307840_a15fe7f813.jpg)

If space is very limited a single road shed built of corrugated sheets like the steam era one at Lyme Regis would also look good:

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/55/58/b8/5558b8aa9f59dfb5132e4d8326e94fa1--steam-locomotive-british-rail.jpg (https://i.pinimg.com/736x/55/58/b8/5558b8aa9f59dfb5132e4d8326e94fa1--steam-locomotive-british-rail.jpg)

Another possibility, using local stone and a tile roof, plus a turntable, diesel fuelling, coal stage and water tower -- all in a compact space -- would be Swanage:

http://www.seiryu.org.uk/ppp/swanage-2/sr-05.jpg (http://www.seiryu.org.uk/ppp/swanage-2/sr-05.jpg)

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0c/b9/07/0cb907f3c49052c0ee5a7c03b139daf6.jpg (https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0c/b9/07/0cb907f3c49052c0ee5a7c03b139daf6.jpg)

The same in BR SR days:
https://photos.smugmug.com/Infrastructure/60s-Infrastructure/i-BMRzP79/2/6842aa94/L/Aug%201962-Engine%20shed-Swanage%20%282%29-L.jpg (https://photos.smugmug.com/Infrastructure/60s-Infrastructure/i-BMRzP79/2/6842aa94/L/Aug%201962-Engine%20shed-Swanage%20%282%29-L.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 29, 2017, 08:50:38 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks John, your thoughts & ideas are more than welcome, the placing of the turntable seemed to make sense to turn locos, but as you say I do have lots of space in the top l/h corner  :hmmm: I feel a need for Scarm time

 :hellosign:  :thankyousign: again Chris for the excellent photos, Swanage is a true lesson in no wasted space. 
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on October 31, 2017, 11:54:27 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-311017234950.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57541)
 :hellosign: & good evening, lots happening at home so only had time to have a go with moving the turntable & adding the siding on the branch for the shunter, as always suggestions are more than welcome
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on November 01, 2017, 07:35:54 am
Derek

That is looking good.  If you can imagine connecting the siding off the branch to the loop behind the station you will pretty much have what I was thinking of.  Local trains will run off the branch and use the 'back platform' and the locomotive will run round etc, whilst the expresses thunder through the station (and the locals stop!) at the same time.  And as Chris (IP) suggests, you will also be able to split through trains at the main platform with a portion continuing on to the branch. 

Four main main patterns of movement with a fifth as the light engine workings off the branch if you fancy.

In my thinking (or what passes for thinking) I hadn't envisaged retaining the connection from the main line to the back platform, but seeing it in your plan, I think it could be fun.  You could even have a train off the branch arriving in the main platform whilst an express (or a goods train) runs through the station on the 'centre road'.  Retaining the connection to the 'back loops' would allow a run round.   

This is a super plan - so many possibilities...

With best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 01, 2017, 08:22:56 am
Good morning, I agree with John's recommendations, Derek. I would make one further change and that is to move the crossover in the station more to the left (about where a four-coach section would end and a three-coach section begin).

I envisage the back siding to be used to stable locomotives and / or rolling stock (such as for parcels and mail) for use, later.

The station pilot can still stable at the end of the right-hand headshunt.

The only omission I can think of is a bay platform for mail / parcels coaches to be loaded and loaded by 'Royal Mail' road vehicles. Maybe, at the end of the botton right-hand platform? This would add to the operating fun.

One last point, road access to the station could be a level crossing at the left-hand side after the points at the bottom of the left pink-coloured board. This could be inspired by Red Cow level crossing at Exeter St Davids.

http://www.roscalen.com/signals/Exeter/8410/1101.jpg (http://www.roscalen.com/signals/Exeter/8410/1101.jpg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 02, 2017, 09:21:25 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks John & Chris, sorry for not replying sooner.
       I like your ideas John for the branch line, it would certainly add lots of possibilities for operation, although the plan is to terminate at the quay station & because of space restraints this will have to be above (the main line in tunnel). Therefore I plan to run a long gradual slope (the Blue track) to gain the neccesary 50mm.
         Thanks Chris the level crossing for the L/H corner is a really excellent suggestion & many thanks for superb photo. I placed the scissor crossover at R/H side so enabling through trains to serve the platform & also goods trains have a direct run to the branch, my thinking would also allow passenger trains from the branch on to the correct platform. Hope this makes sense, & thank you for your imput gentlemen it is very much appreciated,
         regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 03, 2017, 10:00:46 am
Thanks, Derek, that makes very good sense.

A level crossing would be much easier than a road underbridge and I've always liked level crossings.

Regarding the crossover points, it would still be possible to split / combine trains and that is always interesting.

Regarding my suggested bay platform, it looks like there would be room to add a point plus a short length of track?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 03, 2017, 09:44:33 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks again Chris your imput is really useful, totally agreed about splitting & combining.  :hmmm: Thinking maybe add an extra platform at the top with a short spur for the mail trains? looking at the bottom would it take up space for the station access road?. I did many moons ago worked for the GPO so yes that would look good.
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 04, 2017, 09:15:01 am
Good morning, Derek,

I was thinking that the bay platform could be located inset into the right-hand end of the lower platform as there is slightly more room there. Alternatively, it could be inset into the left-hand end of the lower platform. As it would be inset, it would not take up space for the station access road and, especially, on the right-hand end of the lower platform, would be easily accessible from Station Road.

It could be, literally, inset into the middle of the left-hand end of the lower platform, like the bottom right-hand bay platform at Worcester Shrub Hill station or a cutback section, the former left-hand bay platform, there, see diagram, below, depending on the width of the platform. However, an arrangement like the former left-hand bay platform would work, too.

http://www.dudleymall.co.uk/loclrail/worshrub.gif (http://www.dudleymall.co.uk/loclrail/worshrub.gif)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 04, 2017, 09:57:58 pm
 :hellosign:  :thankyousign:  That makes loads of sense Chris, should not be a problem, back on SCARM very soon
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 05, 2017, 09:20:49 pm
AS always, my pleasure, Derek. Looking forward to the next SCARM update.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 09, 2017, 10:22:45 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-091117220816.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57956)
 :hellosign: & good evening, this the latest idea for West Porthsea Town Station. The most obvious difference is the move to the right & curved platforms to gain space on the left, I have included a level crossing on the left as access to the station forecourt. Again the Blue track is the start of the branch line to the Quay Station, still on a long steady slope. As always any comments or suggestions are more than welcome
      More importantly shed time today & we now have the 3 boards cut, braced  & awaiting foam & track for the main station, photos to follow
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 10, 2017, 07:50:35 am
Thanks for the update, Derek. That looks good.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on November 10, 2017, 08:07:57 am
Thanks for the update, Derek. That looks good.

Seconded!

Best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on November 10, 2017, 12:15:12 pm
Looks good to me too.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on November 10, 2017, 05:35:40 pm
And me too. Lots of play value there :) Sorry, a very interesting track layout. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 10, 2017, 07:28:49 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Chris, John, Martin & Brian for the positive responses it is appreciated, best crack on & with the build now   :thankyousign:
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 10, 2017, 08:02:26 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-101117193753.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57973)
 :hellosign: As promised photos from the shed it
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-101117194100.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57974)

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/57/4216-101117194249.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=57975)
The first two the main boards for the station 1200x450 5mm ply with 18mm bracing for strength. The 3rd photo shows location of the removable board across the doorway regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 10, 2017, 08:20:05 pm
Thanks, Derek. Looking good. You must be pleased. I do hope that you can ensure that those boards are absolutely flat before you commence tracklaying and the shed is not subject to large changes in temperature that might cause problems after track is laid? N Gauge rolling stock easily derails if the surface track is laid on is not flat.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 10, 2017, 11:19:14 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks for the warning Chris I am not rushing this time so hopefully all will run well. The shed only gets full sunlight on summer evenings so heat is not a problem. So far the cold does not seem to be affecting the ply (from B&Q) but will certainly keep an eye out as construction continues, I have a heater on standby if needed.
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on November 11, 2017, 12:13:38 am
Hi Derek,

I don't know but perhaps Chris (IP) was slightly concerned, as I was, about the bubble reading on your boat level in the first pic (unless you wanted a slope?). Saying that, those boat levels can be lying little b*ggers at times but I hope you've got a normal long spirit level for the boards.

 Do not rely on boat levels, they cannot be trusted. It's not their fault, they're just missing their mates, the bricks.

All looking good though and glad your making progress. Keep up the good work.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 11, 2017, 09:21:09 am
Hi Derek,

I don't know but perhaps Chris (IP) was slightly concerned, as I was, about the bubble reading on your boat level in the first pic (unless you wanted a slope?). Saying that, those boat levels can be lying little b*ggers at times but I hope you've got a normal long spirit level for the boards.

 Do not rely on boat levels, they cannot be trusted. It's not their fault, they're just missing their mates, the bricks.

All looking good though and glad your making progress. Keep up the good work.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Thanks, Chris (Weave), for pointing that out. The slightest imperfection in the track can set up oscillations in trains passing over it which, then, can cause derailments. Before any permanent tracklaying, it is essential to lay track and run as many different trains and watch closely. It is well worth taking it slowly, Derek, rather than have to relay track later (usually in the most awkward location).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 11, 2017, 04:37:39 pm
As I understand it, Derek, the plan is that many trains (both passenger and goods) combine / split portions at West Porthsea station, with one portion going to / from West Porthsea Quay for the train ferry and cargo ships; some trains travelling direct along the WR mainline to Truro and beyond but others traveling via Chacewater (about 3 miles east of Redruth; about 6 miles west of Truro), to Port Perran, Newquay, Trepol Bay, Wadebridge and Penmayne (some calling at Cant Cove).
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 11, 2017, 10:53:45 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Chris (Weave), shows what I know about spirit levels, must buy a long one before track laying   :thankyousign:
  :hellosign: Interesting thoughts Chris (IP) I originally planned the boat train (passenger & freight) on one dock & another along side with a small platform leading to passenger facilities for boarding passenger ships (possibly Channel Islands). Then  :idea: another dockside area for freight (cranes for containers direct ship to train).  At the moment the plan for the Quay is nice & simple but that could change  :D always open to suggestions.
     The position of West Portsea Town is (possibly) about 2 miles East of Penzance so WR mainline services will feature along with local stoppers heading via St Agnes to the North Coast.  I feel most West bound trains will call at West Porthsea Town then either carry on to the Quay station or terminate in Penzance. Again always open to ideas or suggestions.
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on November 11, 2017, 11:52:18 pm
Hi Derek,

Firstly, regarding spirit levels, even just a cheapy 2ft one should do but don't drop them, ever!  :no:, they don't like it  :no:.

Moving on, please keep West Porthsea where you have said as then we're all on the same page.

I presume you've been reading the geography lesson on Martin's thread but have found another map which includes where Chris (IP)'s layout is (although fictional) and also might help more with further afield destinations....

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c8/GWR_map_Cornwall.jpg

I think I've got the North Cornwall route sorted but we have to think of other routes too (the burden of being ferry port managers  :)).

The reason I'm trying to get my head together as to where everything is, is because of a new thread, tomorrow I hope, of a Brittany hoverport layout while Port Regleun is on hold. Here endeth the hijack.

Good luck with the board building.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 12, 2017, 12:01:35 am
 :hellosign: No problem Chris, West Porthsea Quay is on the South Coast about 2 miles East of Penzance. Interesting a Hoverport terminal, look forward to more.
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on November 12, 2017, 12:47:14 am
Hi Derek,

The hoverport will only serve local islands and Jersey/Guernsey but will be round the point from Port Regleun and will have a terminus station which can be linked with boat trains and train ferry 'through' coaches and wagons from there.

It's an old 5' x 3' (now 6' x 3') layout that I'm resurrecting. Due to the probable house move it's all I can do to perhaps finish (ha ha), nearly finish a layout and have scenarios with proper pics etc. I want Port Regleun to be bigger than this one and can't tear up Izaro at the moment. Too many things up in the air. However, still want the 'through' runnings.

Hope to explain all very soon.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on November 12, 2017, 08:58:57 am
:hellosign: No problem Chris, West Porthsea Quay is on the South Coast about 2 miles East of Penzance. Interesting a Hoverport terminal, look forward to more.
    regards Derek.
Thank you for confirming the location Derek.
Can I just ask, does Penzance still exist in your thoughts? Or is Porthsea the end of the line?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on November 12, 2017, 09:13:56 am
Hi Martin,

That's a very good question. Although I love the station at Penzance it would probably help all train operations if it didn't exist methinks maybe, not sure,  :hmmm:

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 12, 2017, 09:45:13 am
Thanks, Chris (Weave) and Derek. The map is good for showing the lines in Cornwall which really existed plus finding where the additional lines in our 'Alternative Cornwall' are located.

I would imagine that Penzance would still be the end of the (G)WR mainline but some long-distance trains might well terminate at West Porthsea if it was a major town with an important port, stabling sidings and a motive power depot. A connecting auto train or, later, diesel railcar / DMU shuttle, could, off-peak, take passengers to and from West Porthsea. BR WR in the 1960s could then rationalise Penzance and sell off the surplus land.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 12, 2017, 10:10:42 am
I now have both "Railway Centres: No. 2 EXETER CENTRAL Summer Saturday: 1961" and the larger "Operation Cornwall: Summer Weekday & Summer Saturday Passenger Services: 1957" which covers Plymouth to Penzance and all Cornish branches as well as the editions covering North Cornwall and North Devon (the latter scanned as I sold the actual book). So, I can work out (later) which services would be likely to call at West Porthsea (and connections with them) prior to the major changes in 1962. After 1962, with dieselisation in the Southwest and rationalisation of services and infrastructure, services are greatly reduced. Of course, how reduced is up to us!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 12, 2017, 10:26:45 pm
:hellosign: No problem Chris, West Porthsea Quay is on the South Coast about 2 miles East of Penzance. Interesting a Hoverport terminal, look forward to more.
    regards Derek.
Thank you for confirming the location Derek.
Can I just ask, does Penzance still exist in your thoughts? Or is Porthsea the end of the line?
:hellosign: A very good point Chris (Weave) & Martin, My original thoughts were to have terminus station with a tramway link to the quayside thinking similar to Weymouth, however I started  :hmmm: again (dangerous) & as I like to watch trains go by when the mood takes me I have arrived at the present plan.
     :hellosign:   Interesting thoughts Chris (IP), making West Porthsea Quay an important port would be very plausible, am  :hmmm: something similar to Paignton, A terminus with a branch line extension. Would be most grateful for suggestions.
      Also look forward to your timetable ideas Chris (IP),
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 13, 2017, 07:54:20 am
Good morning, Derek. If the WR mainline continues from West Porthsea to Penzance, you'll be able to watch trains go by (which is an excellent idea). The question is whether that mainline would be single or double-track between the two towns? That's up to you. But given how close the two towns are, I would expect it to be single-track. However, the mainline from the East into West Porthsea would be likely to be double-track. So, you can have a major through station (where some trains terminate and commence) together with a tramway link to the quayside, similar to Weymouth.

Based on trains timetabled to / from Penzance and Truro, I can work out the times of trains at West Porthsea around the late 1950s / early 1960s period.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 13, 2017, 09:25:48 pm
 :hellosign: & good evening Chris, thanks for your detailed suggestions. I agree the main line East will definitly be double track, still mulling over single or double to Penzance. As you rightly point out 2 mile single track would be most likely, certainly after Beechings Axe. Will have a updated station plan soon.
           regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on November 13, 2017, 09:31:24 pm
Looking forward to seeing this develop into reality. The local preservation group here were talking about a rail trip France and eventually Spain and thinking about next year as a possibility.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 13, 2017, 09:42:17 pm
 :hellosign: good evening Brian, will sure try to make this happen, sooner the better. Not a lot of spare time at the moment but I do look forward to through running & we certainly woudn`t want to disappoint the preservation group
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 13, 2017, 10:02:32 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-131117215911.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58099)
 :hellosign: Just a small adjustment to the station plan sees a short extension to the bottom platform & the West bound track is now singled
    regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 14, 2017, 08:42:40 pm
Thanks for the latest update, Derek. There is plenty of operating interest with this station. The time period that you plan to set West Porthsea in will have a big effect on the timetable planning.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on November 15, 2017, 07:59:45 pm
Hi Derek,
Just a small suggestion, rather than having the crossover in the platform for the link to the turntable line, how about using a left hand and right hand point as shown in my dodgy edited copy of your plan?  Only a suggestion of course, but does avoid having a turnout in the platform.

John

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4449-151117195207.jpeg)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 15, 2017, 10:52:47 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks John (25901JFM),  I will have a serious   :hmmm: about moving the crossover as it would gain valuable space on the platforms
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 19, 2017, 08:07:06 pm
Hi Derek,
Just a small suggestion, rather than having the crossover in the platform for the link to the turntable line, how about using a left hand and right hand point as shown in my dodgy edited copy of your plan?  Only a suggestion of course, but does avoid having a turnout in the platform.

John

([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4449-151117195207.jpeg[/url])

 :hellosign: Thanks John (25901JFM) your suggestion really inspired me to look again & although the point is roughly in the same place I feel I have made significant improvements. The boards are cut so the shape stays, here hopefully is the update

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-191117194818.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58327)
Most important all the points are now the shorter No4s so saving valuable space & although we have one less point I have added another scissor crossover on the East side. The Post Office/ newspapers have a shed at the East side of the lower plaform (No1) with the West side for local stoppers. The centre platform (2) is also bi-directional, for long distance services & all passenger services to/from West Porthsea Quay. Leaving the top platform (3) for all terminating services & access to the turntable & fueling facilities.
    Thanks for looking & any & all suggestions are more than welcome
        regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 19, 2017, 08:37:21 pm
Thanks for the latest update. Saving a point is good and there is now a siding off the running line for post, parcels, and newspapers. However, I'd move just the crossover about half-way along so that trains can be split / combined (3 + 4 coach portions) as we originally discussed, like at Exeter Central. But, John, sees these things better than I. (I just like Exeter Central, as it once was.)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 19, 2017, 09:35:46 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Chris, your suggestions are more than welcome. My way of splitting trains would be from the West; Shunter arrives from Quay Station in to platform 2 with 3/4 coaches stopping under footbridge ensuring rear coach is clear of scissor crossing. Uncouples & via crossovers moves over to platform 1. The through portion arrives from Penzance & takes the centre track & when clear of scissor crossover can reverse onto the stationary coaches, couple up & be ready for departure. The shunter can then using westerly point & scissor crossover can stand on the very start of the branch awaiting his next train.
    From the East trains for splitting arrive at platform 2 stopping just before the crossover, & when the 3/4 rearmost coaches are un-coupled the train departs for Penzance. The shunter couples up the remaining coaches & takes the branch line to the Quay Station.
     Sorry for being so long winded but hope all makes sense
      regards Derek.   
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 19, 2017, 09:43:47 pm
Ah! Thank you, Derek, that all makes excellent sense. That will indeed be great fun to operate. I'm just obsessed with Exeter Central which had a different layout for a good reason as trains arrived and departed differently to at West Porthsea! 8-)
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on November 20, 2017, 01:20:53 pm
Hi Derek, I was thinking more of the back platform and the connection for the turntable line which hasn't changed on your new plan.  I like Chris in Prague's line of thought for the scissors crossover mid way along the main platform as in Exeter Central and indeed on the GW at Newton Abbot for trains that detach portions. 
I'm not to sure about your Post Office siding, it may prove difficult to shunt?  I think I prefer the bay platform in the previous plan as a place for loading / unloading the vans.
At the end of the day though it is what works for you that counts.  Beware of using Kato No.4 points though.  I'm not a Kato user, but there have been quite a few comments on the forum regarding them and various steam loco's not liking them (derailments).
Good Luck.
John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 21, 2017, 09:35:09 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening John (25901JFM) many thanks, your thoughts inspired the recent changes, although the top crossover stays for now, & it is a "No 4" never say never. "Kato 6s" all around would take an awful lot more space & no scissor crossover but my original plan had "6s" wherever possible so again the jury is out.  :hmmm: maybe just one crossover in the centre could work, want to order track soon so final decision time sooner
      regards Derek.














0
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 26, 2017, 12:51:40 pm
 :hellosign: Good Afternoon, been doing lots of  :hmmm: & looking at the GWR between Long Rock Depot & Penzance Station, (meal break walks) &  admire how simple but effective is the layout. So I have decided to simplfy West Porthsea Town Station, here is latest ideas

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-261117115340.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58566)
First off we have lost the middle track & the scissor crossover but added an extra platform & Carriage sidings in the large space in the top L/H corner thus re-locating the turntable back over to the Right. The single track approach is very much inspired by Long Rock Crossing & most points again "Kato 4s" but importantly it is possible to convert to "6s" all round if there is a major problem, althougth would lose some space.
    The extra track from the Turntable is an (could be good) idea to allow turning of locos after leaving West Porthsea to return. Is this possible electrically ? There is always an alternative solution. Thanks for looking & always welcome comments & suggestions
      regards Derek. 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 26, 2017, 01:40:26 pm
Thank you, Derek. Simple but effective is always a good principle to follow.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on November 26, 2017, 05:37:59 pm
Simpler and certainly more achievable. One change I think I would make is to move the goods shed next to the carriage sidings and the crossover further to the left. Just a thought and adding to the mental confusion. :D
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on November 26, 2017, 07:29:25 pm
:hellosign: Good Afternoon, been doing lots of  :hmmm: & looking at the GWR between Long Rock Depot & Penzance Station, (meal break walks) &  admire how simple but effective is the layout. So I have decided to simplfy West Porthsea Town Station, here is latest ideas

 The single track approach is very much inspired by Long Rock Crossing & most points again "Kato 4s" but importantly it is possible to convert to "6s" all round if there is a major problem, although would lose some space.

Thank you, Derek. Simple but effective is always a good principle to follow.

Seconded!  If there is one thing that characterises my model railway entertainments over the last 10 years or so, it is a move to simplicity.  I have tried to retain 'play value' because I think model railways are fun.  The modern track formation that you mention, Derek, sounds like a good example of this.  The late CF Freezer commentated that the modern railway was very suited to modelling.  Much of the complexity had been removed but the operational essence remained.

Now, I am a great enthusiast for Kato products, but I suggest that if you intend using #4 turnouts that you arrange to test the likely formations with all the locomotives and rolling stock that you intend to run.

@newportnobby (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=264) has kindly written-up elsewhere on the Forum the results of his tests with Kato #4 turnouts.  I have undertaken tests myself but nothing like as extensively or as carefully as NPN.  As a consequence, I use only #6.  It is very forward-thinking of you to make your design suitable for conversion to #6 turnouts if required.

If you find that #4 turnouts work for you, I can give you several that are sitting in a box!

All the very best.

John

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on November 26, 2017, 07:39:47 pm
I’m not one for track plans Derek. I just come up with an idea in my head then try to create it with track sections.  I cannot visualise it in on screen format at all.
However, your simplified plan looks very good. Hopefully, it will work well for you. Looking forward to seeing West Porthsea take shape.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 26, 2017, 07:51:27 pm
I think the best thing to do is actually lay the track even if it's only the paper templates (like Peco supplies and I have used) and run trains, if necessary by hand, and see if the configuration has the correct operating possibilities to keep you entertained whilst being realistic enough that no-one will point out any major errors once everything is actually laid down and fixed in place.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 26, 2017, 10:07:57 pm
 :hellosign: & good evening thank you Chris, Martin, John & Brian.
     Chris & Martin, I admit spend too much time thinking about what if, so must just try to crack on & do it.
      Brian, A very good idea which I will investigate, loads of space on the L/H side.
      John, I too have read NPNs post- very thought provoking. I have just one "Kato 4" which I have used for testing & up to now had no problem, although mostly with modern DMUs.
      regards Derek.
       
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on November 27, 2017, 04:49:35 pm
Simpler and certainly more achievable. One change I think I would make is to move the goods shed next to the carriage sidings and the crossover further to the left. Just a thought and adding to the mental confusion. :D

I agree.  I'm not convinced with the arrangement for the goods shed as it stands currently, I feel this may not work too well.

Like Chris in Prague and Port Peran have stated have a play and see how things work and adjust things to suit as you go.  Sometimes laying the track out on the board can give you a better perspective.  Most of my previous attempts started out as a plan on a piece of paper but then mutate once track laying starts!  You have the bonus of using Kato track which like Peco set track is ideal for putting down and trying something and then changing it before committing yourself.  Good Luck!

John (25901JFM)


Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 27, 2017, 08:09:29 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks John I am thinking all this good advice will be heeded
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 30, 2017, 10:33:10 pm
 :hellosign:  & Good Evening just a quick but very important update to say this is THE track plan to go (I really think so). Have taken all good advice on board......
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-301117222527.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58769)
   A total switch to "Kato 6" for the points & crossovers- not lost a lot of space really, & moved the Parcels/ Goods shed over to the L/H sidings. More to follow presently, thanks for looking & as always advice, comments or suggestions are more than welcome
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on November 30, 2017, 10:45:00 pm
Good evening, Derek. It's a pity that you've had to lose the bay platform for parcels at the end of the bottom left-hand platform and the crossover half way along the twin lines between the lower two platforms for adding / removing passenger train portions but, with a lot more shunting and the use of two locos. it is still possible. Maybe, John, has an elegant solution? However, using 'Kato 6" for smoother running has to be a good idea. Moving the goods shed to the goods yard / carriage sidings area is also an excellent idea.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on November 30, 2017, 11:12:30 pm
Hello & thanks Chris, really think I made a good decision. Hopefully lot's of fun ahead & just to start as we. mean to carry on
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-301117230123.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58777)
Sorry quality not superb but here is my latest accusission Class 47 D1572 with MK 1 CK in Crimson & Cream checking platform height today. My first mock up & serious measuring session using Peco Platforms on Gauge Master Trackbed foam.                                       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: 25901JFM on December 01, 2017, 03:14:00 am
:hellosign:  & Good Evening just a quick but very important update to say this is THE track plan to go (I really think so). Have taken all good advice on board......
([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-301117222527.jpeg[/url]) ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58769[/url])
   A total switch to "Kato 6" for the points & crossovers- not lost a lot of space really, & moved the Parcels/ Goods shed over to the L/H sidings. More to follow presently, thanks for looking & as always advice, comments or suggestions are more than welcome
      regards Derek.



A much simpler layout, which is not a bad thing.  Yes it is a shame that some features are not there now, but it is plausible for mail vans to be loaded in a conventional platform and I'm sure one of the 4 platforms (one with easy access for the G.P.O.) could be spared at the required times.  Portions can still be done, although not knowing the finer details of the "local area" I can't suggest anything else at present.  The good thing with Kato track is that it can be tried and tested and the plan tweaked if need be before the plan is set in stone, so to speak.  The most important thing though is that Derek seems to like it!

John (25901JFM) 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Bealman on December 01, 2017, 04:52:34 am
Is there any particular reason the double track goes to single for a short stretch on the left?
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 01, 2017, 08:00:33 am
good to see a piccie Derek.
Good luck with the build.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on December 01, 2017, 08:43:04 am
:hellosign:  & Good Evening just a quick but very important update to say this is THE track plan to go (I really think so). Have taken all good advice on board......
([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/4216-301117222527.jpeg[/url]) ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=58769[/url])
   A total switch to "Kato 6" for the points & crossovers- not lost a lot of space really, & moved the Parcels/ Goods shed over to the L/H sidings. More to follow presently, thanks for looking & as always advice, comments or suggestions are more than welcome
      regards Derek.


Thank you for the revised plan and the photograph, Derek.

I think that you have made a good decision regarding the #6 points.

One thing I found is that some locomotives are temperamental on #6 facing points, if these are the first track piece after a curve.  (If they are like this with #6, I can't imagine how they would react to #4!)  Trailing points are fine.  I suggest that you build your plan and test it with examples of the locomotives you intend to use.  If you have any problems, you can rearrange the Kato track pieces so very easily.  Once you are content, you can drill the holes for wires and suchlike.

I found that some of the facing point problems did not show themselves at once; the first few locomotives were fine and then one wasn't.  Then another one!  Plenty of test running is the answer and good fun it is, too.

Incidentally, my two new diesel locomotives (one Graham Farish and one Dapol) gave no problems at all.  Same with a Kato US-outline diesel.  It was only steam engines that encountered difficulties.  I think I have worked out the engineering basis for all this in my head, but I won't make a fool of myself by attempting to explain it!

By the way, what happened to the lovely branch line?

All the very best.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Bealman on December 01, 2017, 08:48:04 am
Looks like a mainline station to me!
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 01, 2017, 09:06:26 am
Yes, good to see a loco. and coach on clearance tests. D1572 can be renumbered to one of the WR ones and even named.

I have D1662 "ISAMBARD KINGDOM BRUNEL" so that could work 'through'.

Original Named WR Clss 47s (originally names were all upper case)

D1660 City of Truro, named on 8th June 1965.
D1661 North Star -- The longest surviving name (on the same engine). It was first applied to D1661 on 20th March 1965, and was still carried by 47 840 in 2015 (although the plates were removed at various times).
D1662 Isambard Kingdom Brunel, named on 20th March 1965.
D1663 Sir Daniel Gooch, named on 8th May 1965.
D1664 George Jackson Churchward, named on 8th May 1965.
D1665 Titan, named March 1966.
D1666 Odin, the first to be named, it was named "ODIN" at Cardiff Canton MPD on March 12th 1965. (The shortest official names were "ODIN" and "THOR" applied to D1666 and D1671 respectively in 1965.)
D1667 Atlas, named June 1966.
D1668 Orion, named October 1965.
D1669 Python, named 31 March 1966.
D1670 Mammoth, named August 1965.
D1671 Thor, named September 1965. (The first Brush to be "de-named" after being wrecked at Bridgend in December 1965. The recovered "THOR" plates were subsequently transferred to D1677.)
D1672 Colossus, named August 1965.
D1673 Cyclops, named June 1966.
D1674 Samson, named September 1965.
D1676 Vulcan, named October 1965.
D1677 Thor, named 29 August 1966.

SOURCE: http://www.class47.co.uk (http://www.class47.co.uk)

Once you have all the track laid and run some trains you can always, as John writes, 'fine tune' it thanks to Kato track's qualities.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Bealman on December 01, 2017, 09:21:40 am
Still not understanding the single track bit, though?  :hmmm:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: njee20 on December 01, 2017, 10:07:46 am
I agree with Bealman on the single track bit.

Also why the turntable with just two roads, surely that just needs a headshunt? The previous version had a number of sidings for the turntable to access, not sure if they'd ever be literally at the end of a platform like that though?

Looks a good plan though, but would definitely keep it double track on the LH side.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on December 01, 2017, 08:47:27 pm
What do you mean "this is the track plan"! :D
Can I make another suggestion? The turntable could be moved down nearer the double track and a low relief engine shed put on the back drop at the rear. It would make an ideal place to display your locos. A visible "fiddle yard".
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 02, 2017, 10:54:20 pm
 :hellosign: & A good evening all, many thanks for the comments & suggestions.
       John (25901JFM)  No reason GPO/Parcels/ Newspapers etc could not be un-loaded on the platform, although the siding is good for vans awaiting loads.
       George, My reason for the single track on the L/H side is space for the Level Crossing, although inspired by the GW approach to Long Rock & yes I am hoping to portray a mainline station.
        Thanks Martin, hope all went well today in Hayle.
        John (Train Waiting), I am hoping the "6s" will be trouble free for us both, & there will be lots more on the Branch Line, it is definitly still in the plan.
         Thanks Chris (IP) another very useful website book marked.
         njee20 & Brian, The turntable has moved about as the plan evolved & seems to make sense in it`s present position, Also lots of space to add extra roads top & bottom as the boards are angled. Thank you, like the idea of an Engine shed too.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 03, 2017, 09:16:59 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening everybody, well as the sun nearly put in an appearance this morning more Wood Butchery & boards now almost door to door round the shed. Just couple of gaps to fill & then the interesting removable bridge section, more photos soon.
     Now I have gone & done it, a big order from "Traintrax" for lots of lovely "kato" track, all things being equal West Porthsea Town Station should be starting to emerge before xmas.
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 03, 2017, 10:02:08 pm
Excellent news, Derek. Looking forward to seeing it take shape.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on December 03, 2017, 10:36:02 pm
Hi Derek,

As Chris (IP) says excellent news  :claphappy:.

Looking forward to the build and pics. I think once you've got the track on the board it'll be easier to move bits around and get the exact plan you want.

I'm not doubting your earlier written plan but (for me anyway) it's so much better seeing it in situ.

I'm getting there with the new scaled down version of Port Regleun so hopefully some sort of Channel crossing service could be achievable (with select pics) for Christmas.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 08:57:16 pm
 :hellosign: Good Evening everyone, superb news to report.  :claphappy: Mr Postman delivered this really nice box yesterday
(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-071217203917.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59012)
So day off today & this is where we are now

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-071217204223.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59013)
The track plan is spot on just missing a couple of pieces & station is complete
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 07, 2017, 09:00:23 pm
Looking good.
That’s quick work  getting the track down.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 09:03:22 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Martin, nothing is glued yet but I cant see this plan changing
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on December 07, 2017, 09:09:09 pm
:hellosign: Good Evening everyone, superb news to report.  :claphappy: Mr Postman delivered this really nice box yesterday
So day off today & this is where we are now

The track plan is spot on just missing a couple of pieces & station is complete
       regards Derek.

That looks splendid, Derek.  It's good to see the plan coming together.  One of the great benefits of using Kato 'Unitrack' is that it is really easy to make any changes that appear desirable once you see the formation taking shape in real life.  If you are not using Kato controllers there is a very clever little DC Adaptor that fits onto the point operating switches.  I'll post you a picture of my lever frame set-up if this will help.

All good wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 07, 2017, 09:15:05 pm
Excellent news, Derek. Very good to see the trackwork taking shape.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 09:51:06 pm
:hellosign: Good Evening everyone, superb news to report.  :claphappy: Mr Postman delivered this really nice box yesterday
So day off today & this is where we are now

The track plan is spot on just missing a couple of pieces & station is complete
       regards Derek.


That looks splendid, Derek.  It's good to see the plan coming together.  One of the great benefits of using Kato 'Unitrack' is that it is really easy to make any changes that appear desirable once you see the formation taking shape in real life.  If you are not using Kato controllers there is a very clever little DC Adaptor that fits onto the point operating switches.  I'll post you a picture of my lever frame set-up if this will help.

All good wishes.

John
  :hellosign: Thanks John, I have a Gaugemaster controller but admit I do prefer the Kato. Any photos would be most helpful.
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 09:53:37 pm
 :hellosign: Thanks Chris, I am well pleased
     regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on December 07, 2017, 10:22:11 pm
:hellosign: Good Evening everyone, superb news to report.  :claphappy: Mr Postman delivered this really nice box yesterday
So day off today & this is where we are now

The track plan is spot on just missing a couple of pieces & station is complete
       regards Derek.

 

That looks splendid, Derek.  It's good to see the plan coming together.  One of the great benefits of using Kato 'Unitrack' is that it is really easy to make any changes that appear desirable once you see the formation taking shape in real life.  If you are not using Kato controllers there is a very clever little DC Adaptor that fits onto the point operating switches.  I'll post you a picture of my lever frame set-up if this will help.

All good wishes.

John

  :hellosign: Thanks John, I have a Gaugemaster controller but admit I do prefer the Kato. Any photos would be most helpful.
      regards Derek.


Derek

I have three Kato Power Packs for my US-outline layout.  One simply appeared to wear out and had to be replaced.  With Gaugemaster there is a lifetime guarantee.  The Gaugemaster controllers have 16v AC terminals.  Kato makes the '24-842 DC Converter' (£5.05 from Traintrax) which connects to these terminals.  Here is the arrangement on the Table-Top Railway Mk. III:-

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/6222-071217220144.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59034)
[Lever frame in place.  Five levers operate nine points.  Two crossover-type formations and two loops with a route-setting arrangement.  Apologies for the camera shake!]

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/6222-071217220214.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59035)
[The lever frame pulled out of its location.  '24-842 DC Converter' right in front of the camera.] 

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/6222-071217220242.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59036)
['24-842 DC Converter' disconnected from the lever frame - it's really that easy!  My US-outline layout has 25 levers in the frame, powered by one of these connected to an ancient H&M transformer.]

If you use a Kato '22-015' Power Pack, the lever frame can simply clip onto the side, giving a very neat arrangement if that suits your favoured operating position.

Hope this helps.  If you have any questions, please ask.  If I can't answer them, someone else likely will.

Best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on December 07, 2017, 10:28:51 pm
Hi Derek,

Again  :claphappy:. Glad your happy with it all.

Unless you've done it already, I'd keep the point wires tied up while you're testing trains and use them manually as they become a right pain in the bolognese until you make a hole in the board for the spaghetti. Just a thought.

Also, you've probably said before, but what era (or eras) are you modelling? I presume '60s but are you having modeller's licence?

Sorry but I lose track (no pun).

Anyway, keep up the good work.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 10:31:11 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks John, wow that is neat, & as you say simple to set up maybe the gaugemaster controller will feature, thanks again
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 07, 2017, 10:45:22 pm
 :hellosign: Chris (Weave), thanks for the tip, the points wires are staying bundled for a little while  :thumbsup:
     I have a wide variety of trains from around the world from the 40s (I think) right up to latest EMUs & love em all so yes rule 1 generally but West Porthsea is most definitly 60s. (It makes sense to me)
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on December 08, 2017, 09:32:24 am
Hi Derek,

Unless you've done it already, I'd keep the point wires tied up while you're testing trains and use them manually as they become a right pain in the bolognese until you make a hole in the board for the spaghetti. Just a thought.

Cheers weave  :beers:


That's really good advice.

When it comes to wiring, there are probably two options (assuming the wires will run below the baseboard).

If you wish to use just Kato cables to take full advantage of the 'plug and play' system, I found the best way to drill the holes was with one of these...

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/6222-081217091458.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59042)
[Half-inch bit!]

The holes are hidden below the Kato integral ballast as is, hopefully, evident from the photograph.

Alternatively, one can cut the Kato cables and use a much smaller hole in the baseboard and then re-join the cables.  This also allows for the Kato cables to be extended to any length one wants and works out cheaper than buying several extension cables.  I used this method on my US-outline layout which is quite big.  The cable I used was a twin cable intended, I believe, for burglar alarms.

By the way, I now normally prefer to use the 'Power Feed Unijoiners' rather than the 62mm power feed track.  But you might notice a 62mm power feed track in the photograph - at the end of the headshunt.  This is because of a very large baulk of timber below the baseboard!  The cable runs in a little trough, covered by the black card, and then goes below the baseboard at a convenient location.  With Sundeala, a trough is easy to cut.  Harder with MDF or ply but still do-able.  If one is using a cork surface, then it's an absolute doddle.

All the best.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on December 08, 2017, 05:30:06 pm
A lovely box full! I'm not a Kato user but you can certainly lay track quickly with Kato. Looking forward now to seeing trains running.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 08, 2017, 10:53:18 pm
Hi Derek,

Unless you've done it already, I'd keep the point wires tied up while you're testing trains and use them manually as they become a right pain in the bolognese until you make a hole in the board for the spaghetti. Just a thought.

Cheers weave  :beers:


That's really good advice.

When it comes to wiring, there are probably two options (assuming the wires will run below the baseboard).

If you wish to use just Kato cables to take full advantage of the 'plug and play' system, I found the best way to drill the holes was with one of these...

([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/6222-081217091458.jpeg[/url]) ([url]http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59042[/url])
[Half-inch bit!]

The holes are hidden below the Kato integral ballast as is, hopefully, evident from the photograph.

Alternatively, one can cut the Kato cables and use a much smaller hole in the baseboard and then re-join the cables.  This also allows for the Kato cables to be extended to any length one wants and works out cheaper than buying several extension cables.  I used this method on my US-outline layout which is quite big.  The cable I used was a twin cable intended, I believe, for burglar alarms.

By the way, I now normally prefer to use the 'Power Feed Unijoiners' rather than the 62mm power feed track.  But you might notice a 62mm power feed track in the photograph - at the end of the headshunt.  This is because of a very large baulk of timber below the baseboard!  The cable runs in a little trough, covered by the black card, and then goes below the baseboard at a convenient location.  With Sundeala, a trough is easy to cut.  Harder with MDF or ply but still do-able.  If one is using a cork surface, then it's an absolute doddle.

All the best.

John


Hello & many thanks again John, really appreciate the photo & advice. I am using the 62mm track connector for now while I look at all my options
       regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 08, 2017, 11:04:19 pm
A lovely box full! I'm not a Kato user but you can certainly lay track quickly with Kato. Looking forward now to seeing trains running.
Hello Brian, next shed time will see at least one train checking out the pointwork, but must also complete the boards
     regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 14, 2017, 10:22:27 pm
 :hellosign: & good Evening all. The wet weather put paid to the idea of board construction today so took the opportunity to try some new arrivals over the new"Kato 6" point work & yes pleased as punch  :thumbsup:
     Many thanks to Chris (IP) & Martin (Port Perran) for the new goods wagons, excellent painting gentlemen
      My latest loco purchase, from Pannier Market in Truro is BRCW type 2 D5379 which aptly for my layout, the real loco was based in Tilbury on Boat Train duty, ok wrong county but looks good & a re-number is not an impossiblity.
     Photos to follow
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 14, 2017, 10:37:17 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-141217222701.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59305)
Hello again apology s for the quality, must try to improve.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 14, 2017, 10:45:24 pm
 :hellosign: For some bizarre reason can only upload one photo right now but will try again later   :confusedsign:    :sorrysign:
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on December 15, 2017, 12:21:25 am
Hi Derek,

Ah yes, the weird and wonderful world of posting pics. I can't advise as I rely on my wife, who works in IT, to help and even she has difficulties.

I'm sure you'll get there in the end and so looking forward to more pics.

I hope to start the Port Regleun thread this weekend (as long as there's not pic posting problems as well) and then we'll have to start liaising on 'through' train ferry services both passenger and freight.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on December 15, 2017, 08:42:01 am
Thank you, Derek for the picture.

The 'Birmingham' 'Type 2' is a nice-looking locomotive.  These were once very common hereabouts and, as you say, some were allocated to the ER for a while first.

I'm glad you are finding the Kato track and #6 turnouts to be satisfactory.  A locomotive like your 'Type 2' is unlikely to encounter any difficulty on #4 turnouts, but a steam engine running tender first over a facing #4 could be quite another matter as @newportnobby (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=profile;u=264) has demonstrated with his diligent and helpful research.

With best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on December 15, 2017, 09:33:11 am
Hi Derek, thanks for the photo. and update. I once had a Minitrix BR Blue BRC&W Co. Type 2 like your D5379, a very reliable, rugged little loco with working headlights. Yes, in their early days, the ER had some (D5370–D5378 to Thornaby). In the late 1960s, the LMR, still had (for some reason) a few of what became Class 27 (in the period September to December 1963, some of the Cricklewood allocation were transferred to Leicester and in December 1965 the Thornaby allocation was also nominally transferred to Leicester to join them) and they appeared in the WR on parcels trains because I saw them at Worcester Shrub Hill station. Eventually, they were all on the ScR (original allocations were D5347–D5369 to Glasgow Eastfield).

It was what, later, became Class 27s, D5379–D5415 that were, initially, allocated to London Cricklewood for Tilbury Boat trains and Cross-London freight services.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Newportnobby on December 15, 2017, 11:20:28 am

The 'Birmingham' 'Type 2' is a nice-looking locomotive.  These were once very common hereabouts and, as you say, some were allocated to the ER for a while first.


As can be seen from the Wickedpedia link, the initial first 20 were allocated to the ER and later all transferred to the ScR. This is why I bought the Dapol versions with running numbers D5301 and D5307 as shaky hand syndrome won't allow renumbering or such antics :-[

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_26
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 16, 2017, 10:13:28 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Chris (Weave), John (Train Waiting), Chris (In Prague) & Mick (Newport Nobby). The Type 2 was just in the right place at the right time (& so was I) , & I thought a little research was needed.    :thankyousign:
      regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 30, 2017, 10:38:50 pm
 :hellosign: & Good Evening all. Hope everybody had a good Christmas & looking forward to a bright New Year.
    Santa thought I was a very good boy, more later but first the new track plan

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-301217222804.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59900)
   Ok very little change & more importantly the tracks are all in place except for the Turntable which having read the instructions I am now wondering about the double approach tracks.   :helpneededsign:  Will this be possible on DC or even DCC? Any ideas or suggestions gratefully received. There is a easy plan B ( top two tracks join before turntable), but what if
       regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: weave on December 30, 2017, 11:00:22 pm
Hi Derek,

Sorry, would love to help but I know nothing about turntables.

I'm sure someone can help. I presume it's the Kato one (?).

Hope you had a good Christmas and looking forward to what Santa brought you.

Cheers weave  :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 30, 2017, 11:52:03 pm

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-301217233750.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59907)
Hello, yes Chris I do like Kato Unitrack, can't wait to try it. Hoping for more later as my new phone can still only upload one at once
    regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 31, 2017, 12:39:45 am

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/59/4216-311217003623.jpeg) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view&id=59913)
Hello ha managed another photo, the Hymek is the latest addition to the fleet, thanks Santa
      regards Derek
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Newportnobby on December 31, 2017, 10:30:03 am
Always been my favourite hydraulic :heart2: :drool:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: port perran on December 31, 2017, 10:34:38 am
The Hymek looks really good.
Pretty rare in Cornwall but they did visit  so it’s reasonably correct. Plus I have one as well.
Watch you don’t lose the buffers, mine were very loose till I glued them in.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: JohnN on December 31, 2017, 02:40:33 pm
I've always fancied a Hymek. I prefer the older diesels (and diesels hydraulics) to newer diesels and electrics.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 31, 2017, 02:45:27 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks Mick, Martin & John, yes a good looking loco & thanks for the warning Martin I will keep an eye on the buffers
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Mito on December 31, 2017, 05:35:37 pm
Looks like you've been a very good boy! Looking forward to seeing some motion. Happy new year. :beers:
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on December 31, 2017, 10:03:55 pm
Hello Thanks Brian, am enjoying sorting the turntable, fit to track then some serious testing while finishing the boards to circle the shed
       regards Derek 
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Chris in Prague on January 04, 2018, 09:31:42 am
Thanks for the updates, Derek. I think the "Hymeks" were the best looking and best-performing of all the diesel-hydraulics and it's great to see you have one, D7043 (which was always allocated to 82A Bristol Bath Road: from New, 24/07/1962 to 01/01/1972, withdrawn).

I have three Dapol Hymeks: ND-084G Hymek D7093 in Two-Tone Green DCC Fitted renumbered D7028, ND-084G Hymek D7093 in Two-Tone Green. DCC Fitted renumbered D7090 and the latest 2D-018-010 Hymek D7036 BR Blue SYP Double Arrow Logo (repainted in this livery c. 1966; allocated to 81A from 1965) DCC-fitted. The first two were renumbered to two of the Hymeks which were allocated to Plymouth Laira (84A) for the longest time in the period I'm modelling (up to 1968): D7028, 84A Laira 13/04/1964, then 82A Bristol Bath Road 18/03/1968; D7090, 84A Laira 22/06/1964, then 83A Newton Abbot 19/06/1966.

The first "Hymeks" were not transferred to Plymouth Laira (84A) until April 1964 when D7027, D7028, D7072, D7073 were transferred from Bristol Bath Road (82A), although they were always rare west of Plymouth. However, they were visitors before this. From the summer of 1962, one “Hymek” was stationed at Newton Abbot for regular freight workings to and from Rogerstone. This enabled the local crews to familiarise themselves with the type, which then began to appear in increasing numbers. Bristol “Hymeks” worked regular freight turns to Exeter and Hackney yards, also from Taunton to Minehead, and they were turned out in large numbers on summer Saturday passenger workings, notably to or from the Kingswear branch. [So, with a little application of "Rule One", a Bristol "Hymek" could be seen west of Exeter.] According to "Bodmin and Wadebridge 1984-1978", Fairclough and Wills (1979) one "Hymek" No. D7032 (interestingly allocated to Cardiff Canton from new, in 1962, until September 1965) visited Wadebridge on a North Cornwall trial on 6 January 1965 so I think you can definitely justify at least one Plymouth Laira allocated one on your South Cornwall layout as well as visitors from other WR sheds.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: cornish yorkie on January 04, 2018, 02:43:22 pm
 :hellosign: Many thanks (again) Chris for the Hymek info, maybe a re- number for the future
     regards Derek.
Title: Re: Any-upon-Ware
Post by: Train Waiting on January 04, 2018, 09:55:49 pm
Hello ha managed another photo, the Hymek is the latest addition to the fleet, thanks Santa
      regards Derek

Many thanks for the interesting photograph, Derek.

D7043 is certainly a stylish-looking locomotive.

Best wishes.

John