Coach bogie blues.

Old Crow · February 22, 2018, 06:12:19 PM

I have to buy "used" at present and it can be a lottery; sometimes I've been lucky but currently having problems with some bogies on old coaches derailing or being very draggy.
Two things;
Some wheels sets seem to be stiff turning. I can't see any problems with the locations but it must be something; any ideas?
Old bogies seem to be catching and I think the wheels contact the solebars on turns, so I'm thinking of using a spacer or washer or something. again, any advice?

Newportnobby · February 22, 2018, 08:09:31 PM

Having experienced the same issues in the past when I've bought second hand stock, I find the overriding problem is the wheelsets don't seem to be seated properly in the axle openings in the bogie. Sometimes this can be seen quite obviously as the axle is on the skew when looked at. Another way I check is to look along the top of the bogie to see if the wheels stand proud by the same amount. If not, chances are one axle or more is not seated properly.
As this is the easiest one to solve, I'd check this first.

Old Crow · February 24, 2018, 01:45:08 AM

Buying cheap old stuff is false economy really but I can't run to £25 plus for a single coach. So I've got a few old original Farish suburban coaches that look ok but some of which derail when pushed over points. I don't think these old things are really up to much; it seems to me that the wheels actually contact the solebars of the coach body on curves or even the underframes. Running into a siding, one or other of the bogies may just decide it doesn't want take the turnout. Some that run freely seem ok.; I've got some old Lima coaches which are very free runners and weighted - they will pass over anything.
I may as well experiment with the rogue ones. Any suggestions? I've thought of putting a spacer to help the wheels clear the coach base and use a screw instead of the pin. I've read that replacement wheels have a better profile??? And weight because a problem seems to be where the point blade fits into the running rail, the notch causes the bogie to jump.
Saving up for some good stuff.

railsquid · February 24, 2018, 03:02:39 AM

Quote from: Old Crow on February 24, 2018, 01:45:08 AMI've read that replacement wheels have a better profile???

Original wheels left, new ones right:

I haven't had any particular problems with the older Farish stock, albeit on Tomix track.

New wheelsets are a definite visual improvement.

Cooper · February 24, 2018, 11:26:28 AM

If they aren't misplaced from their location holes as Newport Nobby suggests checking, I'd definitely try new wheel sets, (the smaller flange might solve the rubbing problem) and add a bit of weight over the bogies?

Old Crow · February 24, 2018, 09:36:56 PM

Big thank you Cooper. I put the new wheels on the worst offender and it was transformed. Ran so smooth you could blow it along and rode over the points - being pushed - with no rising or jumping.
The newer wheels are significantly smaller and the flanges much less prominent. It seems that the larger flange was continually hitting the frog of the point and derailing when being pushed from behind. I not that the smaller wheels do not hit the coach floor and I've modified the bogies slightly to make them turn easier without catching.
I'll order some more from BR Lines. Shame they only sell them in 10's.
Thanks again - something more I've learned - was pulling my hair out thinking it was me.

Cooper · February 24, 2018, 09:41:12 PM

In fairness @Old Crow you suggested it yourself, and @railsquid picked up on it, so I can't take the plaudits. Glad you've sorted though!

dodger · February 25, 2018, 06:47:31 AM

Try Peter's Spares they were selling them singly, but I'm not sure if they have any left.

Dodger

trkilliman · February 25, 2018, 07:18:23 AM

Interesting thread.

I'm currently building a rake of LMS coaches from etched sides. For convenience I'm using the old Farish Poole bogies that quite resemble LMS ones. I love modelling/scratchbuilding but cannot be faffed with bending brass frets, unless I really have to.

The original Farish wheels with large flanges are, as Old Crow found, rather hit and miss. I have also bought a couple of packs of the lower profile Bachmann Farish wheels, as fitted to their Stanier coaches.

Packs of 10 does seem a strange number when each coach requires 4 wheelsets, or 6 in rarer cases. Therefore a pack of 12 would make more sense. It's a pity they do not sell a much larger bulk "conversion" pack...oh' well.

The same applies to their packs of couplings and springs, a bulk pack would be welcome. I was a bit miffed with a recent pack of ten, that only had 7 springs in it. If anything a couple of extras thrown in would be good, as they are prone to launch into orbit!

Old Crow · February 25, 2018, 02:57:43 PM

Ah! Those springs! Has anyone ever found one that's "escaped?" And what is the magic tool for fitting the damn tihngs?

trkilliman · February 25, 2018, 03:46:06 PM

Well, they tend to be like Lord Lucan, gone without trace. Or, as my wife said similar to losing an earing backing!

For fitting I find that placing/threading them onto something with a pointed end helps. I "borrowed" a bookbinders awl from my Wife, although a cocktail stick would probably be as good. With the spring dangling on the end you should be able to coax the end of it onto the very small spigot that sticks out from the bogie.

When it's on put a thumb over the top of the spring to (hopefully) stop it going into orbit. Inset the coupling at 90 degrees and gently push it back until it goes just beyond the "holding bar" Then with thumb still over the top of the spring return the coupling to it's normal position. Remove your thumb slowly as at this point when you think you have "won" the springs have a habit launching themselves. Sounds harder than it is, but lose a couple/few springs and you will realise it's a tad delicate, a challenge even...lol

martyn · February 25, 2018, 04:03:05 PM

Try using a TINY jeweller's screwdriver, placing the spring over the shank, then use a TINY drop of gel superglue to glue the spring to the pip on the coupling. Allow to dry, and it makes the job a lot quicker and easier!

A similar trick can be used when replacing carbon brush springs in Poole type chassis-but omit the superglue!

HTH

Martyn

ntpntpntp · February 25, 2018, 05:22:45 PM

Quote from: trkilliman on February 25, 2018, 07:18:23 AM
I was a bit miffed with a recent pack of ten, that only had 7 springs in it.

Unusual to be that many missing. Those springs do sometimes disguise themselves by twisting together down the same axis and looking like one spring.

Work in a clear plastic bag, then anything which "pings" doesn't go far!

Old Crow · February 26, 2018, 07:04:46 PM

Thanks trkilliman I do actually possess a bookbinder's awl but never found a use for it! Couplings - or rather UN-couplings are the bane of my life at present. I have a selection of various makes and ages of rolling stock and it seems the couplings are "similar" but not the same and have a tendency to uncouple at will. Think I might make up "trains" - a fixed rake, certainly carriages with modified or enhanced permanent couplings.

Back to wheels. I've been blaming all my problems on the points and tearing my hair but it seems that it really was the large flanges on old Farish stock that caused the derailing on points and wobbly wagons. Replacing them is the answer and, at a pinch, I've found you can use Lima coach wheels with success. somehow the old silver Farish wheels seem to object to electrofrog points when pushed, hitting the frog nose and jumping. New wheels, absolutely no problem. I'm glad I'm not on DCC because an old 2-6-4 tank with big flanges actually produces sparks on occasions - wheels of fire!

What to do with the old sets? Pity one can't turn them down - I see a guy on E-bay has fifty!

Newportnobby · February 26, 2018, 08:20:25 PM

Quote from: Old Crow on February 26, 2018, 07:04:46 PM

What to do with the old sets?

Keep them for use in modelling a scrapyard, along with any other similar types of 'railwayana'. One of the best scrapyards I've seen is on a layout called 'Barton Road' which has an old condemned 'Hymek' body. the chassis of an old bolster wagon and all sorts of other metal scrap including loads of different carriage/wagon wheels