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Author Topic: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List  (Read 8370 times)

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Offline captainelectra

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #45 on: January 07, 2018, 09:52:56 pm »
BACHMANN 2018/19 RELEASES
371-288 Class 55 No. 55015 'Tulyar' BR Blue
First time a BR Blue liveried Deltic with white window surrounds has been modelled in N Scale


If only they'd looked at their past products before making such a statement (maybe they thought this model was N Gauge!)

Graham Farish 8416 - 55009 Alcydon 




Thought it was a bit of a sweeping statement - I modelled a white cab Deltic back in the day with a Lima and some Tipp-Ex.
Best Regards,
Adam Warr
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Offline carderrail

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #46 on: January 07, 2018, 10:00:48 pm »
I was wonderign about that as well, although only released for a short period originally a batch were re-released in 1999 prior to Bachmann taking over...

BACHMANN 2018/19 RELEASES
371-288 Class 55 No. 55015 'Tulyar' BR Blue
First time a BR Blue liveried Deltic with white window surrounds has been modelled in N Scale


If only they'd looked at their past products before making such a statement (maybe they thought this model was N Gauge!)

Graham Farish 8416 - 55009 Alcydon 



Offline Dr Al

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #47 on: January 07, 2018, 10:06:49 pm »
BACHMANN 2018/19 RELEASES
371-288 Class 55 No. 55015 'Tulyar' BR Blue
First time a BR Blue liveried Deltic with white window surrounds has been modelled in N Scale

If only they'd looked at their past products before making such a statement (maybe they thought this model was N Gauge!)

Graham Farish 8416 - 55009 Alcydon 

This is an ancient model dating from 1984. Not the same tooling, and really not comparable - I can't see there's any valid criticism of Bachmann here - they can't be expected to not reproduce models that were last done 33 years ago!

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Offline Lindi

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #48 on: January 07, 2018, 10:15:34 pm »
BACHMANN 2018/19 RELEASES
371-288 Class 55 No. 55015 'Tulyar' BR Blue
First time a BR Blue liveried Deltic with white window surrounds has been modelled in N Scale

If only they'd looked at their past products before making such a statement (maybe they thought this model was N Gauge!)

Graham Farish 8416 - 55009 Alcydon 

This is an ancient model dating from 1984. Not the same tooling, and really not comparable - I can't see there's any valid criticism of Bachmann here - they can't be expected to not reproduce models that were last done 33 years ago!

Cheers,
Alan

Not a criticism of Bachmann producing the model just of their statement that it was the first time a blue deltic with white window surrounds had been produced in n scale, which is not true.

The model is most welcome and I will be purchasing it when it comes out.

Offline Chetcombe

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #49 on: January 08, 2018, 01:34:28 am »
Very excited by the WR Blue Pullman set. I remember when my dad and I first started in orribly oversized we had the Triang version in grey/blue and I have wanted an N Gauge one ever since I got back into the hobby :bounce:

The maroon Hawksworths and a sound fitted Class 31 are also very tempting :D

All in all a very nice New Year's announcement!

Offline Mustermark

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #50 on: January 08, 2018, 02:50:30 am »
I'm also very excited about the Western Pullman. Even at 380!
Also tempted by 31s in BR Blue and RTC.

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I'm a personality prototype... you can tell, can't you.

Offline geoffc

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #51 on: January 08, 2018, 09:59:33 am »
Nothing for me I'm afraid, no FGW/GWR 158 or Mk3 sleepers. For some reason they are producing a Class 57 GWR which is a waste of time with no coaches to go with it. They did the same when they produced the FGW version, the only good side to that was they did not sell very well and I got one brand new from a box shifter for 55. If the same thing happens again I will buy one, if not my money is going on the Dapol DRS 68 and GWR HST.

Geoff

Offline Portpatrick

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #52 on: January 08, 2018, 10:19:17 am »
I suppose if I was going to be totally self indulgent and extravagant , I could be tempted by the reissued "blue pullman", even a used one in original Nanking blue.  When I started on the Western in 1971 I used to see them in this new livery.  However I have already splashed out on Voyagers in Virgin and Cross Country.  And built up an HST in the short lived Virgin 2+5 Cross Country format.  Minimal use for them but I like them.  There are more important and useful things like the promised Thompson coaches I really do want.  And if the Mk 3 sleepers came out in current livery along with the MK 2s to match and a Class 73, all to go with the Dapol 67 on new style, that really would grab me.  Along with a Cravens (105) in green for Portpatrick Town.  In my dreams.

Offline njee20

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #53 on: January 08, 2018, 10:49:28 am »
Agree the GWR 57 seems an odd choice given the complete lack of complementary rolling stock. Trying to milk the tooling I guess, as there aren't many other variants of the non-Delner fitted 57s.

Given Dapol haven't done the tooling for the SLEP variant I'm surprised Farish haven't tapped into that market. I'm sure there's a market for newer Caledonian Sleeper liveries (the blue "First" one and the newest teal livery) as well as Dynamic Lines FGW or GWR ones. Given how much the older purple Caledonian Sleeper ones seem to go for, and the fact they've got the mk2 in their arsenal as well I'd have thought that would have been a winner.

Still perplexed by their calling the 450 a new tooling. I did wonder if they'd sorted electrical continuity between coaches, but they're calling the First TPE one a re-livery, so I'd presume it's exactly the same product. I'm not convinced the removal of the pantograph justifies a "new tooling" moniker.

Offline Dr Al

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #54 on: January 08, 2018, 11:44:24 am »
Still perplexed by their calling the 450 a new tooling. I did wonder if they'd sorted electrical continuity between coaches, but they're calling the First TPE one a re-livery, so I'd presume it's exactly the same product. I'm not convinced the removal of the pantograph justifies a "new tooling" moniker.

It may be that they are changing the chassis tooling to accept Next18?

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Offline njee20

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #55 on: January 08, 2018, 11:51:27 am »
It's possible. Would be an odd choice though. IMO one of the reasons the 350 didn't sell better was that you need 3 decoders to convert it to DCC.

Changing to Next18 actually worsens that due to a lack of cheaper Next18 decoders.

What would be good would be developing some sort of electrical connectivity between coaches (perhaps in conjunction with Next18 and a speaker slot) to enable you to convert one with a single decoder. Given the amount of space in the motor coach it's an obvious candidate for a sound conversion, particularly given the distinctive noise they make.

However... surely if you're doing that you do the TPE one as well as the SWT 450, however they're calling the 450 a "new tooling" and the TPE one a "re-livery", which suggests to me they're whipping the pantograph off the 450, filling a few tiny holes in the pantograph well and calling it a new tooling!

At >230 I predict a bit of a lemon, sadly, which really isn't what is needed.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 11:52:33 am by njee20 »

Offline Dr Al

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #56 on: January 08, 2018, 11:55:13 am »
What would be good would be developing some sort of electrical connectivity between coaches (perhaps in conjunction with Next18 and a speaker slot) to enable you to convert one with a single decoder.

In an ideal world - but the additional cost of tooling might make the unit more expensive than buying an extra cheap decoder or 2, so it's swings and roundabouts.

They do clearly want to move as much to DCC sound and Next 18 compatable as possible - clearly DCC sound is the next cash cow for them. Just hope they don't ruin the 47 and 31 chassis for it.

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Offline njee20

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #57 on: January 08, 2018, 12:08:21 pm »
But surely the cheapest tooling is to stick with what they have? Although of course changing to Next18 is just a new circuit board, or rather two new circuit boards in the different vehicles. From their perspective of course any change in tooling is more expensive than forcing the customer to buy two additional decoders, but obviously they have to look on a macro scale at the change in the market perception to the model if they undertook the tooling change. Does the Blue Pullman (or CEP or any other MU) have electrical connectivity between coaches?

However, my point was more that any of those things (with the possible exception of modification to include speakers/reduce decoder requirements) is a very tenuous use of "new tooling" and appears not to be being applied to the other 350 they're releasing, which suggests to me they're doing nothing whatsoever, and releasing a product with a history of poor sales at a significantly higher price point, whilst stock of older ones still remains (although one wonders if sales will now pick up).

Basically I'm being a bit of a pedant.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 12:09:55 pm by njee20 »

Offline Dr Al

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #58 on: January 08, 2018, 12:32:24 pm »
But surely the cheapest tooling is to stick with what they have? Although of course changing to Next18 is just a new circuit board, or rather two new circuit boards in the different vehicles. From their perspective of course any change in tooling is more expensive than forcing the customer to buy two additional decoders, but obviously they have to look on a macro scale at the change in the market perception to the model if they undertook the tooling change. Does the Blue Pullman (or CEP or any other MU) have electrical connectivity between coaches?

Given that the Next18 decoders seem larger than NEM651, in some cases (particularly like this unit, where the drive needs to be fairly compact not to block out too many windows) the retooling may end up being more significant that just PCBs. It'll be interesting to see what they do with the J72 - my bet will be they won't be able to get a Next18 in it.

It's also what worries me a smidgen about their retooling of 47s and 31s - to get that speaker in as well may mean a complete drive retool, use of the coreless motor? If so these new ones won't run well with older ones if the class 40 top speed is anything to go by. DCC sound is the bandwagon now being jumped on to make more money.

No UK EMU or DMU has through wiring apart from Hornby/Arnold Belle, and the forthcoming Pendolino. For me it's not necessary (not DCC user) as pickup from one car is plenty enough, and if I did ever DCC I guess dual decoders is the only option for most. Given secondhand cheap decoders can be around 10, whilst undesirable, it's not a massive extra expense - worst for Dapol units that have a central power car and therefore need 2 extra decoders for the ends lights. But would a retooled unit to incorporate this cost less than 10 more? Seems doubtful IMHO.

However, my point was more that any of those things (with the possible exception of modification to include speakers/reduce decoder requirements) is a very tenuous use of "new tooling" and appears not to be being applied to the other 350 they're releasing, which suggests to me they're doing nothing whatsoever, and releasing a product with a history of poor sales at a significantly higher price point, whilst stock of older ones still remains (although one wonders if sales will now pick up).

Undoubtedly - though given that the 450 has no pantographs and 3rd rail collector shoes, I'd expect the tooling here to be different so it didn't leave holes where a pantograph would be, and new bogies to accommodate the shoes. Granted, it's not a massive tooling change, so your point has validity, but it is a change, so technically they are not wrong in their claims. They'd get hammered if they just repainted the 350 and left a load of gaping attachment holes on the roof where the pantograph would have been, and didn't bother with 3rd rail collectors.

Same could be said for some of the versions of diesel locos in the past - when they released the 37/4 it was a 'new tooling' even though that basically meant it was only a modified body tool from the 37/0.

In terms of the 350/450 sales, I don't have much to add, primarily because they aren't units of interest to me. Although perhaps that's the entire point.........!

Cheers,
Alan
Quote from: Roy L S
If Dr Al is online he may be able to provide a more comprehensive answer.

Offline njee20

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Re: Graham Farish New Product Announcement - 2018 Full List
« Reply #59 on: January 08, 2018, 12:48:59 pm »
They've already got shoe beams on the 350/1 LM variant, so it's literally a handful of holes. I take your point that technically that is a tooling change, but still...

The motor is in one of the centre coaches, so like the Dapol Voyager you do need 2 additional decoders (three in total for a 4-car unit), which I'm sure is a contributory factor in the poor sales. I certainly don't have a real issue with it, I use cheap function only decoders, and have nine 350s. I think. Maybe only 8 now. They come and go. But I know a lot of people have commented on this as a factor, which I can understand.

Re: re-tooling locos to accommodate speakers etc I'd be concerned about loss of mass too. The old (non-DCC friendly) Dapol 66s were great haulers, then they removed a load of material to make way for a decoder and they're now nowhere near as good, indeed verging on inadequate I'd say. No idea what the 47 is like, but would be a shame if they went on to compromise locos like the 60, which can still manage prototypical trains with ease.

 

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