Just to check my sums: GWR's broad gauge on N-Gauge?

[spot]

If I were to model the Great Western Railway's broad gauge of 7 feet 0¼ inches in N-gauge, i.e. using 9mm track, then all the accessories sold in the shops as 1/220, i.e. labelled Z-gauge, would be to scale? Trees and people and horses and sheds and backdrops? All I'd need to do is scratch-build rolling stock?

I'm not thinking of this as a first layout, I'm just jotting ideas in a new notebook. The coincidence of 9mm track being correct for presenting broad gauge at a scale of 1/220 is, I think, just a coincidence, but it seems startlingly accurate even so.

I've spent time reading some forum threads but I've not seen this discussed, my apology if I've missed it.

[NeMo]

Hmm... 84.25 inches in mm is... 2140 mm...

2140 / 9 = 237... so yes, broad gauge track at 1:220 would be approximately 9 mm in gauge.

Your problem is that the rail would be rather deep and thick. Let's say the N gauge rail is 2 mm tall... x 220 that's 440, so you'd be modelling rail 44 cm deep, which is massive! Likewise the width of the rail and the size of the sleepers.

Broad gauge sleepers didn't tend to look much like those used on normal gauge track either, come to think of it.

On the other hand, it'd be a starting point, perhaps prior to hand building your own broad gauge track?

Cheers, NeMo

[PLD]

In 1:220 scale, 7ft 1/4in work out at 9.72mm. As you would really want finer track than RTR N gauge and it would have to be hand-built to properly represent the baulk-road track, you could also look to using the 2mm finescale standards with code 40 rail and 9.4mm gauge track which would be even closer to scale.

The alternative is to stay with the N gauge scale ratio of 1:148 and use the 3mm scale finescale track components and gauge of 14mm.

[spot]

I had noticed there was a 3mm scale track available but I would be on the wrong forum at that stage, it would be no longer N-gauge. From what I've seen searching, most models representing GWR broad gauge work in 4mm or 7mm, both of which sound immense.

The comments about conventional N-gauge track being over-high and over-wide in the context of 1/220 scale would apply to its conventional use at 1/148 scale too, presumably - I've learned a new word in this thread, "finescale" which I'm now searching and finding hits. Was the intention of the normal model rail width to allow better conductivity, and the normal model rail height better mechanical strength? Anyway, several new websites about finescale to look at now. Discovering the vocabulary is only the start of learning.

[PLD]

I had noticed there was a 3mm scale track available but I would be on the wrong forum at that stage, it would be no longer N-gauge.

To be honest someone working in N Scale (1:148) on a broad or narrow gauge is probably a better fit for this forum than someone working in a different scale on 9mm gauge track... 

I've learned a new word in this thread, "finescale" which I'm now searching and finding hits. Was the intention of the normal model rail width to allow better conductivity, and the normal model rail height better mechanical strength?

The 'standard' commercial track in all the three common model railway scales ('N', '00', '0') are a heavier rail and a narrower track gauge than a true scale representation. I think the kindest way of describing it is a "Historical Engineering Compromise"   

"Finescale" is a generic term used (and often abused) to indicate various closer-to-scale alternatives... 

[spot]

I had noticed there was a 3mm scale track available but I would be on the wrong forum at that stage, it would be no longer N-gauge.

To be honest someone working in N Scale (1:148) on a broad or narrow gauge is probably a better fit for this forum than someone working in a different scale on 9mm gauge track... 

Ah. I had wondered but I'd not wanted to presume. Thank you.

[Malc]

Broad gauge sleepers ran longitudinally, not between the rails.

[steve836]

I think you'll find that the reason most people who wish to model brad gauge use 4mm or 7mm scale is the availability of parts such as wheels, motors etc. which are not available in 2mm

[spot]

Broad gauge sleepers ran longitudinally, not between the rails.

I'd looked at some photos on the Broad Gauge Society's site and I see what you mean, and cross-spacers every ten feet or so to hold the gauge. At first sight it's far more efficient in materials, I wonder what went wrong.

I think you'll find that the reason most people who wish to model brad gauge use 4mm or 7mm scale is the availability of parts such as wheels, motors etc. which are not available in 2mm

I'm only a week into scratching the surface of how people model a segment of railway and I can see that looking for specific pre-built models in either broad or standard gauge is a task most likely doomed to failure. Disguising something manufactured goes a certain distance, beyond which finding a source of those parts which are beyond creation seems the only approach. My initial impression is that anyone aiming to include stock from before, say, 1890, is going to be scratch-building an awful lot of bodywork, I've seen very few models advertised which could pre-date 1910. I'm only saying this in the hope someone can say I'm merely unaware, and that actually...

[keerout]

Nope, as far as I know anything pregrouping = hens teeth...
There is hope; there is the landship train pack, but that is the only pre grouping RtR on the market.
Broad gauge in N, even with Brunel's fame, looks like it's all forgotten about 
Now I hope somebody is proving me wrong.... anybody?...
Gerard

[Moria]

Broad gauge sleepers ran longitudinally, not between the rails.

Mostly   theres always exceptions, and there was some GWR broad gauge cross sleepered tracks.

Including an example here from a pic in my collection  of rare and unique thingies



Admitedly rare, but often smaller lines and sidings, but as always it's the exception that proves the rule

I believe there was also some cross sleepering at Reading (not the mains), Exeter and possibly the Brixham branch in places, but I haven't found any photo proof yet.

Regards

Graham

[CarriageShed]

Brunel's Big Railway by Robin Jones shows plenty of drawings and a few photos of broad gauge lines. Even the ones with longitudinal sleepers have cross-braces that look the same as sleepers, spaced about one every three regular sleepers apart.