why is it??

[BROADTRAIN1979]

Now me goodlied untold all over the uk and scotland may be island i dont know and america austraila....friends, why is it that faraish only dcc ready half their locos and not others?? let me be specific hmmm ok take the 31 why isnt that the same as say, the 37 dcc ready? ok again, right diesels not dcc ready- you ready? good, here goes-08 04 (03 when available,) 31 25 33 44 40 45 46 50 55 the dcc ready ones 37 47 42 108 (20s when available)and the latter diesels 66s upwards now what is the reason they are built by the same company i mean my car i wouldnt buy half of one well i would id get the wife to lift and push me down the street save petrol wouldnt it erm no yer but no but yer but 10 seconds for the perfect answer and a special greens on toast sarney for you all.

[cloughie]

for the same reason they put totally different shades of red on the coaches in the  master cutler set and the dp1 deltic set, please select from the list below
they are bone heads
they are not bothered
they do not think
they use what they have got laying about
what do you think BT
cloughie

[poliss]

Are the non DCC ready locos older designs?

[longbridge]

Does make you wonder particularly when the Bachmann American outline elcheapo out of scale diesels in N Scale is available DCC ready, same manufacturer but I guess being an American company they look after their own first.

Example in Oz a cheap Bachmann  DCC ready American Diesel sells for $69au, cheapest non DCC Farish diesel sells for $139au.

[poliss]

Bachmann is Chinese owned, although the company is registered in an offshore tax haven somewhere in the Carribean.

[poliss]

Why?
1) Because they are old designs and they don't want to spend money updating them.
2) Because the UK was very late into DCC.
3) The majority of UK modellers seems to DCC is the work of the Devil and they 'don't want anything to do with it thank you'.
4) A lot of people think DCC is only for *large layouts, so they don't demand it from the manufacturers.

*Complete rubbish of course. DCC isn't about size. (Where have I heard that before?) It's about controlling your locos.

[quinntopia]

Does make you wonder particularly when the Bachmann American outline elcheapo out of scale diesels in N Scale is available DCC ready, same manufacturer but I guess being an American company they look after their own first. evil laugh

I don't know if the American stuff is in that good of shape from a 'DCC plug and play' perspective as you may thing....although I don't do American stuff, it seems like the idea of 'plug and play' for American stuff is you need to replace the board with an installed decoder that is specifically made for that loco...nothing like the "NEM 651" standard where you (mostly) expect that any old 6 pin decoder would work.  You ask an American hobby shop dealer if they have any 6 pin decoders they give you a strange look (even though Digitrax and TCS make them, they're perceived as some sort of European novelty).

Check out the sheer number of decoders just from Digitrax on this dealer's page: http://www.tonystrains.com/products/digitrax_decs_small.htm

[longbridge]

Does make you wonder particularly when the Bachmann American outline elcheapo out of scale diesels in N Scale is available DCC ready, same manufacturer but I guess being an American company they look after their own first. evil laugh

I don't know if the American stuff is in that good of shape from a 'DCC plug and play' perspective as you may thing....although I don't do American stuff, it seems like the idea of 'plug and play' for American stuff is you need to replace the board with an installed decoder that is specifically made for that loco...nothing like the "NEM 651" standard where you (mostly) expect that any old 6 pin decoder would work.  You ask an American hobby shop dealer if they have any 6 pin decoders they give you a strange look (even though Digitrax and TCS make them, they're perceived as some sort of European novelty).

Check out the sheer number of decoders just from Digitrax on this dealer's page: http://www.tonystrains.com/products/digitrax_decs_small.htm

Thanks for that information as I visualised a system similar to Hornby OO Gauge where its just a matter of plugging in

[poliss]

The difference with American locos is that the lights are on the circuit board, therefore you have to replace them with a decoder board. Some decoders cover several locos, it all depends on the length of the loco etc.

[upnick]

Farish  locos are  well  behind in the field of DCC  it seems  they hstill  have their head in the sand  about the  benefits of DCC.   

With the advent of the  six pin  decdoers this will help   but a lot still need hardwires  although  this is  made easy with the digihat  conversion  &  smaller decoders  for eg:   TCS Z2.   

I have converted a good few Farish loco  types  but prefer American  locos in either board or hardwires the boards dependant on type can  allow working ditch  lights  & in one case i fitted step lights as well in N scale 

[zwilnik]

If I were to make an educated guess, I'd say it's all to do with the scale of the market.

While N gauge is growing massively compared to what it used to be, it's still not a huge market and as each new model requires skilled design and specialised tooling, I'd say that even Bachman probably don't think it would be profitable to have the manpower and capital setup costs to create more than a couple of new engine models a year. Any 'new' products that can be done with re-releases of rolling stock made with old moulds and tools is potentially a lot more profitable, and new printing techniques means they can do different colourschemes and potentially improve the look of the old models a little.

I'd also guess that current CAD technology means that a bodyshell designed for OO gauge can be scaled down to N in a lot less time than it would take a designer to create one from scratch (thus the prototype Deltic within a year of the OO version), but the underlying chassis would still need to be specifically designed as the size of the actual motor and electronics doesn't scale down the same way.

Dapol appear to take a slightly different approach in making pretty much everything they do a 250 unit limited edition, but you'll notice that a large amount of their real trade is re-releases still. (actually I even have a sneaking suspicion that they only ever release 10 units of each run and put the other 240 straight on e-bay with a 50% markup as that's effectively what happens with any new Dapol release )

As far as DCC is concerned, it's only just becoming commercial in the sense that most railway modellers have heard of it and can fairly safely buy a standard controller and chips for their locos with only a few weeks of research. Commercially it's still really only for what we in the tech trade call the 'propellerheads' though, the leading edge of users that will put up with any potential issues to try the latest thing. So I can see why the manufacturers aren't holding back DC only models in favour of having an all DCC lineup.

[poliss]

DCC is tweny years old this year. British firms are so far behind the times I wonder how they survive. Solder points on circuit boards, how quaint.

[quinntopia]

DCC is tweny years old this year. British firms are so far behind the times I wonder how they survive. Solder points on circuit boards, how quaint.

Yeah, that is true.  I was just thinking about my trip to Gaugemaster last Fall...I wanted to get my first real UK locomotive....(clearly I'm shopping just based on how 'cool' I think they look since I'm fairly uneducated about what locomotives/trains run where in the UK...of course, I'm a prototype heretic anyway, but I digress), as I was shopping I knew I had to a locomotive equipped with the 6 pin plug...and there were several interesting ones which required soldering (What? Really?) but I didn't want the hassle.   I ultimately went with the Class 150 Central Lines DMU (mostly because it most closely resembled the Southern Lines train I had just taken down to Ford...and the detail on it is actually really nice) because it had the NEM 651, but it was probably my 6th or 7th choice (Class 37 in 'triple grey'? No.  Class 179 Cross Country? No. Class 158 Northern Rail? No. And on and on.

But honestly, I almost didn't get any of them.  And that would be too bad, because I'm sure both Farish and Her Majesties Revenue Collection Ministry would like me to provide some extra volume to the UK foreign currency reserves (I don't want to give it all to Germany, Japan, or China, so I'm happy to share with our friends across the pond!).

The thing is, if we all stopped buying locomotives that weren't truly DCC ready, GF (and others...I recall that even a few years back, a lot of the Fleischmann and Trix older models were only offered in Analog) would learn its lesson quick.  Its like Zwilnick said....they don't want to, or can't afford, to re-engineer or produce a lot of new stock each year, however, if they found that no one was buying any of the old analog only models, they'd quickly figure out how to adapt, right?

[Sailor Charon]

Goodly Daylode...
[Forgive me, I can't do Unwinese]
Do you remember Professor Stanley Unwin from when he was on the tele, or is it Hugh Dennis taking him off on the Now Show?
The main reason for a lack of DCC ready on some locos is the same as the reason for solid driving wheels on others. They're old Poole era models that they can't - or can't be bothered to - update at the moment. When, or if, they update (say) the 31 to the standards of the 24, then it will be,DCC ready. Likewise, when they update the 8F to the same standard as the Royal Scot or Jubilee, it will have see through wheels (and also be DCC ready)

[Claude Dreyfus]

As mentioned a few times, the overhaul of the Farish fleet has been an extremely drawn-out affair; and still far from complete. There are a good many models that are still to the Poole design - although many of the motors have been updated.

Anything new is DCC compatible, but do remember that DCC is still in the minority here. It's too expensive for an average starter set, and those locos that are affordable (£50.00 mark) ain't DCC compatible without some work that in many cases is beyond the reach of the 'beginner'.

Okay, so this example is 00, but I am admiring a very nice Hornby class 50 in large logo. It's DCC fitted, with sound, but costs a cool £200.00. The bog-standard 50 costs less than half that...for the average modeller is this £100.00 price difference worth it?

The point is that up until recently locos that are DCC compatible have cost more. I have no plans to go DCC, so why on earth would I want to pay a premium for something that I'm never going to use...surely the minority should pay the premium? Of course this attitude is what has probably held DCC back from being more wide-spread...but it was still a valid argument. It was, of course, not in Bachmann's interests to go to the trouble of fitting DCC compatibility as standard and making a loss; especially bearing in mind the size of the UK market. Only now is the landscape changing to make this a more vaible proposition.

Also, the Japanese market is widely admired for the diversity and quality of its models. Only Kato have DCC ready stuff...the others need varying degrees of work to make them suitable.