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Author Topic: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout  (Read 9143 times)

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Offline Mito

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #60 on: September 12, 2016, 05:35:32 pm »
It's looking good. Teething problems are all part of the fun.  :thumbsup:
You know you're getting older when your mind makes commitments your body can't meet.

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #61 on: November 01, 2016, 02:21:34 pm »
Hey guys,

Not posted in a while as I've been rather busy.

Not much has changed apart from I've put a layer of poly filler over the hillside and sanded that down nicely.

I was wondering what people might recommend for point motors? I don't need polarity switching just a nice quiet, smooth and not too expensive motor to move all the points.
After that is done I guess it's on with the ballasting and then weathering the track!

Offline newportnobby

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #62 on: November 01, 2016, 02:40:08 pm »

I was wondering what people might recommend for point motors? I don't need polarity switching just a nice quiet, smooth and not too expensive motor to move all the points.


Glad you're still with us!
You may be seeking something that doesn't exist. Seeps are cheap but tend to go over with a loudish thump. Tortoise slow action are quiet but IMO expensive. Hopefully others will talk you through Cobalts and Peco motors,
In all honesty quiet, smooth and not too expensive means you might be better off looking at wire in tube (if you don't have many points but I recall you have a lot) or maybe a servo system.

Offline PostModN66

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #63 on: November 01, 2016, 02:54:16 pm »
For a self-contained one-board layout like this I would go for Wire-in-Tube.  Very cheap, silent, very reliable, maintenance free and more authentic than point motors.

What's not to like  ???

Cheers  Jon  :)
“We must conduct research and then accept the results. If they don't stand up to experimentation, Buddha's own words must be rejected.” ― Dalai Lama XIV

My Postmodern Image Layouts

Lofthole http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=14792.msg147178#msg147178

Deansmoor http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=14741.msg146381#msg146381

Offline Mito

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #64 on: November 01, 2016, 06:12:39 pm »
+1 to that. :thumbsup:
You know you're getting older when your mind makes commitments your body can't meet.

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #65 on: November 01, 2016, 10:25:39 pm »
Hey guys just trying to figure this out.

Is there a minimum curve for WIT?

So far I know I need something like this:


However, points E and F should be really pulled from the same lever as they will never need to be independant.

Turquoise goes to G
Pink goes to D
Black goes to C
Yellow goes to b
Green and blue go to A for the two different options of the three way
Brown to E and Orange to F - but should pull together and in opposite directions.

Big blue rectange is the control area which will need to be next to the vesta which is in place. Looking at some lever systems and I love the look of Modratec. https://modratec.com/cart/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=31_32_13&zenid=4834efddb4ecab6cac2affe8bf3d5ea8

the 12 lever option is somewhat reasonably priced, and I could add in some manual operation semaphore signals.

What I need to know is, is this all feasible given the space constraints? Can you run these on top of the layout like a real life one? If not where's the best place to get items that can make this look more realistic?

Offline PostModN66

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #66 on: November 02, 2016, 08:49:49 am »
Hey guys just trying to figure this out.

Is there a minimum curve for WIT?



Depending on the thickness of wire used, min radius is about 3 inches.

This video shows the installation on Horseblock lane:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tPtxPdM_go

This thread may help...

http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=19227.msg195637#msg195637

Fans of Wire in Tube have their own opinions about type of wire, types of levers etc; you would have to come to your own conclusions.  The only tip I would give is to avoid bellcranks in the linkage - a headache and a maintenance liability!

Cheers  Jon   :)
“We must conduct research and then accept the results. If they don't stand up to experimentation, Buddha's own words must be rejected.” ― Dalai Lama XIV

My Postmodern Image Layouts

Lofthole http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=14792.msg147178#msg147178

Deansmoor http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=14741.msg146381#msg146381

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #67 on: November 02, 2016, 04:40:09 pm »
Hey guys great suggestions so far!

I have put together this little diagram in sigscribe to try to get my concept out there better.



Red levers are for signals, black are for points, black and blue are for pulling two points at the same time - so E/F and B/C would each share a lever and pull/push in opposite directions by looping the cable around. It saves on 2 levers which arent really needed here.

Ive added some basic stop signalling around the area. One from the engine shed, one from the headshunt into the goods area and one for each line heading towards the single Exit to the fiddle yard. If I add signals to the goods area I think Ill just have static ground semaphore - assuming that was used?

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #68 on: November 02, 2016, 09:13:54 pm »
 :censored: :censored: :censored:
Not a good evening at all!

I got a static grass applicator and some grass through today woooo
Decided to give it a go on a spare bit of wood with some pva just to see if it would work. Didn't really work well at all but I'm going for that it's down to being almost directly on wood.

Second issue was that as I removed the clip from the nail the rubber shrink wrap pulled away from the clip. You can probably see where this is going.
One decent jolt and a smell of burning later and the applicator needs repair. Already. The cup which was heat glued on has come off meaning I'll likely have to use epoxy to get it back on.

Somewhat disappointed. The grass looked ok I guess but not quite right. Will test on some insulation tomorrow after epoxying it all back together!

Offline keithbythe sea

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #69 on: November 04, 2016, 09:53:07 am »
Sad news with the applicator, hopefully you can repair it OK.

What brand did you buy? I am currently planning to buy one and some real market feedback would be helpful (rather than the random star ratings on certain web sites!).  :thankyousign:

Offline Croxy

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #70 on: November 04, 2016, 11:02:36 pm »
Thanks for posting the pics.....looking forward to seeing this layout as it progresses.........
If you like it run it......

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #71 on: November 14, 2016, 02:50:08 pm »
Afternoon all!

Just been playing around with the thought of point motors again. WIT would be lovely however given the track is already down it's somewhat difficult if not impossible to fit that in!
Maybe for an expansion!

I have been playing with the idea of a touch toggle interface from the guys at Berrett Hill in the US. http://www.berretthillshop.com/using-touch-toggles-in-a-large-model-railroad-panel/

Using that I have mocked up a control interface


In this example a train using controller 2 can pass from the fiddle yard to the second lane of the goods area whilst a train is being uncoupled and moved to the right of the main platform using controller 1.

The yellow backed buttons are isolators - turn green when track is live. Orange backed are point switches, alternate green - green on which side is active. Red backed switches are power feeds, these won't actually be buttons but indicators for which controller is controlling which part of the track - if not illuminated the track is not live.

The orange buttons with a single dot are joint point control, both points operate in unison and when illuminated green, it denotes that that path is accessible.

I'm pretty sure ill need 2 seep motors for the threeway point, and normal motors for everything else.

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #72 on: November 16, 2016, 09:57:55 am »
Morning all!

Sorry for another double post but thought I'd keep this up to date.

Last night I got some good old fashioned carpentry/salvage done. I've had some old bed slats in the garage for years, Id used most of them to put a shelf under my home made workbench. However, I have now used the last few (including one I had been testing static grass on for those eagle eyed among you...) to create  two H braces for the fiddle yard board!

All Glued and screwed together and I can find some more slats to go between the bars of the legs to create a little shelf.




I've ordered the  grainge and hodder traverser and am looking for tortoise point motors to go with the rest of it. The issue with the traverser is that it's 900mmx400mm, whereas the fiddleyard board is 600mmx600mm.

I'll sit two runners on top, one either side and put the traverser on top so I can pull it towards me so that the turntable can turn all the way around without having to move the layout away from the wall.




This diagram shows just how much the traverser needs to move to clear the back wall - the distance between the two dots is 275mm and my runners extend to 300mm. the purple hatch is the turn table turned so that its maximum distance from the green dot to the back wall is shown. red and yellow hatch shows the 90 degree turns


Think the plans pretty solid now. Just need to get on with it!


Offline newportnobby

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #73 on: November 16, 2016, 10:26:37 am »
Interesting. I'm looking forward to seeing how this develops.

Offline MrDobilina

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Re: GWR themed terminus and shunt layout
« Reply #74 on: November 21, 2016, 10:47:30 am »
Morning all!

I have had some success this weekend.  :beers:

I put together the Grainge and Hodder turntable and have wood glued the relevant parts together. There were 2 pieces that were slightly bent but a day of weights and glue on them and they seem ok now.

The height of the fiddle yard table needed to be reduced by about 130mm. The turntable is quite deep really, saying that I did have to add a few pieces of wood on the underside of the middle section so that I could affix the draw runners to the underside of the turntable mount.

One thing that I didn't see mentioned on the store page for the turntable is that you need an M6 bolt and nut. You can't buy these singly so I had to purchase 10 of them for the small sum of £5.51 :(

I also bought some more wood to fascia the front and sides at least, but haven't gotten around to that yet.

I've also ordered some tortoise point motors as well as terminal blocks and some 8 core cable. I plan on replacing the wiring underneath the board and to the control panel with this cable to tidy it up a lot. The terminal blocks will be placed at key locations to reduce the amount of wire that might need redoing in future. so at each point motor there will be an 8 way block so short wires can be wired into that from the point motor and then the thicker cable to the bus.

Finally, here is a quick video of the turntable in action - no rails put on it just yet.





 

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