!!

Not Registered?

Welcome!  Please register to view all of the new posts and forum boards - some of which are hidden to guests.  After registering and gaining 10 posts you will be able to sell and buy items on our N'porium.

If you have any problems registering, then please check your spam filter before emailing us.  Hotmail users seem to find their emails in the Junk folder.


Thanks for reading,
The NGF Staff.

Author Topic: European N gauge goofs  (Read 2291 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dickrowland

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 25
  • Country: gb
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2017, 07:21:43 am »
I found a couple of Artrain UIC green 2nds on Ebay, but at a quoted price of Euro 175.00 each I'll give them a miss for a while. I thought at first the quoted price was for a twin-pack or even a triple-pack but no, that was a single coach.
A pair would be nice for my early 1970s DB Moselbahn layout, but not at that price!

Offline weave

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1709
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2017, 02:06:49 pm »
I found a couple of Artrain UIC green 2nds on Ebay, but at a quoted price of Euro 175.00 each I'll give them a miss for a while. I thought at first the quoted price was for a twin-pack or even a triple-pack but no, that was a single coach.
A pair would be nice for my early 1970s DB Moselbahn layout, but not at that price!

Hi,

You might have missed it but Gordon did mention SNCF Lima DEVs when talking about bogies.

I can't seem to upload a pic but I've got a few and they are quite nice to me. There are a few on French ebay sites (ranging 30-50 euros). I've picked some up for £20 here new (ish).

The only boxed ones I have are LIMA 320883 (green) and 320882 (green/grey).

You might want to steer clear of Lima but as I said they seem OK to me and they could fit in with your plans.

Cheers weave  :beers:

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2017, 11:46:24 pm »

Transmondia own the Artrain moulds and are producing new versions with improved bogies.

...still waiting...


.
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2017, 11:55:38 pm »

You might want to steer clear of Lima but as I said they seem OK to me and they could fit in with your plans.


My Lima DEVs are some of the more efficient coaches I have. They date from the 'second generation' Lima manufacturing so the shape is good, and the 'now old fashioned' nature of the couplings etc is actually an advantage, as more up to date models often suffer from being 'too advanced' (eg nem pocket couplers have a tendency to wiggle up and down and decouple ( a massive problem on LS Models' SNCF USI coaches), whereas robust old fixed couplings stay together.

I actually put a couple of later Arnold tooled DEV bodies (better quality of markings than the Lima) onto the Lima chassis to get the best of both worlds.


.

.
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline woodbury22uk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 23382
  • Posts: 1365
  • Country: gb
    • Ebay
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2017, 12:28:09 am »
Agree Gordon. These came from heyday of Lima with the BB9400 electrics. I sold most of mine but still have some of the 8 compartment ones I converted to catenary greasing coach, exhibition coach, a France Telecom mess wagon, and some of the 9 compartment couchettes.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2017, 01:45:44 am by woodbury22uk »
Mike

Over-user of brackets and quotation marks

Membre 0196. Association Française des Amis du N (AFAN)

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2017, 01:03:16 am »
At my MR club tonight I had a rake running round a unitrack circuit with the following :

BB9300
REE yellow Allege postale
REE maroon Allege postale
Lima pre-UIC dark green DEV
Dynam OCEM 1st
Dynam all green UIC
Dynam all green UIC
Roco Bruhat

Despite four different makes mixed up, the set stayed together with no decoupling - and all but the REE postals have old fashioned fixed couplings


.
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline dickrowland

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 25
  • Country: gb
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2017, 07:06:35 am »
Are the Lima UIC coaches flush glazed?

Offline woodbury22uk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 23382
  • Posts: 1365
  • Country: gb
    • Ebay
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2017, 02:22:58 pm »
Are the Lima UIC coaches flush glazed?

They are DEV rather than UIC. The glazing is in my view accurate, being very slightly recessed from the bodyside as per the real thing. Have not got a photo of the base coach but here are some I converted long ago with one of the real coaches.





Mike

Over-user of brackets and quotation marks

Membre 0196. Association Française des Amis du N (AFAN)

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2017, 12:49:18 am »
We are straying off topic  because the conversation had turned to what is good not what is bad!

So, I've started a new thread  (see elsewhere) where I have put my latest contribution about the Lima DEV coaches
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2017, 12:40:17 am »
.

Another pup from Fleischmann...

781701

new 'starter set' described as 'Swiss private railway', but is pretty much total fantasy

stock:
a Murnau - Oberammergau DRG E69
two German Thunderbox 4 wheel coaches
one basic 4w flat wagon

all in red with a spurious Matterhorn-like symbol (wonder what MGB will think...)


.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 12:43:06 am by Gordon »
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline biela49

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 24
  • Country: es
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #25 on: November 14, 2017, 03:47:44 pm »
What were the differences between DB and SNCF UIC coaches?
With regard to the Fleischmann coach I presume that the bogies are French-outline, but can the coach body be modified in any way (apart from with a hammer!)?
Just curious.

At their beginning UIC coaches existed in two versions UIC-X and UIC-Y. Main difference is their length. UIC-X, as used in Germany, Italy, Spain, etc., are 26,4 m., while UIC-Y, as the french DEVs, are 24,5 m. Also the number of departments on each car; 10 on 1st and 12 on second, all 6 seats, for UIC-X, while 9 of 6 seats and 10 of 8 seats on UIC-Y.

After those arrived the UIC-Z, better known as Eurofima. Designed to offer air conditioning on all, some companies didn't to use air conditioning and then were two sub series, Z1 and Z2, with and without respectively, with 9 departments in 1st class and 11 on 2nd., all 6 seats.

(Learnt on Wikipedia)

 

Offline daffy

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 26722
  • Posts: 1140
  • Country: gb
  • Learning everyday
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #26 on: November 14, 2017, 04:39:39 pm »
.

Another pup from Fleischmann...

781701

new 'starter set' described as 'Swiss private railway', but is pretty much total fantasy

stock:
a Murnau - Oberammergau DRG E69
two German Thunderbox 4 wheel coaches
one basic 4w flat wagon

all in red with a spurious Matterhorn-like symbol (wonder what MGB will think...


I was wondering about this set Gordon, so thanks for confirming my suspicions.

BTW, it bears a lot of resemblance to another Fleischmann Starter set loco, of the 'Edelweiss Privatbahn'. Again, this is one I am unsure about its origin and authenticity. Ref is 737104, and these pics show the similarity. Seems the latest is a modification of the earlier issue to me, with different coaches etc, but perhaps you may be able to provide clarity:

737104 -

I note that some sellers show the operating company merely as 'Verschiedene', or various.

781701 -
« Last Edit: November 14, 2017, 04:56:05 pm by daffy »
Mike

Sufferin' succotash!

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2017, 01:38:57 am »

I was wondering about this set Gordon, so thanks for confirming my suspicions.

BTW, it bears a lot of resemblance to another Fleischmann Starter set loco, of the 'Edelweiss Privatbahn'. Again, this is one I am unsure about its origin and authenticity. Ref is 737104, and these pics show the similarity. Seems the latest is a modification of the earlier issue to me, with different coaches etc, but perhaps you may be able to provide clarity:

All fantasy.

They are getting their money's worth out of the moulding of the DRG E69 05 (a one off loco in real life!)

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAG_1_bis_5

They are using the DRG E69 like Triang/ Hornby used 'Nellie' etc
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 01:43:18 am by Gordon »
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline Gordon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 744
  • Country: 00
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2017, 01:58:58 am »

At their beginning UIC coaches existed in two versions UIC-X and UIC-Y. Main difference is their length. while UIC-Y,  are 24,5 m. Also the number of departments on each car; 10 on 1st and 12 on second, all 6 seats, for UIC-X, while 9 of 6 seats and 10 of 8 seats on UIC-Y.

With the French UIC Y, the main immediately obvious difference is the really shape and styling rather than the length.

In fact the arrangement of the compartments (not departments) on the SNCF UIC coaches was not fixed, there were many variations.

.
Sometime Publicity Officer, N Gauge Society

Swiss Railways Consultant
French Railways Consultant
European railway expert

First British N loco (in 1972): Farish GER Holden tank!
Modelling French N gauge since 1975
Modelling Swiss and German N gauge since 1971

Offline woodbury22uk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • N Gauge Society Number: 23382
  • Posts: 1365
  • Country: gb
    • Ebay
    • Facebook
    • YouTube
    • Awards
Re: European N gauge goofs
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2017, 06:32:36 am »

At their beginning UIC coaches existed in two versions UIC-X and UIC-Y. Main difference is their length. while UIC-Y,  are 24,5 m. Also the number of departments on each car; 10 on 1st and 12 on second, all 6 seats, for UIC-X, while 9 of 6 seats and 10 of 8 seats on UIC-Y.

With the French UIC Y, the main immediately obvious difference is the really shape and styling rather than the length.

In fact the arrangement of the compartments (not departments) on the SNCF UIC coaches was not fixed, there were many variations.

.

The French UIC Y bodies fell into three categories:-

9 compartments - as an A9 (later A8x, B9, A4B5) with a baggage variant A7D (later B7D).
10 Compartments - as B10 day coach, B9c9x couchettes, the latter with two roof heights
9 compartments + service compartment - as A4B5(x) day coach, A4c4B5c5x couchettes (with two roof heights), B5Dd2 second class/Baggage.

As Gordon wrote they have a distinctive body outline which is shared with the restaurant cars from the DEV series, of which there are numerous variants as restaurants, cafeterias,childrens play coaches, discothèques, exhibition coaches, etc

Unlike in the later Corail series the UIC Y bodies used consistent window sizes, one for passenger compartments, and another narrower and shorter one for toilets and service compartments.
Mike

Over-user of brackets and quotation marks

Membre 0196. Association Française des Amis du N (AFAN)

 

Please Support Us!
November Goal: £55.00
Due Date: Nov 30
Total Receipts: £65.00
Above Goal: £10.00
Site Currency: GBP
118% 
November Donations


Advertise Here
anything