N Gauge Forum

Your Layout and Models => Layout Planning => Topic started by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 02:07:39 pm

Title: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 02:07:39 pm
Can anyone help identify locos and vehicles?


http://transportarchiveimages.zenfolio.com/p946691224/h106CAF18#h106caf18 (http://transportarchiveimages.zenfolio.com/p946691224/h106CAF18#h106caf18)


Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dean thom on March 11, 2013, 02:15:03 pm
some more info would be valuable. firstly, what part of the country? Dx
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 02:16:42 pm
It is Scotland as stated. Gleneagles Station
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: red_death on March 11, 2013, 02:39:02 pm
It is either a 21 or a 29.

Cheers, Mike
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 03:13:53 pm
It is either a 21 or a 29.

Cheers, Mike


Thanks Mike.  I am thinking you are correct
Class 21
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blue-diesels/6719790929/# (http://www.flickr.com/photos/blue-diesels/6719790929/#)
Class 29
http://railphotoprints.zenfolio.com/p321309302/h3DD3B826#h3dd3b826 (http://railphotoprints.zenfolio.com/p321309302/h3DD3B826#h3dd3b826)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: EtchedPixels on March 11, 2013, 03:37:25 pm
If the date is right almost certainly class 21 as the re-engine work for class 29 had only just begun. The fact they are in pairs also suggests this (they were that unreliable!)

Not really good enough an image  to identify the coaches.

There are a couple of kits for the class 21/29 neither of them particularly great. The Langley one is a white metal kit that can be fitted the Farish 25 chassis with class 20 bogie frames. It's an old white metal kit, it's not particularly detailed or fine. It is however not that hard to build, and is heavy so runs well.Some of the detail can be improved quite painlessly - eg filing the window frames thinner.

The second is the etched kit from Worsley Works which has its own set of problems including flat grilles that should be raised and a roof that at least on the kit I have bears no major resemblance to reality. Roof aside (and that can be reworked although it isn't easy to fix the sand fillers) it's a nice clean set of etches.

It's a common problem - just about every drawing and model of these locos I've seen has the roof badly botched. I've even seen magazine articles with a drawing right next to a photo that it doesn't remotely agree with. Seems everyone keeps copying each others invented detail !

Alan
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 03:45:22 pm
 :thankyousign:

Excellent commentary as always Alan.

Many thanks. I will file this now and await future developments. Maybe another 20 years and an RTR will turn up in n gauge.

 :claphappy: :claphappy:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: EtchedPixels on March 11, 2013, 04:21:14 pm
Or you could just buy a 3 car 170 in Scotrail livery 8-)

I believe the Dapol 26 would also be correct for the location and period along with some steam (eg the V2) hanging on. And of course the Wickham Railbus on the Crieff branch (now long gone) which is why I happen to have photos of Gleneagles to hand!

Alan
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 04:39:14 pm
Or you could just buy a 3 car 170 in Scotrail livery 8-)

I believe the Dapol 26 would also be correct for the location and period along with some steam (eg the V2) hanging on. And of course the Wickham Railbus on the Crieff branch (now long gone) which is why I happen to have photos of Gleneagles to hand!

Alan


Saving for Saltire 158 and 170. And of course your Wickham SC79969
 
There is plenty of RTR stuff for running including 4MT, Jubilee, Scots, A2, A4, Cl 25/26/27/40/47/50/66/67 and anything that ran Perth to Euston and Aberdeen to Buchanan and Queen St respectively. Have quite a collection of Gleneagles photos.

So I have a good lot already in the stable.

From the Worsley website...... (it doesn't look too bad really and the sound of blu-tack appeals)

http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/Image-Pages/Image_N_Class29-RH.htm (http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/Image-Pages/Image_N_Class29-RH.htm)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: EtchedPixels on March 11, 2013, 04:54:39 pm
Oddly enough my Worsley Works models are fitted to their chassis by bluetac as well !
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 11, 2013, 07:11:42 pm
Oddly enough my Worsley Works models are fitted to their chassis by bluetac as well !

That's encouraging. However...

I think I'd need someone to do the full job for me through, building to finishing and painting. Probably cost an arm and a leg!!
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dodger on March 11, 2013, 07:27:28 pm
The leading coaches look as though they are BR Mk1's in maroon livery.

Dodger
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dean thom on March 12, 2013, 01:10:45 am
It is Scotland as stated. Gleneagles Station

?????? when i first posted my reply the link wasnt there!!!! ??? ;D

Edit; sussed it! i posted a matter of seconds after you last edited yr post...i thought i was going mad for a mo. Dx
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on March 12, 2013, 07:34:21 am
It is Scotland as stated. Gleneagles Station

?????? when i first posted my reply the link wasnt there!!!! ??? ;D

Edit; sussed it! i posted a matter of seconds after you last edited yr post...i thought i was going mad for a mo. Dx

No worries, I had originally tried to upload a photograph. It didn't work so then edited to a link. Meanwhile you replied.

Sorry to have confused you.

 :laugh3: :laugh3:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 07, 2013, 01:48:10 pm
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GLENEAGLES-STATION-11TH-MAY-1963-6X4-COPY-PRINT-/360610253743?pt=UK_Collectables_Railwayana_RL&hash=item53f60bcbaf&nma=true&si=lfsFoIgCVVeSAwJ0mNskK9%252Bg1Mc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GLENEAGLES-STATION-11TH-MAY-1963-6X4-COPY-PRINT-/360610253743?pt=UK_Collectables_Railwayana_RL&hash=item53f60bcbaf&nma=true&si=lfsFoIgCVVeSAwJ0mNskK9%252Bg1Mc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557)

Another guessing game I'm afraid. The coach, not the loco. This is the branch train for Crieff from Gleneagles in 1963 when the railbus had failed.

Anyone identify the type of coach please?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dodger on April 07, 2013, 03:00:50 pm


Another guessing game I'm afraid. The coach, not the loco. This is the branch train for Crieff from Gleneagles in 1963 when the railbus had failed.

Anyone identify the type of coach please?

It looks like a Stanier BSK. You are right about the service. I read somewhere a class 5 was used so that the coal and water supplies were sufficient.

Dodger
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 07, 2013, 03:51:16 pm
http://www.flickr.com/photos/holycorner/8242188854/#in/set-72157631918193203 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/holycorner/8242188854/#in/set-72157631918193203)

I got another pic from the branch line itself. Says a Stanier and a Porthole Composite......???
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dodger on April 07, 2013, 04:54:56 pm
Thats another train. The first picture shows a Standard 5 and the second a Stanier 5. to me the coach in the first picture is definitely a Stanier and there looks like a lookout ducket at the far end making it a brake vehicle. The window nearest the loco dont look to be round, therefore not a porthole. it could be the same vehicle as the brake vehicle in the second picture, which is a Stanier BSK.

Dodger
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 07, 2013, 05:04:26 pm
Thats another train. The first picture shows a Standard 5 and the second a Stanier 5. to me the coach in the first picture is definitely a Stanier and there looks like a lookout ducket at the far end making it a brake vehicle. The window nearest the loco dont look to be round, therefore not a porthole. it could be the same vehicle as the brake vehicle in the second picture, which is a Stanier BSK.

Dodger

Now then, you've cleared up a mystery.. Standard 5 v. Stanier 5. I agree about the BSK possibly being the same vehicle in both pics. Intrigued by the coach farthest from loco in second pic referred to as a porthole composite.

Farish do the BSK but only in Crimson & Cream AFAIK

I'll need to dig out my black five to check if it is Standard or Stanier.......
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dodger on April 07, 2013, 05:16:48 pm
Five  of the very early standard 5's were allocated to Perth for a number of years.

One of the phases of Stanier coaches had round toilet windows, hence the name porthole.

dodger
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 07, 2013, 05:26:06 pm
Yes I understand some of the Standard 5's served their life at Perth shed.

Thanks for your help.

I got another interesting photo here http://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/5796327937/#lightbox/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/5796327937/#lightbox/)
 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: dean thom on April 07, 2013, 07:17:47 pm
its a Stanier coach for sure. beyond that i can't help further. Dx
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 07, 2013, 10:26:16 pm
Locomotive Railway Carriage & Wagon Review

Volume 36 (1930)

No. 450 (February)

Locomotive for Gleneagles Hotel, L.M.S.R. 63. illus.
0-4-0ST No. 16048 (Peckett WN 977/1904.


Looking for information on the above. Assuming this loco was for the hotel branch working would it have been there until the Crieff line closed?  Of course perhaps it was only for working at the hotel? Any info welcomed. Are these available in N?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: EtchedPixels on April 07, 2013, 11:24:21 pm
Locomotive for Gleneagles Hotel, L.M.S.R. 63. illus.
0-4-0ST No. 16048 (Peckett WN 977/1904.[/color][/font]

Looking for information on the above. Assuming this loco was for the hotel branch working would it have been there until the Crieff line closed?  Of course perhaps it was only for working at the hotel? Any info welcomed. Are these available in N?


Without knowing the dimensions and style its hard to guess. Peckett manufactured a lot of very small steam locos. N Brass do an etched kit of one GWR/SHT variation although chassis are tricky. Peco long ago did a very out of scale white metal one. You are probably looking a locomotive that is as short as a mineral wagon and not a lot higher, with a wheelbase of about 6'.

http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm (http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm)

gives a flavour
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 08, 2013, 11:33:06 am
Locomotive for Gleneagles Hotel, L.M.S.R. 63. illus.
0-4-0ST No. 16048 (Peckett WN 977/1904.[/color][/font]

Looking for information on the above. Assuming this loco was for the hotel branch working would it have been there until the Crieff line closed?  Of course perhaps it was only for working at the hotel? Any info welcomed. Are these available in N?


Without knowing the dimensions and style its hard to guess. Peckett manufactured a lot of very small steam locos. N Brass do an etched kit of one GWR/SHT variation although chassis are tricky. Peco long ago did a very out of scale white metal one. You are probably looking a locomotive that is as short as a mineral wagon and not a lot higher, with a wheelbase of about 6'.

[url]http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm[/url] ([url]http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm[/url])

gives a flavour


Thanks for that Alan. I had found the link yesterday to that site. Very informative. It's what made me wonder if the Peckett would have been used solely at the hotel or taken wagons down to the station yard.
 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: 1whitemoor on April 08, 2013, 11:57:10 am
Locomotive for Gleneagles Hotel, L.M.S.R. 63. illus.
0-4-0ST No. 16048 (Peckett WN 977/1904.[/color][/font]

Looking for information on the above. Assuming this loco was for the hotel branch working would it have been there until the Crieff line closed?  Of course perhaps it was only for working at the hotel? Any info welcomed. Are these available in N?


Without knowing the dimensions and style its hard to guess. Peckett manufactured a lot of very small steam locos. N Brass do an etched kit of one GWR/SHT variation although chassis are tricky. Peco long ago did a very out of scale white metal one. You are probably looking a locomotive that is as short as a mineral wagon and not a lot higher, with a wheelbase of about 6'.

[url]http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm[/url] ([url]http://www.martynbane.co.uk/peckett/locos.htm[/url])

gives a flavour


Thanks for that Alan. I had found the link yesterday to that site. Very informative. It's what made me wonder if the Peckett would have been used solely at the hotel or taken wagons down to the station yard.
 :thankyousign:


Someone on the RMweb industrial section will probably know:

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/145-uk-standard-gauge-industrial/ (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/145-uk-standard-gauge-industrial/)

I had a quick look, but I can't find anything on it online. It's in an IRS (industrial Railway society) book which someone will have. Sadly it's one of the volumes which is not available online.

It could be any (of early design) size. It's an earlier Peckett, so perhaps an "R2" class which were pretty common and of 0-4-0 design.

As Etched pixels points out, they're not well represented in N. My Peckett is the N brass locos version, but I have chosen to model one with inside cylinders as it's much simpler. Put simply, there's no scae chassis available with outside cylinders.

I hope that's of some help

Paul A.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 08, 2013, 12:06:49 pm
 :thankyousign:

Paul, I'll give that a try. Just looking for the info at moment.

Brian
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 16, 2013, 05:51:20 pm
Well, it is almost twenty years since I developed an interest in Model Railways, n gauge in particular.
I guess it was becoming a father that did it. Took son to shows, bought some trains to play with and set up track ovals on dining tables etc.

Over time I did some research on a station I used often but more as it was close to my heart being near my at one time family home. This was Gleneagles Station.

I had many contacts over the years who passed on drawings etc. but I stored them for some day when I get round to doing a layout.

Well, redundant and retired I am at long last getting all the stuff out of boxes bit by bit. Today I came across Signalling/Track layout diagrams from 1953 which show the simplified layout in place before closure of much of the layout in 1964. The plans were passed to me by a Peter Stanton, worked as a D&C Manager Birmingham for Railtrack, for which I am grateful. We lost touch and he wasn't able to give me a good deal more stuff he was intent on obtaining.

Well, here is a bash at drafting the layout. Poetic license to the Perth end where a loco servicing area will appear instead of the engineer's coup.

Happy to hear your ideas as always.

Brian

This is first attempt and a bit of a paste-up. Will do again in code 55.

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Gleneagles.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 17, 2013, 09:15:38 pm
Well, I got it done in Code 55 but it'll take time to get the photo up I think.....
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 22, 2013, 03:34:25 pm
Full station area and branch line with loco facilities. Based on Gleneagles 1953 track plan.

Now I just have to fit it in my garage......

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Glen Full.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 22, 2013, 09:47:30 pm
Full station area and branch line with fictional loco facilities. Based on Gleneagles 1953 track plan. Planning to run as a mainline/heritage set-up but combined with regular freight option up branch line...........

Now I just have to fit it in my garage......

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Glen%20Full.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: port perran on April 22, 2013, 09:51:04 pm
Looks very interesting.
Where's the Golf Course ?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 22, 2013, 09:58:24 pm
 :laughabovepost:

It is across the road and behind the back scene.........
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: ScottyStitch on April 24, 2013, 12:07:12 pm
Excellent plan.

I shall be following this closely   :)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on April 26, 2013, 02:21:21 pm
Now then, I've got the measurements for the layout now. It needs to fit within 2.9m by 2.4m in my garage.

The plan comes in at 2.76m x 1.86m so far so good. A few things to tidy up due to using trial version of Anyrail, but the basics is now there....

What baseboard system to use?

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Glen%20Full2.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Geoff on April 26, 2013, 02:46:04 pm
Now that is a nice layout only if I had the space, I wish you the best of luck with that, personally I would use 9mm ply but that is my opinion.

Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on April 26, 2013, 10:23:51 pm
I seriously suggest you run the fan of LH points at the right hand end of the outer fiddle yard (top right) from a LH point off the curve so as to avoid the kink of turning left then right into the yard. You'll also get slightly longer tracks in the outer fiddle yard as a result :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 04, 2013, 05:38:04 pm
Ok, now I have reduced it and re-allocated elements to fit in a space 2.9m by 1.8m

Not sure I have addressed all concerns as yet.

(http://arrachogaidh.eu/Glen%20Full3.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 05, 2013, 11:18:19 pm
I seriously suggest you run the fan of LH points at the right hand end of the outer fiddle yard (top right) from a LH point off the curve so as to avoid the kink of turning left then right into the yard. You'll also get slightly longer tracks in the outer fiddle yard as a result :thumbsup:

Yes, I see what you mean. I've played around with it and will incorporate that in next update. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

I also got my scaling wrong on the bottom half of the layout. 1.2m instead of 0.9m so some adjustment to do..... :dunce:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: mr magnolia on May 06, 2013, 07:34:39 pm
Cool plan. Lots of wires...
Are you going to have a hole to pop up through to interfere with what's going on ( or off) the tracks? Or are you able to access all sides?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 06, 2013, 08:02:55 pm
Cool plan. Lots of wires...
Are you going to have a hole to pop up through to interfere with what's going on ( or off) the tracks? Or are you able to access all sides?

All wires will be underneath, no OHLE here....  :help:  I see what you mean about accessing the track. There will be access all round and all track will actually be within an arms length so should "The Hand of God" be required to rescue anything it should be manageable.

But we are a way to go before we get to that stage as yet.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 10, 2013, 07:38:52 pm
Ok, revised the top RH corner as suggested.

I think this is now near enough finalised.

Wondering about DCC for this.

(http://arrachogaidh.eu/Glen%20Full4.jpg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Mustermark on May 10, 2013, 08:49:20 pm
Very nice indeed. 8)

That looks like a bit of a complication with the reversing loop formed by the Comrie branch line...  :confused1:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Leo1961 on May 10, 2013, 09:27:08 pm
Can I suggest a change to the top right to allow you up to 18% more track for the same space?

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/thumb_5016.bmp) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=5016)

or to maximise storage space even more, a change that adds nearly 33% more track!

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/58/thumb_5017.bmp) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=5017)

Of course if you have other ideas for this space, feel free to ignore my suggestions  :)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 10, 2013, 11:52:29 pm
Can I suggest a change to the top right to allow you up to 18% more track for the same space?
or to maximise storage space even more, a change that adds nearly 33% more track!
Of course if you have other ideas for this space, feel free to ignore my suggestions  :)

Wow, Can I do that?  I'll give it a try...... Will post result next week.

Thanks Leo1961
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 11, 2013, 01:52:19 pm
I was so intrigued by the suggestion from Leo that I've redrafted the layout. Certainly increases the storage area. Needs a bit of tidying but may now be ready to go......

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Glen%20Full5.jpg)
 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Leo1961 on May 11, 2013, 02:09:45 pm
Looking good  :thumbsup:

One to watch  :beers:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on May 11, 2013, 04:50:36 pm
Although I concur with Leo's 18% arrangement, I have grave doubts about the 33% variation :hmmm:
It may look OK in a drawing, but do you think you'll be able to fit those nice curves onto your baseboard and then run everything you want to run round them? :worried:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Leo1961 on May 11, 2013, 05:43:20 pm
Although I concur with Leo's 18% arrangement, I have grave doubts about the 33% variation :hmmm:
It may look OK in a drawing, but do you think you'll be able to fit those nice curves onto your baseboard and then run everything you want to run round them? :worried:

It should be alright as the tightest curve is standard radius 1 and all of the others are a lot less strict  :thumbsup:

As for the gaps, the software ( SCARM ) isn't always as accurate as you would lay it in real life, so there should still be sufficient for the longest two pieces of rolling stock to pass without contact.

But, of course, the proof will be in the laying  :drool:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 11, 2013, 07:11:37 pm
Hi Leo and Newport,

I don't think the curves are particularly tight and they are all on the flat so I am prepared to give it a go. I will still play around experimenting with curved points etc. to try and ease the situation. When looking behind the scenes at shows I am always interested in fiddle yards and some have very tight curves.

My main concern is with the Branch Line which has to rise and fall and negotiate curves. Main use will be short local trains or railcars but I have a secret plan to link in with a layout I saw some years ago where heavy freight emanated from St Fillans which is west of Comrie....... And of course as the Branch is now "Heritage Owned" some other specials may run up there...... :wave: :wave:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on May 12, 2013, 09:53:10 am
Problem with curved points is that Peco ones are only available in long and nothing smaller. Fine for main running lines but take up too much space in branch line and fiddle yard areas.
I hope you can get it to fit as Leo's suggestion is a good 'un.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 12, 2013, 12:55:49 pm
Yes Newport, a good idea. The points would always have their restrictions no matter where located so moving them slightly shouldn't really be an issue, I hope....

 :beers:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 12, 2013, 03:22:27 pm
Problem with curved points is that Peco ones are only available in long and nothing smaller. Fine for main running lines but take up too much space in branch line and fiddle yard areas.

I know it is probably a cardinal sin to mix track from manufacturers but I do have a variety of Peco, Minitrix and Roco in the toolbox. I was however looking to start afresh with Peco 55 as much as possible.

I think now is the time to start seriously planning the baseboard as the layout seems to have neared completion.
 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 13, 2013, 08:29:44 pm
To ensure portability if it should ever meet exhibition standard no baseboard will longer than 1.6m.

I think I am now satisfied with the layout. Baseboards will probably be marine ply. Two of 1.4m x 0.9m (Fiddle yard) and one each of 0.4m x 0.9m, 1.6m x 0.9m and 0.8m x 0.9m for the front of the layout give or take a couple of mm.

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Glen Full7.jpg)

 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 15, 2013, 09:33:12 pm
So, having a final'ish layout plan and an understanding of portabilty influencing baseboard size I need to look at the sub baseboard layout i.e. beneath the marine plywood and also at control methods.

I have seen several modular type constructions and the normal 2x1 frameworks but not sure what is best.

Considering I have a fair number of locos in stock I am looking towards DCC operation of the entire circuit.

Any suggestions, advice, best practice would be welcome at this stage as it is very important to get the base correct.

cheers,

Brian :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 23, 2013, 02:05:03 pm
Happy to look afresh at things as my next version of the layout shows.
It is 2.9 by 1.9 so is I think acceptable for my intended location and utilises Code 55 up front and only Code 80 on the fiddle yard lead in area. I may have shortened the platform lengths which will compromise what can be used as stopping services. I'll see where that leads me next. Previously I had room for loco plus 6. I think now stopping trains will be loco plus 5. Not a disaster I guess. I think the main platforms are 125 m long. Not sure what that is in N Gauge cm. I have about 93cm main and 72cm branch platforms on the drawing.

(http://www.arrachogaidh.eu/Compromise.jpg)

I think it will work with almost all available locomotive stock. I will conduct tests beforehand to discover this. The hobby has evolved and many of the older vehicles which I have I think will sail through the layout. If newer models do not then their has perhaps been a compromise made by manufacturers regards ability versus finer detail.




There is still some tweaking to take place, but as a result of all your comments I think the result is more realistic than previously shown and thank you all for your advice.

Constructive assistance is always welcome.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 23, 2013, 10:19:42 pm
Thanks for the revised plan, I am still not sure the inclined section will work.
The best way to build the layout seems to be four, 1450 x 950 boards.  The inclined ramps and overhead section would be a separate structure supported from, and connected to the main boards.


Anyone care to comment?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Sprintex on May 24, 2013, 09:11:54 am
Can't see why the inclined section should be a problem?

It appears to have about 5' of length in which to rise on the left, allowing a clearance of 2" where it crosses the inner loop gives a 1:30 gradient, not ideal for steamers generally but since it's a branch line I'm guessing it will only have short trains anyway? Plenty of room the other side to lose height in so seems perfectly workable to me ;)


Paul
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Greybeema on May 24, 2013, 09:33:13 am
The alternativeis to build the baseboards as an open topped board with your track base on risers lifted up above the frame.  You could then have a track bed that rises and lowers so if one side rises as the other falls you can maximise the clearance whilst minimising the slope..  Remember that any clearance will need to allow for the thickness of the trackbed and rail height..
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on May 24, 2013, 12:42:22 pm
Don't forget if you fit point motors under the baseboard not to do it where a road, for example, passes underneath. Believe me. it's been done before :-[
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 29, 2013, 08:38:16 pm
The alternativeis to build the baseboards as an open topped board with your track base on risers lifted up above the frame.  You could then have a track bed that rises and lowers so if one side rises as the other falls you can maximise the clearance whilst minimising the slope..  Remember that any clearance will need to allow for the thickness of the trackbed and rail height..

That sounds a good practical solution. Would it complicate baseboards though?
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 29, 2013, 08:39:41 pm
Don't forget if you fit point motors under the baseboard not to do it where a road, for example, passes underneath. Believe me. it's been done before :-[

Yes, I am hoping to put out the baseboard construction to "Professionas" so I would hope that wouldn't be an issue but I guess wiser to know about this than not!
B
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Greybeema on May 29, 2013, 10:25:40 pm
The alternativeis to build the baseboards as an open topped board with your track base on risers lifted up above the frame.  You could then have a track bed that rises and lowers so if one side rises as the other falls you can maximise the clearance whilst minimising the slope..  Remember that any clearance will need to allow for the thickness of the trackbed and rail height..


That sounds a good practical solution. Would it complicate baseboards though?


Not really especially if you are using proffesional kit buily frames.

Here is my new build gallery:-  http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=media;sa=album;in=398 (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=media;sa=album;in=398)

I'm no carpenter so take a look and judge for yourself -
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 30, 2013, 07:17:09 am
Thanks Greybeema, that is great to see how the plan progresses to baseboard. That gives me more confidence going forward.

 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on June 02, 2013, 10:53:02 pm
Having to delay any forward movement on baseboards due to financial issues. Had horrific vet expenses for a dog which I then had to put to sleep.

Will need to wait a few months beore moving forward physically.

 :( :(
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Chetcombe on June 03, 2013, 02:45:42 am
Having to delay any forward movement on baseboards due to financial issues. Had horrific vet expenses for a dog which I then had to put to sleep.

Will need to wait a few months beore moving forward physically.

 :( :(

I hope you can take solace in the fact that you did everything you could, regardless of the vet bills. We did similar with one of our cats recently.

Despite the expense,I am sure you will get back on your feet before too long and maybe your new layout can be a legacy for your dog.

It takes a while, but I hope you get over your loss
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Sprintex on June 03, 2013, 04:16:43 am
Sorry to hear about your dog, never easy to lose a pet :(


Paul
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: daveg on June 03, 2013, 08:36:07 am
Sad news about your pet.

Always a tough thing to cope with-

Dave G.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on June 08, 2013, 11:45:23 am
 8) What lovely sunny dry warm weather we are getting. Spoilt really.

Anyway I stumbled across the "List of Materials" that you can get from AnyRail5 this morning.

Here is the news : -

Track lengths
NB-55, N Peco Finescale Code 55 NB-55. Turntable radius 151mm.   0.3 m
SL-300F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-300F. Flex 914.4mm. (wood)   76.41 m
SL-302F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-302F. Flex 914.4mm. (concrete)   0.97 m
SL-394F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-394F. Crossing 154mm. 10º   0.62 m
SL-E383F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E383F. Double crossover 271.5mm. 10º  (conductive frog)   2.18 m
SL-E386F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E386F. Right curved turnout 10º (conductive frog)   0.31 m
SL-E388F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E388F. Right turnout 163.5mm. (conductive frog)   0.95 m
SL-E389F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E389F. Left turnout 163.5mm. (conductive frog)   2.84 m
SL-E391F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E391F. Right turnout 123mm. (conductive frog)   4.69 m
SL-E392F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E392F. Left turnout 123mm. (conductive frog)   5.68 m
SL-E393F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E393F. Crossing 102.4mm. 20º  (conductive frog)   0.83 m
SL-E397F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E397F. Wye turnout 10º (conductive frog)   0.23 m
SL-E399F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 SL-E399F. Threeway turnout 153.25mm.   1.18 m
ST-1, N Peco Setrack Code 80 ST-1. Straight 87mm.   0.17 m
ST-15F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 ST-15F. Curve radius 263.5mm, angle 45º (R2)   0.41 m
ST-18F, N Peco Finescale Code 55 ST-18F. Curve radius 299mm, angle 45º (R3)   1.41 m
ST-3, N Peco Setrack Code 80 ST-3. Curve radius 228mm, angle 22.5º   0.9 m
ST-5, N Peco Setrack Code 80 ST-5. Right turnout 87mm.   3.19 m
ST-6, N Peco Setrack Code 80 ST-6. Left turnout 87mm.   4.61 m

Total track length:    107.89 m

I didn't realise there was a small code 80 straight and a curve. I'll need to track them down and eliminate. Also need to sort out wood sleepered track.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Sprintex on June 08, 2013, 11:51:09 am
10.2 scale miles of track :thumbsup:


Paul
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: daveg on June 08, 2013, 11:57:40 am
Bit chilly here in Severaloaks!

Any Rail is an excellent package IMHO.

The report is really when pricing kit up. Bit scary all that track but it'll be huge fun laying it down and making everything work!

Within the numerous plans I have 'for next time' there are the odd bits of set track. I tend to use them when I can't quite get the flexi in the right place.

Good luck with Gleneagles. Hope you can get to all of the track 'cos you what will happen!

Can't wait to see some pics.

Dave G
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: daveg on June 08, 2013, 12:01:24 pm
BTW, AnyRail can show you part numbers on the plan if you click the correct button!  :wave:

Dave G
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on June 12, 2013, 03:17:19 pm
BTW, AnyRail can show you part numbers on the plan if you click the correct button!  :wave:

Dave G

I used the Anyrail Forum. Chap there found problem straight away. I had a hidden layer I didn't know about. All sorted now and track requirements are reduced to 61.64m thankfully.

 :thankyousign:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: daveg on June 12, 2013, 03:24:40 pm
That's good news. Only a small fortune for track rather than a huge one, then!  :D

Actually it's the points that cost the real money, flexi is value for money, I think.

Dave G

Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on June 12, 2013, 04:28:16 pm
Yes flexi very good and better in bulk! Double Crossover will be 56 though!

Priced by MRD website it seems to total just over 300

 :claphappy:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on July 02, 2013, 03:07:19 pm
No real progress to report. Money is a big issue at moment due to one dog illness and death and one dog dental work not being fully covered by insurance. Had to outlay over 4k these last few weeks. Credit card thankfully. Got 1800 back so far. May get some more in next week or so.....  but then again ......

That is a big restriction on progress.

Second restriction is that I have Dupeyetron's Contracture in both hands, left one being worse is now ready for surgery so that will take place in next 12 weeks. The right one is not as advanced and will hold for another year.

So, that will be surgery and then recuperation, physio etc. So we have to look longer term now.

I want to plan a Continental layout so I can manage that on the pc.

Touring in motorhome for a week in July so operation will be August/September time.


Brian  :beers:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: scotsoft on July 02, 2013, 03:15:34 pm
Hello Brian,

Sorry to hear about the loss of your dog and the other expensive health problems, then on top of that your impending operation.  I can only hope you are blessed with decent weather for your motorhome trip.

cheers John.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on July 02, 2013, 05:09:13 pm
Sounds like you have been in the wars a bit lately, Brian :(
I hope you have a smashing break and that things improve for you soon :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: daveg on July 02, 2013, 05:49:24 pm
Blimey!

Sorry to learn that life has knocked you about a bit recently, Brian.

Hope that your week away will be enjoyable and forthcoming op lets you enjoy your hobby again.

Take it easy and please keep us posted on how you are doing.

Dave
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Brinley on July 04, 2013, 12:08:29 pm
Would it be in bad taste to say "Break a leg"?  :D
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on July 04, 2013, 02:29:05 pm
Would it be in bad taste to say "Break a leg"?  :D

 :laugh:

Probably, My wife badly broke her ankle last August.

 :hmmm:
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Brinley on July 05, 2013, 07:03:06 am
Ouch. Sorry..... :-[
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on May 20, 2016, 04:53:55 pm
Courtesy of Alan Cox of Etched Pixels fame and Richard Boothby I now have a completed and motorised Wickham Railcar for Scottish Region.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/0/thumb_39841.JPG) (http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=39841)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: port perran on May 20, 2016, 08:38:05 pm
That looks really nice.
I'm very envious.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Chris in Prague on May 20, 2016, 08:59:55 pm
It's similar to (but not the same, of course) to AC Cars Railbus W79977/8 (1964 to 1967) which were based at St. Blazey used on a shuttle service to Bodmin North from June 14th 1964, connecting with trains from Wadebridge to Bodmin Road at newly opened exchange platforms at Boscarne Junction, and also certain trips to Wadebridge. Now, I'd really like to have one of those for off-season services.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on October 12, 2017, 04:44:25 pm
Reviving this thread again.

Sadly not much progress to date due to all sorts of issues! Let's just call it "Life".

Still been purchasing items though.

Had yet another operation to relieve Dupytren's Contracture in my right hand (second time) Got left one done second time in February.

So at least I can start to get my hands working again which should allow me to get the garage cleared so I can make room for the railway.

Hopefully I'll be able to report more progress.

Regards
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Chris in Prague on October 12, 2017, 04:49:41 pm
I do hope all will soon be well with your hands and that you'll be able to get on with your layout.
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Arrachogaidh on October 12, 2017, 06:17:30 pm
Current revised layout with added backscenes storage and a new access road onto layout.

At stage now to send off to check feasibility of build by professional builder.

(http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/gallery/56/1767-121017180547.jpeg)
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: Train Waiting on October 12, 2017, 06:50:48 pm
That's a magnificent plan.  'N' gauge at its best.  And nice to see that you have space for Comrie.

I wish I had known Gleneagles then.  It was 1976 before I knew it.  A lot happened in that 14 years!

Best wishes.

John
Title: Re: Gleneagles circa 1962
Post by: newportnobby on October 12, 2017, 08:44:05 pm
Oh heck :goggleeyes: :goggleeyes: :goggleeyes:
All those points, motors wiring etc



At stage now to send off to check feasibility of build by professional builder.


For me that would be the only way