Wheels

Snowwolflair · May 04, 2018, 03:42:50 PM

It should be straightforward to have wheels, muffs and spacers compatible with the 2mm system.

What no one has mentioned yet is the 2mm system of gears and motors as well vastly simplifying the design of chassis.

BR Signalman · May 04, 2018, 04:15:49 PM

I have used 2mm wheels on N. A Dapol Collett 0-4-2, however, I did also buy the 2mm chassis for them to go on. Scuttles along quite nicely with a permanently coupled Autocoach which also picks up power.

JanW · May 04, 2018, 04:21:39 PM

Using 2mm scale wheels on standard n gauge track will not work.
I have a layout with handbuilt track to nmra standards with flangeways of only 0.7mm.
Just measured the flangeways of Peco track and they are 1.2mm on the crossing V.
The 2mm scale wheels will just disappear in them...
Even on my own layout wagons with rp25 wheels run better than the ones with 2mm scale wheels.
I would be very interested in n gauge driving wheels, if they are made to rp25 profile (1.8 mm wide).
About quartering: it really is not that difficult. Start with one axle and set it to approx. 90 degrees. Does not have to be exactly 90 degrees!
Then adjust the second axle so that everything turns smoothly.
If the second one is OK go to the third and adjust until everything turns smoothly again and you're done.
Of course the coupling rods should only be attached to the axles one by one. So for the second axle only connect it to axle 1 and 2. Then to 1,2 and 3 and so on (if you start with a 9F you have a nice challenge

I have also quartered rtr loco's bought second hand. (last one was a Dapol 45xx) so it will be a skill you can use more often...

Dorsetmike · May 04, 2018, 04:59:18 PM

QuoteWhat no one has mentioned yet is the 2mm system of gears and motors as well vastly simplifying the design of chassis.

I cheat I use UM tender drives

Snowwolflair · May 04, 2018, 05:01:22 PM

Quote from: Dorsetmike on May 04, 2018, 04:59:18 PM
QuoteWhat no one has mentioned yet is the 2mm system of gears and motors as well vastly simplifying the design of chassis.

I cheat I use UM tender drives

But that does not work on a tank loco

CarriageShed · May 04, 2018, 05:21:24 PM

Quote from: Snowwolflair on May 04, 2018, 05:01:22 PM
But that does not work on a tank loco

In which case could we concentrate on tender locos for now... perhaps Drummond locos... not that I'm even slightly biased of course...

More practically though, if a working solution could be worked out for one tender loco then thought could be given to other classes and types afterwards. Do we need a wheel-making version of Revolution Trains...?

Dorsetmike · May 04, 2018, 06:07:40 PM

Quote from: Snowwolflair on May 04, 2018, 05:01:22 PM
Quote from: Dorsetmike on May 04, 2018, 04:59:18 PM
QuoteWhat no one has mentioned yet is the 2mm system of gears and motors as well vastly simplifying the design of chassis.

I cheat I use UM tender drives

But that does not work on a tank loco

Stop nit picking!

BR Signalman · May 06, 2018, 10:56:49 PM

Using 2mm scale wheels on standard n gauge track will not work.

Really? I must go and put some signals back to danger, stop her and tell 1454, she doesn't work.

JanW · May 08, 2018, 08:31:58 AM

Quote from: BR Signalman on May 06, 2018, 10:56:49 PM
Using 2mm scale wheels on standard n gauge track will not work.

Really?

Of course I have seen your post about the 14xx and maybe I should be more specific.
And I think I have learned something thanks to your 1454

My theory is that fixed chassis with six or more wheels will work because it is no problem if one of the wheels hangs in the air. Which it does on Peco track.
That is certainly an opportunity to use the 2mm scale wheels for specific locos
but I think that you will have serious problems with bogies or pony trucks.
I wanted to be sure so I just tested a wagon with 2mm scale wheels on a code 55 large radius turnout and there is no way to get this wagon through the point reliably.
It just bumps through.

I hope this clarifies why I said that 2mm scale wheels and Peco pointwork don't go together. There seems to be an exception to this for a rigid chassis but I wouldn't advise other modellers to use finescale wheels without reservations.

acook · May 08, 2018, 10:12:34 PM

Hi Folks,
This is a very interesting topic, I looked at the differences in N/2mm wheel standards last year.
Playing with the numbers and geometry, the increased thickness of n wheels allows the tread to roll along the diverging rail before being picked up by the frog, so they still dip due to the taper, but by a minuscule amount.
2mm wheels are thinner so fall into the gap as they do not ride the diverging rail.
I thought about setting the back to back wider, but there is then the problem of curve clearance.
The point about the rigid chassis is interesting, six-coupled would hang one wheel in the air, the other 5 on the track.
Bogie wheels are not an issue as n gauge spoked tender wheels are available.
I always find a practical example is the best way to analyse the problem, so from the previous posts, lets try a design example, and say I want seethrough spoked wheels on my Union Mills 4-4-0.
Bachmann spoked wagon wheels for the bogie (tick), that leaves the drivers.
2mm drivers fall into the gap so from the rigid chassis theory, if the bogie vertical movement is restricted such that it carries the leading driver over the gap, and the tender connection supports the trailing driver over the gap then that would solve that problem.
This solution then brings track vertical curvature into play,where all the drivers could be lifted off at the bottom of a gradient for example.
Hmm more thought needed.
Cheers
Alan

Izzy · May 09, 2018, 09:20:33 AM

I have used 2mmSA 2fs wheels on N gauge track by using an increased btb of 7.9mm. This is the N btb of 7.5mm plus the flange width difference - 0.2mm x2 (0.5mm v 0.3mm). In this way the outer measurement over the root radius of the flanges stays the same so no difference with getting around curves. It's true the wheels can drop into peco 55 width flangeways, especially with short wheelbase 4 wheel wagons, but then so do the same type with N wheels in my experience.

Izzy

CarriageShed · May 10, 2018, 04:21:40 PM

I just happened to be reading an article last night about the 3mm Society producing its own wheels for loco builds. The 2mmFS chaps do the same for their efforts, so shouldn't the N Gauge Society be doing something similar? (Hopefully I haven't missed a long-running discussion of many moons ago which covers this very topic.)

Snowwolflair · May 10, 2018, 04:27:00 PM

Quote from: CarriageShed on May 10, 2018, 04:21:40 PM
I just happened to be reading an article last night about the 3mm Society producing its own wheels for loco builds. The 2mmFS chaps do the same for their efforts, so shouldn't the N Gauge Society be doing something similar? (Hopefully I haven't missed a long-running discussion of many moons ago which covers this very topic.)

No but you may have dug up a corpse from the early 80's, but most of the "young chaps" who run the N SOC these days were probably still at school in these days and it might very well be time to revisit the topic.

My vote would be to cooperate with the 2mm boys to provide N variant parts that go with their range of gears etc.