who will take on the class 50 now?

[Paddy]

Try doubling that to best part of 20% of the market. Given the NGS has approx 6k members and there are still significant numbers of N gauge modellers who aren't members I'm sure that 2.5k-4k would be a gross underestimate.

Cheers, Mike

Thanks Mike - I feel much moro positive about N gauge now.

Paddy

[railsquid]

Wasn't it earlier discussed that Kato had their own factory... They aren't trying to get slots in another production line owned by others and more than likely have their own team to build up the molds.

These two facts make Kato unique in what they can achieve, especially as Ben says, they deal with a minimum of 10,000 Units. This could be for outsiders/commission jobs only though...

Kato do indeed have their own in-country factories and half-a-century of continuous production experience.

These two facts make Kato unique in what they can achieve, especially as Ben says, they deal with a minimum of 10,000 Units. This could be for outsiders/commission jobs only though...

Yep - 10,000 is a 'small batch' for outsiders/commission jobs... For their own releases they're looking for 4 or 5 times that as the minimum run...

40-50,000 models of one type albeit across liveries... I find those sorts of sales figures hard to digest. Probably because we're constantly reminded this is a dying hobby in this country but I've heard that the far east still love their trains just like we used to.

I can't speak for other countries in the region but if you live in a city in Japan, your location is usually very much described in terms of proximity to the nearest station. Living in a suburb of Tokyo, I can wander down to my local shopping area (centred around the local station) and pick up half-a-dozen railway magazines, and 3 or 4 model railway publications which are mainly focussed on N gauge. As well as a couple of publications on the history of the local line. Moreover I can go over to the kiddies section and find at least one child-orientated book featuring trains from the local line, and a whole bunch of others featuring trains in general.

The Japanese are more into N gauge than the UK, probably because house space is at more of a premium. The population of Japan is about twice that of the UK. These to factors must have quite a big effect on volume.

Looking at recent housing data, it seems the average UK new build house is smaller than the legal minimum in Japan... But yes, Kato (and to some extent Tomix) have done very well from promoting track systems which can be laid out on an ad-hoc basis, and N is the dominant scale.

Hi there,

It is very difficult to quantify the numbers of N gauge enthusiasts, as there are so many factors to consider.  Continental or British?  Modeller or Collector?  N Gauge only, or mixed scale?  Serious enthusiast or one-off purchaser?

I have seen estimates that there are 25000-40000 enthusiasts in the UK, whereas in Japan there are several million.

This may seem hard to believe, but when you look at websites such as HobbySearch http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/rail/ which have literally dozens of new models coming to the market every week, and compare that to the release rate of Farish and Dapol models, it does become more plausible.

My local railway company (Seibu) has just introduced a new train into regular service (the 40000 series if anyone's taking notes); Kato brought out the N gauge model to coincide with that. Admittedly Kato has a slight bias towards Seibu as their HQ is sandwiched between two Seibu lines, but overall if there's a new train coming into service, you can bet one of the majors (Kato, Tomix, MicroAce, GreenMax) will be not far behind. There's also Tomytec (a branch of the same conglomerate as Tomix) which puts out obscurer stuff as unmotorized models which can be motorized and otherwise improved, partly with 3rd party accessories.

Somewhere I've seen figures (can look up the reference if anyone really wants to know) which indicate the Japanese model railway industry is (even at current exchange rates) worth about GBP 500 million per annum, 90% of which is in N. I challenge you to find any mainly N gauge manufacturer with a plusher HQ and shop than Kato's Tokyo location.

PS I was privileged to meet the current Mr. Kato himself last year, very nice chap who clearly knows his trains.

[Newportnobby]

PS I was privileged to meet the current Mr. Kato himself last year, very nice chap who clearly knows his trains.

I believe he is a model citizen

[Western Exile]

If only we could somehow get the Japanese interested in the British railway scene, then problem solved! 

[Black Cloud]

I've come late to this topic and had a quick look through a number of the comments, but not all of them, so apologies if anyone has already said what i'm about to say. Given that the original Farish 50 sat on the same chassis as the class 55 surely it is not a stretch too far to develop a new/improved 50 body to sit on a modified BachFar 55 chassis which is already DCC ready. Yes there would be a development cost but I am sure that would be recouped in sales judging from the comments on this forum. Whilst it is not quite the same as a completely new retooled model we could at least have something that looks like a 50 (and for those of us modelling late 60s/early 70s we could even have an 'as built' version). Alternatively, perhaps there is scope for a kit manufacturer to develop a body to sit on a modified 55 chassis.

[Newportnobby]

Alternatively, perhaps there is scope for a kit manufacturer to develop a body to sit on a modified 55 chassis.

Seems a reasonable suggestion - possibly one for the 3D guys to have a stab at

[Nik96]

Alternatively, perhaps there is scope for a kit manufacturer to develop a body to sit on a modified 55 chassis.

Seems a reasonable suggestion - possibly one for the 3D guys to have a stab at

If somebody has details/drawings for the bogies (I think this was mentioned as an error) I can get going with it imminently.

[Ben A]

Hello all,

The 50 and 55 bogies are the same English Electric design, that is the advantage of starting with the Deltic.

The issue is the main dimensions. According to data from the Railway Centre the Deltic is 69'6 long, with a wheelbase of 59'6, whereas the 50 is 68'6 long, with a wheelbase of 56'2, meaning that even if the chassis is not too long, the bogies will be in the wrong position.

These issues can be solved with a new chassis block and driveshafts, but it is not trivial in my view.

I think DP1 - the prototype Deltic - was slightly shorter but I don't know if it would be right, and I am not sure that many proud owners of that model would want to convert it!

Of course you could replace the Deltic body with a body for DP2 and have a prototype 50!

Cheers

Ben A.

[BrakeCoach]

Intercity livery maybe?

[Karhedron]

[Sprintex]

Lovely 

Intercity livery maybe?

No No No. Almost as bad as toothpaste south east! 

Wouldn't go insulting NSE too loudly given the Admin of this forum is a devout fan, might find you're unable to log in tomorrow 


Paul

[Tank]

No No No. Almost as bad as toothpaste south east! 

  Which many think was their best livery.

[njee20]

Later NSE I totally agree, far and away the best livery.

[davidinyork]

Hello all,

The 50 and 55 bogies are the same English Electric design, that is the advantage of starting with the Deltic.

The issue is the main dimensions. According to data from the Railway Centre the Deltic is 69'6 long, with a wheelbase of 59'6, whereas the 50 is 68'6 long, with a wheelbase of 56'2, meaning that even if the chassis is not too long, the bogies will be in the wrong position.

These issues can be solved with a new chassis block and driveshafts, but it is not trivial in my view.

I think DP1 - the prototype Deltic - was slightly shorter but I don't know if it would be right, and I am not sure that many proud owners of that model would want to convert it!

Of course you could replace the Deltic body with a body for DP2 and have a prototype 50!

Cheers

Ben A.

More specifically, with the Class 55 Farish have modelled the cast (rather than fabricated) variant of the bogies - Classes 37 and 55 have had both types fitted at various times, but Class 50s only ever had the cast ones. The Farish model of the prototype Deltic has the bogies represented (correctly) as fabricated ones - which would not be correct for a Class 50.

[red_death]

But could you tell in N scale at 2 foot? Bogie centre difference could be jarring but bogie fabrication? c'mon 

Yes you can - to me it is one of those things that once you've seen the difference you can't un-see it!

The 2nd and 3rd picture here demonstrate the different frames on the top part of the bogie: http://www.delticsounds.com/bogies.html

Cheers, Mike