Has anybody else had problems in the last few days? They asked me to change my password, however I was unable to complete that as theyh wanted an alternate phone &/or email for verification.
I don't need nor want a mobile phone, a/. can't justify the cost b/. no use for one; I don't want a second emai address, I've only ever had one at a time, initially AOL, then NTL world when AOL transferred their cable users many years ago. I would not want one of the free ones like hotmail, gmail or yahoo, they seem to attract the majority of hacking. I can't even access my MS account to cancel it!
The following is the response I got from MS when I tried to explain why
QuoteHello,
Welcome back to Microsoft account Support. I know it's inconvenient having to be constantly ask to provide alternate email and phone number. I totally understand where you are coming from. But we cannot disable this feature as this is system designed. Microsoft is implementing a security feature that will ask for a code when you try to access your account, billing, security information page and some Microsoft services or apps. This feature was designed to make sure that all your security proofs (alternate email, mobile number / Identity verification apps) are all updated. This also provides an extra layer of security to your account. The code can be sent to an alternate email address or a mobile phone number registered into your account. You will then use this code to access that particular site you wish to access.
However the steps we are taking are designed to ensure your account is as secure as possible. These steps are necessary for account security, and are covered in the terms of use located at: http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/legal/intellectualproperty/copyright/default.aspx (http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/legal/intellectualproperty/copyright/default.aspx)
The security of all our users is of prime importance to Microsoft, and because of that we cannot allow accounts that do not comply with these measures to be hosted on our system.
Let us know should you need further assistance. Don't hesitate to contact us back. Have a blessed day!
Mike, this looks rather odd. How did this start, and how did you contact 'Microsoft'? That closing "Have a blessed day" rings alarm bells - doesn't sound like Microsoft to me.
Hi
Alarm bells would ring with me too. Microsoft have never asked me to change my password and even if they did I wouldn't until I was forced to.
Cheers
Paul
When you say "they asked me to change my password", who are "they" and in what context was this request? When did it come up? Is about the password you use to log into your pc, for access to your microsoft live stuff, or what?
I know Winders 10 seems to want you to have a Live account but I made sure we all had traditional local accounts when I set up our family PCs on Win 10.
Quote from: Dorsetmike on March 22, 2017, 04:01:58 PM
I would not want one of the free ones like hotmail, gmail or yahoo, they seem to attract the majority of hacking.
Quote
I've had a gmail account as a fallback for years and to my recollection have never even received any spam on it - probably because hardly anyone else has a record of it and I don't use it on the interweb.
Super duper scamtastic I'd say! Everything about that feels so wrong. They wouldn't reply in that tone, let alone the salutation. Terrible grammar too. All the hallmarks.
Quote from: Dorsetmike on March 22, 2017, 04:01:58 PM
They asked me to change my password
Password for what, Mike?
The password for MS account, first I knew about it was when I tried to log on to Skype
Hmmm, and by what mechanism did you contact them? Was there a pop up asking you to contact them or anything?
Your Skype password is unique though, it's not a master "Microsoft" password. In fact there really isn't such a thing.
I will eat my hat if that's a genuine Microsoft help email.
Have you run a virus check? Microsoft's inbuilt one is better than most free (or paid) offerings, just ensure definitions are up to date.
Quote from: njee20 on March 22, 2017, 09:55:27 PM
Your Skype password is unique though, it's not a master "Microsoft" password. In fact there really isn't such a thing.
Not necessarily true. Skype is now built into Hotmail, my Skype is linked to my Microsoft account which does act as a master account for all sorts of MS stuff.
Quote from: njee20 on March 22, 2017, 09:55:27 PM
Hmmm, and by what mechanism did you contact them? Was there a pop up asking you to contact them or anything?
Your Skype password is unique though, it's not a master "Microsoft" password. In fact there really isn't such a thing.
I will eat my hat if that's a genuine Microsoft help email.
Have you run a virus check? Microsoft's inbuilt one is better than most free (or paid) offerings, just ensure definitions are up to date.
Good advice. It might also be worth running the free version of Malwarebytes
:beers:
Just a thought Dorsetmike. Have you tried logging in to your Microsoft account directly through their login page. If you can without being asked to change your password then your Skype problem probably is a scam.
:beers:
QuoteMicrosoft is implementing a security feature that will ask for a code when you try to access your account, billing, security information page and some Microsoft services or apps.
I had this a year or so back with my hotmail account,i just set up another hotmail account ,with a random user name and password and deleted the email contents once the main account had been verified.
Mike, if this isn't a scam I'll eat my tail feathers.
As others have said, it has all the hallmarks of nefarious activity by unsavoury people out to do no good.
Somehow they have got you in a loop that gives the appearance that you are contacting Microsoft, when in fact you are just recontacting them. It's a classic scammers trick and strongly suggests your computer may have been subject to an attack.
No reputable company will ever contact you in this way and ask you to change a password or reveal personal details.
Get the computer virus checked as suggested earlier, and make no further contact with whoever is trying to coerce you in this way.
Quote from: ntpntpntp on March 22, 2017, 09:59:37 PM
Quote from: njee20 on March 22, 2017, 09:55:27 PM
Your Skype password is unique though, it's not a master "Microsoft" password. In fact there really isn't such a thing.
Not necessarily true. Skype is now built into Hotmail, my Skype is linked to my Microsoft account which does act as a master account for all sorts of MS stuff.
Interesting, I stand corrected. My Lync ("Skype for business") account is included with everything, but Skype itself has remained totally standalone.
There have been problems with Microsoft log in servers in the last few days. The message you had doesn't look like a Microsoft message. They do like to have alternate email and mobile phone details for your account. If you don't supply them you do get a request to do so. As far as I know if you don't supply the information it might be slightly harder to recover your password if you forget it but nothing more than that unless you opt for two factor login where after giving your ID and password you then have to give a random number that is sent to you by text.
Like most IT companies they are obsessed with collecting data on users.
My take on it...
Someone is tricking you into changing your password. The process to change it is legit, with the need for a secondary email address/phone number.
"Microsoft Support" are not legit, my guess is they will somehow obtain your new password, key logging or something, but can't circumvent real processes. Hence the very odd email saying what a pain it is.
That may be too advanced, and it may be as simple as a fake "change password" screen, but then I'd have thought they'd get rid of two factor authorisation.
Would certainly be interested to know how you contacted support, Mike?
ever heard of google?
I've now got a keyboard problem, I use a kvm switch torun 2 PC's on 1 k/b, mouse & monitor, k/b worksfine on tge other PC but onthis one I get no alpha-numeric characters, but shift,ctrl and the "media" keys work.
I'm having to use the "on screen" k/b hence some of the typos! Have to type into note pad ©/paste.
I hae the same problem trying to log into onedrive as with skype so don't see it as hack situation.
I originallyfollowed the link from the failed log in, that is what appears to have triggered the initial
change password email.
Just done a system restore, K/B now working,but still can not access Skype etc, password problem still; any suggestions for an alternative IM with file transfer?
Microsoft authentication servers affecting one drive, outlook, Xbox, skype and microsoft 360 have been having problems over the last few days with the entire network down at one point. Anything that required logging onto Microsoft to run was affected.
That would fit the problems I've been having.
Mmm, not really. That wouldn't force a password change, and wouldn't explain a response from 'Microsoft Support' in poor English. If anything if they had a server down I'd expect traffic to be so high that you'd get a generic reply, and maybe a personal one after a week or so!
What email address did your response come from? Not fool proof. It still feels extremely dodgy to me.
Careful Mike, just because a scenario fits what you experience it doesn't mean the actors are playing fair. In this case I suspect they are capitalising upon reality to give some sort of weight to the idea they may be genuine. All scammers are opportunists - a real problem with servers is just such an opportunity.
I'll say it again, if what you are experiencing is genuine I'll eat my tail feathers.
The code that the original "Support" email is describing is part of the two-factor authentication system that MS implemented some time ago. Various other providers have done similar things.
In MS's case it doesn't require an alternate email or a mobile - the code can be sent by voice message to a non-text capable phone (e.g. a landline). See the instructions on this MS Support page (https://support.microsoft.com/en-gb/help/12428/microsoft-account-security-info-and-security-codes).
But FWIW, I'll add my voice to the clamour - that "Support" email does not have the "feel" of a genuine MS email, especially one addressing an absolutely bog standard enquiry, where you'd expect a cut & paste of some off-the-shelf professionally written text, and usually a link to the relevant support web page explaining the practice. On the other hand, you got it by following a link from a failed login. To fake that would require that your machine had already been compromised, I think.
Well, a link from a pop up telling him to change his password. I agree that a degree of compromise was required to get that far, but it's not a huge leap of faith.
Yes, I would strongly suspect that some form of compromise of the computer may already taken place, hence the need to do a thorough up-to-date virus and malware check.
Mike, if you are unsure in any way how to proceed, look for direct assistance from either someone you trust who knows about or professional help. Under no circumstances allow anybody to remotely access your computer, or follow any advice that requires you to reveal any of your passwords to ANYONE.
I've run AVG, nowt drastic there, done a system restore, I've abandoned Skype, only used it with one contact recently so no real loss also abandoned onedrive, didn't really need it as well as Dropbox, plus saves £3.99 a month.
This is probably not relevant, but for the last 3(?) days, my laptop has been giving me the usual installing update, do not turn off your computer message. After what seems an age, the message then comes up that the update can not be installed and the computer is "undoing the changes". This seems to take at least an hour each time. :veryangry:. I have just done a google check for the update number - KB4013429 - and apparently there is a know fault with the update. :censored:
Anybody else have an update problem?
Quote from: Dorsetmike on March 23, 2017, 10:15:34 PM
I've run AVG, nowt drastic there, done a system restore, I've abandoned Skype, only used it with one contact recently so no real loss also abandoned onedrive, didn't really need it as well as Dropbox, plus saves £3.99 a month.
Sounds good Mike. :thumbsup: Here's wishing you troublefree - and cheaper - computing.
Quote from: escafeld on March 23, 2017, 11:40:12 PM
Just checked my PC and the update successfully installed on 15 March. Sorry
Huh! :confused1:. At least having googled the problem, I know it's not just me. Is your set up Win 10 x64?
Addit: Having got the additional information from escafeld whilst posting the above, I will have a look - thanks.
Awww microsoft and those passwords Mike are Haven aren't they. Seriously Mike most providers now ask for an alternate email or other form of ID it can get frustrating when it won't accept what you are typing, especially if you have loads of login's to different websites for which almost all of us have. How do you stop scammers, it's one of those questions that is hard to answer!. They are getting more and more sophisticated in their attempts, i am now running apple and it seems ok to me, although i am sure they can get hacked too.
The email you had, like other members have stated is more then likely a scam, i agree with others that they wouldn't put that at the end of their email (Have a blessed day!) Microsoft are a bit more professional i think.
Happy Modelling Mike and i hope you get your problem solved and with the help from all the members on here i am sure you will. :thumbsup:
Hi
At the weekend I had an issue trying to login to my laptop with a password I knew was correct. Turns out that one of the recent Microsoft updates had installed the US language pack and had changed my keyboard layout. As my password contains one of the characters that moves between a UK and US keyboard I was not typing what I thought I was.
What a stupid thing to do by Microsoft.
Cheers
Paul
Quote from: PaulCheffus on March 29, 2017, 09:40:44 AM
Hi
At the weekend I had an issue trying to login to my laptop with a password I knew was correct. Turns out that one of the recent Microsoft updates had installed the US language pack and had changed my keyboard layout. As my password contains one of the characters that moves between a UK and US keyboard I was not typing what I thought I was.
What a stupid thing to do by Microsoft.
Cheers
Paul
For anyone using Win 10, you
can disable system updates, regardless of what most people say.
I bought a new Win10 laptop last year, I spent a lot of money to get a really quick machine (45 seconds switch on to useable including loading e-mails), the first "system" update doubled the start up time and spread the disease known as Cortana throughout the system. I backed the update out, spent two hours undoing all the changes and disabled system updates.
You can't turn off system updates through Control Panel. If you Google "disable Win10 system updates " there is a simple (tick-box easy) way to disable "system" updates. It's easy to reverse if required and causes no problems. You
cant disable security updates but that's not such a bad thing with MicroShaft.
12 months later, the laptop still boots in 45 seconds and works perfectly. Oh yes, and I never use MS web browser, Firefox is more stable.
:thumbsup:
What's with "MicroSloth"/"MicroShaft" etc? They bear little resemblance to the company name and they're not particularly witty. The actual company name is shorter!
Each to their own, eh.
I find those names funny.
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 10:53:27 AM
What's with "MicroSloth"/"MicroShaft" etc? They bear little resemblance to the company name and they're not particularly witty. The actual company name is shorter!
Hi
How about Micro :censored: then as its the same length and conveys the same feeling.
Cheers
Paul
Took the words out of my mouth so to speak Paul, just ways of expressing our displeasure with the company.
Quote from: Bealman on March 29, 2017, 11:13:33 AM
Each to their own, eh.
I find those names funny.
Precisely :thumbsup:
Paul
And yet everyone buys their products and help keep Bill Gates as the world's richest man!
There's always Linux and iOS for the haters!
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 11:39:05 AM
And yet everyone buys their products and help keep Bill Gates as the world's richest man!
There's always Linux and iOS for the haters!
For the vast majority of the population, they have to buy Micro**** as there is no viable alternative. Linux and iOS is fine for the more technically minded, but a lot of add on proprietary software won't be suitable for Linux and may not be available for IOS. Hence people HAVE to turn to Micro****.
Bill Gates and his company have got rich by producing a second rate product. Which then is superseded by a "new" version that "doesn't have those problems any more, this version is perfect". So people buy it believing that it will make their computer problems go awy. Only it doesn't. It just produces different problems. But, "dont worry, we've got a new platform in development that'll solve those problems ".
...and so the gravy train of Micro**** rolls on...
...and on...
...and on!
There is very little in any Micro**** operating system for the general populous that wasn't in XP.
But if they don't keep rolling out "better" (mainly unnecessary) software they go out of business.
It gets purchased as there is no real alternative.
:computerangry:
I moved to Apple a few years back for various reasons and they too have their problems. Sad thing is, 'Apple' is a short word and using 'App :censored:' is meaningless, so Microcrap users have a much better choice of derogatory nomenclature.
:jealous:
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 11:39:05 AM
And yet everyone buys their products and help keep Bill Gates as the world's richest man!
There's always Linux and iOS for the haters!
Hi
I don't have a choice as the company I work for uses Windows all my development has to be on the Windows platform.
Cheers
Paul
QuoteLinux and iOS is fine for the more technically minded,
Not at all,put in dvd and boot from it,answer a couple of questions,make a coffee and come back to fully functional operating system that will do what most home users want a computer to do
Quotebut a lot of add on proprietary software won't be suitable for Linux
Apart from games ,i bought an xbox for that as it was cheaper than upgrading the old computer ,theres often a linux alternative,and most other software plays nicely in virtual box or under wine.
About the only decent thing micro$oft has made over the years was the original intellimouse track ball
Many of the common programs that are used, such as Office (particularly Word and Excel and Outlook); Adobe Lightroom and Photoshop; The better known finance packages; anyrail and many others do not run on Linux. Unless you run them under Wine which is just another bit of hassle for users and defeats the object of running Linux.
Ok there are other similar products that will run in Linux but they are not Microsoft compatible products and are therefore not the programs of choice for most people.
:beers:
My laptop runs Vista (yes, Vista! Never had an issue with it ), but Firefox informs me that of September this year, it will no longer support Vista.
Ah well, like so many other things in life, I'll worry about it when it happens. :worried:
Quote from: Bealman on March 29, 2017, 01:50:19 PM
My laptop runs Vista (yes, Vista! Never had an issue with it ), but Firefox informs me that of September this year, it will no longer support Vista.
Ah well, like so many other things in life, I'll worry about it when it happens. :worried:
I've got the same problem with my wife's old desktop (or is that my old wife's desktop :hmmm: ).
It won't support Explorer, Chrome and soon Firefox. In addition, Vista support is about to end.
The hardware is too old to run anything newer.
What it is to get old .... Talking about computers, not me of course!!
:beers:
:laughabovepost:
Yeah, nobody seems to have heard of the old saying "if it works, don't fix it" anymore. :beers:
Quote from: daffy on March 29, 2017, 12:13:50 PMso Microcrap users have a much better choice of derogatory nomenclature.
:jealous:
Microcrap? Really? How is that funny?! What am I missing?
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 02:16:51 PM
Quote from: daffy on March 29, 2017, 12:13:50 PMso Microcrap users have a much better choice of derogatory nomenclature.
:jealous:
Microcrap? Really? How is that funny?! What am I missing?
How is it
not funny?
:firefox:
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 02:16:51 PM
Quote from: daffy on March 29, 2017, 12:13:50 PMso Microcrap users have a much better choice of derogatory nomenclature.
:jealous:
Microcrap? Really? How is that funny?! What am I missing?
A sense of humour?
Seriously, please stop trying to enforce your own grammatical preferences on others, it's getting very tiring.
If people want to call it Microsloth, Microcrap, or anything else that doesn't fall fowl of the forum rules then they're quite at liberty to do so.
Paul
QuoteMany of the common programs that are used, such as Office (particularly Word and Excel and Outlook);.
QuoteOk there are other similar products that will run in Linux but they are not Microsoft compatible products
Rubbish,most linux distros come with libre office already installed, legally free of charge ,and the files they produce are compatible with most flavours of micro$oft office packages,unlike some versions of office which cant deal with file formats produced by a different version of there same software.Gimp is as good as photoshop,and a dam sight cheaper,lightroom,no idea but id bet money theres more than 1 decent free program out there.
QuoteUnless you run them under Wine which is just another bit of hassle
Hassle? once wines installed any compatable doze software works like any other piece of software,click on it and it runs,no hassle wot so ever
QuoteThe hardware is too old to run anything newer.
whats the hardware spec? my 9 year old ex vista machine runs win 10 without any problems,or of course you could get the penguin on there.
Quote from: njee20 on March 29, 2017, 02:16:51 PM
Quote from: daffy on March 29, 2017, 12:13:50 PMso Microcrap users have a much better choice of derogatory nomenclature.
:jealous:
Microcrap? Really? How is that funny?! What am I missing?
:hmmm:
It's so much funnier now. Thanks for your viewpoint.
You prefer Linux - thats fine I respect your choice. I and 99 percent of computer users prefer Microsoft because it has world wide acceptance as have many of the standard programs that run on it. I have tried a number of versions of Linux and the Office clones and photo editors and find them unsatisfactory in many ways.
I have noted your opinions on Linux but I'll stick with Windows thanks.
Let's just agree to differ.
:beers:
I tried Linux some years ago, but didn't stick with it after it classed my new OKI colour laser as being only good for a paper weight. It also would not run the photo editor I've been using since 1991 (updated to 2003 when Corel bought it and buried it having taken what bits they wanted) looked at Gimp, didn't fancy a new learning curve; it does all I need, not broke so why fix OK so I have to run it in XP mode but it runs.
Quote from: Dorsetmike on March 29, 2017, 04:11:49 PM
I tried Linux some years ago, but didn't stick with it after it classed my new OKI colour laser as being only good for a paper weight. It also would not run the photo editor I've been using since 1991 (updated to 2003 when Corel bought it and buried it having taken what bits they wanted) looked at Gimp, didn't fancy a new learning curve; it does all I need, not broke so why fix OK so I have to run it in XP mode but it runs.
You must be talking Corel Paintshop Pro (now up to version X9) note the X !!
I used to use older versions of that all the time and it was pretty much as good as Photoshop all those years ago. Gave up with Paintshop Pro a few years back and now occasionally use Photoshop Elements and mostly LightRoom. I've found that images from good modern digital cameras don't need a lot of editing (unless you want the piccies of your misses to look like a nubile teenager) and Lightroom suits me down to the ground.
Tried Gimp but - so difficult to get your head round it. It has its fans though and I've seen brilliant results from people who no how to use it.
:beers:
Quoteafter it classed my new OKI colour laser as being only good for a paper weight
Things like this were very common a few years back,mainly down to manufactures making there devices windows only compatible to save a few quid,thankfully those days are almost gone,although the intel/micro$oft cartel still seem to be trying there damndest to make life awkward for those who dont want to to run the latest version of doze on the latest hardware.
Quote from: Sprintex on March 29, 2017, 02:32:02 PM
A sense of humour?
Seriously, please stop trying to enforce your own grammatical preferences on others, it's getting very tiring.
If people want to call it Microsloth, Microcrap, or anything else that doesn't fall fowl of the forum rules then they're quite at liberty to do so.
I don't see anything grammatical about it - it is just tiresome and frankly quite childish.
IIRC you removed a link to a Rage Against the Machine cover for its use of a swear word (despite being a widely played no 1 - think of the children :o ), yet you seem happy to condone the use of crap or other thinly veiled swear words in this thread...
QuoteYou must be talking Corel Paintshop Pro (now up to version X9) note the X !!
No, Micrografx Picture Publisher, bought out by Corel in 2002, they contiued issuing V10 for a few months then buried it and used some of the bits in Paintshop.
I started with the first colour version (V2) came with my first scanner in '91.
Quote from: red_death on March 29, 2017, 06:51:18 PM
IIRC you removed a link to a Rage Against the Machine cover for its use of a swear word (despite being a widely played no 1 - think of the children :o ), yet you seem happy to condone the use of crap or other thinly veiled swear words in this thread...
'Crap' isn't a swear word, and I don't see any "thinly veiled swear words" in this thread either. People have in some cases used four asterisks without any hint as to the missing letters so that could be anything, and only if they HAD included some of the letters so as to point to a particular swear word would that have been against the forum rules.
And in another case the correct emoticon has been used so no problem.
Paul
Quote from: Dorsetmike on March 29, 2017, 07:04:20 PM
QuoteYou must be talking Corel Paintshop Pro (now up to version X9) note the X !!
No, Micrografx Picture Publisher, bought out by Corel in 2002, they contiued issuing V10 for a few months then buried it and used some of the bits in Paintshop.
I started with the first colour version (V2) came with my first scanner in '91.
Ah yes I remember now I used a number of versions of the Micrografx program and then In its Paintshop Pro guise I had few versions before I dumped it. Full of bugs I recall, but features were good in my opinion.
:beers:
Quote from: red_death on March 29, 2017, 06:51:18 PM
I don't see anything grammatical about [Microsloth etc.] - it is just tiresome and frankly quite childish.
I'm with you on this, what's the point of using a silly name? It lends no substance to the point being made. If you have a comment/opinion about Microsoft products then call the company by its name.
I do remember a humorous column that used to run on the back of Computer Weekly years ago, supposedly the diary of an IT Department manager. It used to feature comic-fictitious company names such as Macroshaft and Infernal Busted Machines, and references to politicians of the day such as Trendy Blur. In that context it was indeed a fun read when it arrived on my desk with it's "in jokes" on the IT industry and life in a typical IT department.
:sleep:
:dighole:
:moony:
Quote from: Sprintex on March 29, 2017, 07:08:01 PM
Quote from: red_death on March 29, 2017, 06:51:18 PM
IIRC you removed a link to a Rage Against the Machine cover for its use of a swear word (despite being a widely played no 1 - think of the children :o ), yet you seem happy to condone the use of crap or other thinly veiled swear words in this thread...
'Crap' isn't a swear word, and I don't see any "thinly veiled swear words" in this thread either. People have in some cases used four asterisks without any hint as to the missing letters so that could be anything, and only if they HAD included some of the letters so as to point to a particular swear word would that have been against the forum rules.
And in another case the correct emoticon has been used so no problem.
Paul
I hate to disagree with a mod but I disagree (even after a fair bit of googling). This is a family forum and if I used this kind of word round by family or friends I'm sure I'd still receive a short yet well defined and painful slap. I hate to see this word used as often as it does on here.
I never said I condoned it's use, I said it's not a swear word and therefore not against forum rules, just stating facts ;)
Paul
Where may we find this de facto list of swear words?
Google defines crap as vulgar, and the Cambridge Dictionary (I don't have the OED on my phone) calls it offensive. The same terms are used for other 4 letter words I guess you'd rather we didn't use. I'd like to see which other words can actually be used as they're not swear words...
FWIW I agree with the majority, I think it's offensive and shouldn't be used if we're maintaining a "family friendly" policy.
Quote from: njee20 on April 02, 2017, 07:44:00 AM
Where may we find this de facto list of swear words?
In the absence of a list lets start our own...
I'll contribute the following as a starting point:
Great
Western
Diesel
Double
Ho
;)
:laughabovepost: :laughabovepost:
Funny as that is, this section is called Computer Help, and if everyone refers to the original post, it is quite obvious that this thread has gone seriously off topic.
I am therefore looking at locking it.
The original issue was addressed by page three of the thread, and that is reason in itself to lock it.
:locked:
Quote from: njee20 on April 02, 2017, 07:44:00 AM
Where may we find this de facto list of swear words?
Google defines crap as vulgar, and the Cambridge Dictionary (I don't have the OED on my phone) calls it offensive. The same terms are used for other 4 letter words I guess you'd rather we didn't use. I'd like to see which other words can actually be used as they're not swear words...
FWIW I agree with the majority, I think it's offensive and shouldn't be used if we're maintaining a "family friendly" policy.
I think we all have a pretty good idea of which words are vulgar within the UK :o and using a dictionary is a good reference point. However we are not just a UK forum and that is where it becomes a little harder to be precise about what is unacceptable and what is not. For example, crap is no longer defined as being vulgar by the New Oxford American Dictionary and the Cambridge American dictionary states that it is UK offensive. Plus craps is a dice game - so it would be hard to allow craps but not crap. The best policy is to use the censored :censored: smiley if one is not sure what is vulgar and what is not