Cars are getting bigger

Started by TrevL, April 24, 2018, 07:40:21 PM

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TrevL

Whilst taking my dog for a walk, I always walk through a council car park to get where I'm going.  Today there was old Austin Mini (good nick for it's age) and parked next to it was a 2017 model and the size difference was phenomenal.  Thinking about it, every incarnation of most models is bigger than the last. Think Ford Focus, Astras, Polos, Golfs, even the once miniscule Fiat 500 is now on steroids. Given that todays engines are far more effecient than of old, surely putting one of these new engines in a yesteryear body size would give much superior economy both in terms of fuel used and during the manufacturing process? Also traffic jams would be shorter.  Discuss.
Cheers, Trev.


Time flys like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana!

Skyline2uk

This is is a topic we in this household (and extended households) often discuss.

Being proud owners of one of the last "original" minis (badged as a Rover Mini Seven) we refer to the BMW offerings as "Bigs".

All ranges are indeed expanding, literally.

Case in point; VW lineup;

Used to be Polo, Golf, Passat I'm increasing size.

Now, the Polo has expanded to such a size it's as big as an old Golf, and the former Polo slot is taken up by the Fox and then the "Up!".

It's not just old product lines either, as an owner of a MK3 Focus I can clearly see its size increase over a MK1.

The reason? Well in a word, safety.

Crash regulations and the frankly astonishing results driven by Euro Ncap tests mean that cars are extraordinarily safe.

Image a Rover Mini (made from tinfoil frankly) doing a head on at 40mph....shudder.

Finally, there is a sort of arms-race going on. Those "SUV" things (Freelander, X5, M-Class etc etc) bought by families cause others to do so, thinking they need more physical metal to protect them from being hit by, well, other SUVs!

Skyline2uk

zwilnik

Some of the size increase is due to extra safety features (bigger survival cell, larger crumple zones etc) but a lot is purely the fashion towards SUVs. I've got one of the first gen BMW Minis from back when the idea was to make it a Mini. It's quick, nimble and fairly fuel efficient. A couple of years back I had one of the new Cooper S models as a loaner while mine was being repaired and it was awful. It wasn't anything like a Mini and handled like a truck.
Needless to say I won't be getting one of the newer ones if my current one ever gives up the ghost.

joe cassidy

Maybe it's because people are getting bigger ?

Are today's sofas, beds, etc. bigger than in the 1960s ?

Best regards,


Joe

davidinyork

Quote from: joe cassidy on April 24, 2018, 08:34:51 PM
Are today's sofas, beds, etc. bigger than in the 1960s ?

Today's train seats (and legroom) certainly aren't!

cycletrak9

And car park spaces have grown accordingly. Some of the older city centre multi storey parks are considerably "tighter" than the spaces in newly developed retail parks.

njee20

The current Audi Q7, Range Rover and Volvo XC90 (IIRC) are all bigger than a 'standard' parking space. So you can park them perfectly and not be able to get out if people are both sides.

Even ignoring safety there's so much more under the bonnet of a car now you'd never fit it all in an old Mini!

Would shorter traffic jams actually be advantageous? Surely it's more about the number of vehicles!

I must say I much prefer my modern Golf to an older Polo sized one! 

Newportnobby

Quote from: cycletrak9 on April 24, 2018, 09:45:38 PM
And car park spaces have grown accordingly. Some of the older city centre multi storey parks are considerably "tighter" than the spaces in newly developed retail parks.

I've found the opposite, really. It strikes me car park spaces are becoming narrower so they can squeeze more cars in and thus increase returns. Also, going by the knocks my cars have been getting over the years, my theory is borne out :veryangry:

PLD

I think it was the model before the current Golf GTI that was being reviewed on Top Gear. "It has exactly double the Horsepower of the original... However it is slightly more than double the weight..."  :doh:

Actually the latest Astra is marginally smaller than the previous model (Estates are within 5mm length & width of the model before last) on the outside yet have slightly more room on the inside, so it can be done...

Portpatrick

Car park spaces are rarely sufficient for the monstrous beats so many manufacturers are turning out and selling.  It may be their owners cannot get out or in when cars are parked either side.  But I have had to engage in back wrecking gymnastics to get in my current model Golf from the nearside when  such monsters have parked each side of me.  But in St Albans some months ago a couple my age were bemused to find that even though we both drove Golfs, the space widths made getting in for stiffening middle aged occupants tricky.  And don't get me started on the thoughtless whatsits who park  even normal cars across 2 spaces.  I wish the peaked cap brigade would book them for such offences.

bridgiesimon

It is cos car designers are railway modellers and are making sure there is room for lots of trains!!

Si

RailGooner

#11
Quote from: Skyline2uk on April 24, 2018, 08:11:38 PM
This is is a topic we in this household (and extended households) often discuss.

Being proud owners of one of the last "original" minis (badged as a Rover Mini Seven) we refer to the BMW offerings as "Bigs".

All ranges are indeed expanding, literally.

Case in point; VW lineup;

Used to be Polo, Golf, Passat I'm increasing size.

Now, the Polo has expanded to such a size it's as big as an old Golf, and the former Polo slot is taken up by the Fox and then the "Up!".

It's not just old product lines either, as an owner of a MK3 Focus I can clearly see its size increase over a MK1.

The reason? Well in a word, safety.

Crash regulations and the frankly astonishing results driven by Euro Ncap tests mean that cars are extraordinarily safe.

Image a Rover Mini (made from tinfoil frankly) doing a head on at 40mph....shudder.

Finally, there is a sort of arms-race going on. Those "SUV" things (Freelander, X5, M-Class etc etc) bought by families cause others to do so, thinking they need more physical metal to protect them from being hit by, well, other SUVs!

Skyline2uk

Totally agree. I remember my 73 (ish) Mini with great fondness. Yes it was terribly inadequate for touring, as evidenced when the gearbox spectacularly blew up in the outside lane of the M6 while overtaking a BMW M3! >:D But around town and on quiet back roads it was so nimble and easy.

It was a real joy to drive. Throwing it round hairpin bends à la Paddy Hopkirk. Zipping through impossibly narrow gaps. Stuck in a traffic jam - switch off the engine and enjoy the quiet and absence of rattling. Throwing it round hairpin bends à la Paddy Hopkirk. Reversing in to parking spaces with the merest rearward glance, confident that even if both neighbouring cars opened their doors my tiny clown car would miss with feet to spare. Throwing it round hairpin bends à la Paddy Hopkirk. :D

I don't drive now, because I hate it. I'm happier taking the bus, paying someone else to have the stress. MBH drives a Focus - as big as a bus but only seats five! Asked what car I'd buy if I won the lottery, I'll answer an original Mini for fun, or three.

daffy

Perhaps it's already been done on some Audi or BMW, but with all the modern electronics on new cars these days - Lane assist, cameras and sensors, et al - I foresee a time when I'll come back to my Golf, or whatever, where I left it in a multi story 1980's car park to find it sandwiched between the ubiquitous concrete pillar (that usually straddles the bay marker-lines) and some ginormous beast of an SUV cum 4x4, with barely enough space between them to squeeze a lemon.

But I will not be phased, angered or irritated by this all too familiar scenario, for I will simply press a button on my key and my car will slowly and silently roll out from its enclave. After all, that is how all the cars will have been 'sardined' into their spaces in the first place.

Of course, this dream scenario (or is it a nightmare :hmmm:) has one obvious flaw: it will require me (along with everyone else) to buy a new car with all the necessary bells and whistles, which, being a poor old pensioner scraping by on the fringes of the consumer society  :), is something I can't afford to do.

2nd flaw: I arrive at my car, press the key button, and, due to a 'minor electronic glitch', 37 other vehicles in the building simultaneously roll out of their spaces, totally blocking all access and egress. My car, however, ignores all commands and remains trapped and immobile. :doh:
Mike

Sufferin' succotash!

njee20

#13
Remote parking available on E-Class and BMW 7-Series, and no doubt others by now:


Quote from: PLD on April 24, 2018, 10:23:09 PM
I think it was the model before the current Golf GTI that was being reviewed on Top Gear. "It has exactly double the Horsepower of the original... However it is slightly more than double the weight..."  :doh:

The mk1 GTI had 110ps, the mk6 had 210ps, the latest mk7 has up to 240ps if you still want back seats. Weight increased from c900kg to c1400kg, and 0-60 time decreased from 9 seconds to 6, so it's an amusing anecdote, but not quite true, particularly given the fact the newer one has power steering, air con, ABS, ESC etc etc! I know which I'd rather own, drive and crash too, even if both were identical performance stats, although let's be honest a 9 second 0-60 time in 1975 from a family hatchback is pretty damned impressive!

The fact the current Golf R does 0.60 in 4.5 seconds is madness, that was supercar speed not long ago. And they're still not massive, just a bit bigger than 40 years ago!

davidinyork

Quote from: njee20 on April 25, 2018, 07:54:07 AM
Remote parking available on E-Class and BMW 7-Series, and no doubt others by now:
Presumably it's not currently legal to use that on a public road?

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