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Author Topic: Fairway Junction  (Read 2282 times)

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Offline kierang

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #30 on: January 08, 2018, 10:57:43 am »
Funnily enough, my Britannia has no issues whatsoever with a crossover, it's just the #4 turnout it can't deal with  :confused2:

Depends what you mean by a crossover, if itís the Kato double (scissors) crossover then thatís a #6  :thumbsup:

The Kato single crossovers are #4.

Ah, ok, I have the double crossovers (x 2)  :thumbsup:

Offline MalcolmAL

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #31 on: January 08, 2018, 11:07:16 am »
NPN - you would think Kato could resolve the issue somehow? But I suppose their own rolling stock
, so no need to worry about it in Japan?
That is what I was told by a member in Japan when I had a moan about the #4 defect !

Just in case you have not seen :- there are a few sites on the web describing a modification to resolve it. Involves filing a notch in the fixed rail into which the moving blade can fit out of the way. It is a bit of a "thing" to have to do to an expensive new point that is under warranty though, which is why I have not gone down the Kato route (yet!)

Offline MalcolmAL

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #32 on: January 08, 2018, 11:36:13 am »
there are a few sites on the web describing a modification to resolve it.
Found one, John Sing I think was one of the first to describe it a few years ago.
http://www.pbase.com/atsf_arizona/kato_4_turnout_tuning&page=all

Offline Train Waiting

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #33 on: January 08, 2018, 11:58:31 am »
NPN - you would think Kato could resolve the issue somehow? But I suppose their own rolling stock is modern image and not ropey Dapol steam locos, so no need to worry about it in Japan?


I'm very glad you have found such a neat solution for your 'Britannia'.  The plan looks good.

Not all Kato is modern image:



The driver of D9007 Pinza got a fright earlier today!  The SP 'GS-4' dwarfs the 'Deltic' but is, of course, to a smaller scale.  Kato also do some Japanese steam locomotives which look very nice.  Kato is very much a system and everything works well together.

All the best.

John
'Why does the Disney Castle work so well?  Because it borrows from reality without ever slipping into it.'

(Acknowledgement: John Goodall Esq, Architectural Editor, 'Country Life'.)


The Table-Top Railway is a train set trying and failing to be a model railway.

I believe that train sets and model railways are fun.

Offline Invicta Alec

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #34 on: January 08, 2018, 01:37:23 pm »
Funnily enough, my Britannia has no issues whatsoever with a crossover, it's just the #4 turnout it can't deal with  :confused2:


Depends what you mean by a crossover, if itís the Kato double (scissors) crossover then thatís a #6  :thumbsup:

The Kato single crossovers are #4.


Are you sure about that Steve? The 6's are 186mm long. Back to back they 'aint gonna fit into the 310mm  length of the scissors. The scissors are the same profile as 4's surely?




Alec.

« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 01:39:27 pm by Invicta Alec »

Offline Train Waiting

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #35 on: January 08, 2018, 02:41:47 pm »
Funnily enough, my Britannia has no issues whatsoever with a crossover, it's just the #4 turnout it can't deal with  :confused2:


Depends what you mean by a crossover, if itís the Kato double (scissors) crossover then thatís a #6  :thumbsup:

The Kato single crossovers are #4.


Are you sure about that Steve? The 6's are 186mm long. Back to back they 'aint gonna fit into the 310mm  length of the scissors. The scissors are the same profile as 4's surely?




Alec.


Steve is absolutely correct, Alec.

What follows is a little bit of a simplification (gross simplification, more like!).

I looked at the scissors crossover on my American layout to confirm my opinion.  Effectively the Kato scissors crossover is like four #6 turnouts cleverly 'cut and shut' to give the standard track spacing.  Hence the much shorter length than one gets making a simple crossover from two #6 turnouts, which results in the wide track spacing.  The bits that matter, switches and common crossing, are, to my eye, identical to the #6 turnouts.  That's the reason I felt happy to use the scissors crossover as I had decided not to use #4 turnouts.  I've had no trouble running trains (not all Kato stock) through the scissors.

I hope this helps and will be glad to provide any other details that might be helpful.

Best wishes.

John

'Why does the Disney Castle work so well?  Because it borrows from reality without ever slipping into it.'

(Acknowledgement: John Goodall Esq, Architectural Editor, 'Country Life'.)


The Table-Top Railway is a train set trying and failing to be a model railway.

I believe that train sets and model railways are fun.

Offline MalcolmAL

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2018, 02:54:00 pm »
Overall a little longer than a pair of #4 not sure about the radius. But I dont think it is the radius of the #4 that is the problem from what I read, it is the blunt end(s) of the switch blades alongside the fixed rail.  Which begs the question of why that does not happen in the #6 and crossover ? Are they recessed or just slimmer in profile ?

« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 02:55:20 pm by MalcolmAL »

Offline newportnobby

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #37 on: January 08, 2018, 03:26:44 pm »
But I dont think it is the radius of the #4 that is the problem from what I read, it is the blunt end(s) of the switch blades alongside the fixed rail.  Which begs the question of why that does not happen in the #6 and crossover ? Are they recessed or just slimmer in profile ?

I wish I knew as if my steamers ran through a #4 point I would seriously consider moving to Unitrack but as things stand will not buy over 60 points and try to create the recesses myself.
Surely Kato are aware of this and, if so, do they consider the UK scene to be too small to bother with alterations?

Offline MalcolmAL

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #38 on: January 08, 2018, 03:35:23 pm »
will not buy over 60 points and try to create the recesses myself.

Surely Kato are aware of this and, if so, do they consider the UK scene to be too small to bother with alterations?
No indeed,

and you would think they are and would, but it has been going on years now,

not just the UK, the mods first appeared in USA, so not just Dapol as ref. previous !!

Offline tutenkhamunsleeping

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #39 on: January 08, 2018, 04:01:38 pm »
Are you sure about that Steve? The 6's are 186mm long. Back to back they 'aint gonna fit into the 310mm  length of the scissors. The scissors are the same profile as 4's surely?

Yes, 100% sure.  The Kato double crossover is effectively four #6s OVERLAPPED in the middle (not back to back) and thus a space-saver.

If it were made of #4s then it would be 248mm in length, as per the single crossovers they do.

Offline Train Waiting

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #40 on: January 08, 2018, 04:23:38 pm »
But I dont think it is the radius of the #4 that is the problem from what I read, it is the blunt end(s) of the switch blades alongside the fixed rail.  Which begs the question of why that does not happen in the #6 and crossover ? Are they recessed or just slimmer in profile ?

I wish I knew as if my steamers ran through a #4 point I would seriously consider moving to Unitrack but as things stand will not buy over 60 points and try to create the recesses myself.
Surely Kato are aware of this and, if so, do they consider the UK scene to be too small to bother with alterations?

I re-did some tests with #4 turnouts when I started to acquire Union Mills locomotives, in the hope that these would be happy with #4 for a British layout.  I was familiar with John Sing's careful work from my US modelling experience (he has a nice AT&SF layout).  With the Union Mills locomotives, I found that the common crossing (the 'frog') caused more difficulties than the switch blades, especially running tender first.  I attacked an innocent turnout with files and a grindstone, which then gave better running, but still not reliable enough for a layout.

John   
'Why does the Disney Castle work so well?  Because it borrows from reality without ever slipping into it.'

(Acknowledgement: John Goodall Esq, Architectural Editor, 'Country Life'.)


The Table-Top Railway is a train set trying and failing to be a model railway.

I believe that train sets and model railways are fun.

Offline Invicta Alec

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #41 on: January 08, 2018, 05:39:11 pm »
Are you sure about that Steve? The 6's are 186mm long. Back to back they 'aint gonna fit into the 310mm  length of the scissors. The scissors are the same profile as 4's surely?

Yes, 100% sure.  The Kato double crossover is effectively four #6s OVERLAPPED in the middle (not back to back) and thus a space-saver.

If it were made of #4s then it would be 248mm in length, as per the single crossovers they do.

Thanks for that Steve (and also John). Its the "overlapped" or "cut and shut" bit I was unaware of. Thanks also to other contributors on this. I'm not into steam guys so I can't comment but all 6 of my trains (1,2 and 4 car (D)emu's all run without problem through my #6 points and double crossover. I'm keeping to my original idea of staying away from #4s. Change to Kato Newportnobby and thank me later  :beers:

Alec.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 08:53:52 pm by Invicta Alec »

Offline newportnobby

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #42 on: January 08, 2018, 08:21:23 pm »
Change to Kato Newportnobby

Alec.

Not possible, Alec. I just don't have the room for #6 points :no:

Offline kierang

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2018, 05:16:21 pm »
Hi all.

First station construction has been underway this week. Platform built using a stripwood framework (12mm) to get it to the right height for the Kato track. I then used the Metcalfe platform kit for most of it, and some Metcalfe brick paper for the walls etc. I constructed some steps using the platform edging "slabs".

For info, the platform height is 13mm off the ground, so about 6mm above the top of the Kato tracks. This is about 3mm higher than the Metcalfe platform would be, to account for the higher shoulders of the Kato track. I checked this against the NSE Class 47 and it comes in about 1mm below the carriage steps, so about right to my eye (give or take 1mm either way !).

Metcalfe Country Station forms the building and the signal box came with the NSE Class 47 "Capital Connection" set. It may, or may not continue to reside at one end of the platform depending on how things develop.

Some photos (need to colour in the building corners to hide the white edges, and remove some of the glue where I got a bit messy. Other than that, pretty pleased with the outcome):











Offline kierang

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Re: Fairway Junction
« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2018, 05:23:14 pm »
Oh, just to note also, I used tracing paper to cover the windows, and black paper for some. This is so that when I install lights the tracing paper shows the room is lit, but you can't see the bulb, and the blacked out windows don't light up. I drill or punch holes in the bottom of all my buildings and when everything is in the right place I will run Christmas tree lights (LEDs) underneath the base board, feeding them through the holes where needed and covering any I don't need with black insulation tape. This seemed to me to be the simplest way of lighting inside the buildings without any fiddly wiring. Street lights are a different story, but I do have some very fine LED Christmas lights which might work for that (the kind you're supposed to scrunch up in an artistic fashion and place inside a vase !).

 

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