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Author Topic: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche  (Read 112195 times)

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Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #1995 on: February 14, 2018, 08:00:57 am »
THat is certainly a very impressive fish train now.

Yes, indeed. I make it 18 white Insulfish vans plus 4 Ice Blue (the post-1963 BR livery for insulated vans and containers) Insulated Vans. I'll post the 4 duplicate white Insulfish vans, to you, tomorrow, Laurence, bringing the grand total to 22 plus 4. Now I know why you have your 9F allocated to this train! In real life, it would, probably, have had some white (or Ice Blue) Insulated Containers on Conflats, too. I envy you the room to run such long trains.
They used to rush over the girder bridge that carried the Great Central over the West Coast Mainline at Rugby.  The 9Fs used to clank vigorously at XP freight speeds.  I don't remember any conflats on them, but I probably wasn't looking that hard.  In those days, the Great Central was the express freight route from the North to the South, avoiding both London and Birmingham.
With kind regards
Laurence

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #1996 on: February 15, 2018, 08:47:32 am »
Yesterday was such a hectic day that I had no time to write up my progress, which had to wait until this morning.  It all began with the first visit from a kitchen fitter to remove the units from the kitchen which would not fit into the new plan.  So I was able to make only four timetable sub-cycles before he arrived, three involving 9744.  It seems that cleaning the track made no difference to 9744, which need a prod to start from the DOWN loops on both of its UP runs and also to get it started from Platform 4 on all three.  In addition, it had a disastrous fit of stalling on the DOWN leg of the branch on its way back to Shipton.  As if that werenít enough, Dicheat Manor required a prod to get started from UP Loop 6, Forthampton Grange required another to get it started from UP Loop 2 and 80119 had a big stall at Point 25 on its way out of the Down loops on its second run.

In the afternoon, we had to run the U3A table tennis group, which meant that most of the afternoon was unavailable for Train Shed duties.  To cap it all, we had bought tickets to see a live relay of Twelfth Night from Stratford, which meant I could only manage a few more minutes in the Train Shed before it was time to go.  This time, I was able to run another four sub-cycles, where 9744 managed to start from Platform 4 on its own on all three of its runs but needed a prod to start from the loops on its first two.  In addition it threw its toys out of the pram twice at Point 43, but then ran perfectly well on its final run.  There were two other incidents.  Firstly, I had missed the step of resetting the points into the goods depot after the local goods entered and so poor 80119 had the ignominy of running into the rear of the train.  That was simply operator error and was soon corrected.

However, at the start of the final sub-cycle, 3846 suddenly stopped and would not respond, no matter what I did.  I remembered that, many months ago, a similar incident had occurred when a loco (which one I forget) had the same problem.  The cause was that its loco ID had become corrupted in its decoder.  So I had to dig out the programming track and connect it up to the controller.  I reprogrammed it to its correct value of ID 3 and that sorted it out.  The fault occurred at the same time as I sent an instruction to 9744, so I can only assume that, somehow, the controller must have sent an erroneous message to 3846, causing it to change its ID to something else.

Anyway, the play was first class (as usual) and I have been able to write everything up this morning.  Letís see what today brings.  I am waiting for a delivery of kiln dried logs, so I should be able to catch up with the timetable and, hopefully get something done on the scenic front.
With kind regards
Laurence

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #1997 on: February 15, 2018, 06:52:15 pm »
Lawrence, while reading this, a little lightbulb lit up in my head. I'm wondering if the various little niggles might all be related. Could it be that there is some sort of cross-talk/interference that is causing problems with the DCC signal? This might explain locos stopping when they shouldn't and chips getting reprogrammed when they shouldn't.

I have no idea whether it's technically possible for DCC equipment to behave this way, but it struck me as a possibility that might have some merit. Quite happy to be shot down in flames on this - just following the lightbulb :)
Tony

'...things are not done by those who sit down to count the cost of every thought and act.' - Sir Daniel Gooch of IKB

Offline Spanners70

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #1998 on: February 15, 2018, 08:12:40 pm »
Iíve follwed this thread for number of months whilst contemplating whether my ďnew buildĒ house truss loft will take a railway or not, as itís the modern truss design but gives potential for about 12m x 3m space whilst having the boards in the V each side of the main space. My worry being the trusses are only about 80x30mm or so but a 7.4m span but at 60cm apart.
As much as I look forward to you regular and excellent posts Laurence, I do wonder about all the track cleaning and your issues and also wonder why. I donít want to build in my loft if I had similar issues. I carnt say I know the solution, but I do wonder as to what may be up be it more droppers for the supply or maybe cv programming (last time I had any railway was early 80s I know diddly sqat squared about dcc but will build that on my project)
I do hope you get it figured out, but Iím really not convinced itís down to track and wheel cleaning on the amount your having to do, must be something a bit more obvious with all your troubles? I just hope you get to the bottom of it all.
Look forward to future installments as your railway develops  :)

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #1999 on: February 15, 2018, 08:31:20 pm »
Today was another busy day, but not in the same way as yesterday.  I was expecting a delivery of kiln-dried logs today, so someone had to be in the house in case the logs appeared.  The only information we had was that they would be delivered between 0800 and 1800. 

I managed a really good session this morning, running the remaining two sub-cycles from yesterday and six more or todayís.  80119 had a London road Bridge episode and 92006 had its train decouple again.  Both of the decoupling events were between fish vans that had been in the train from the beginning and had never decoupled before.  I turned the second van around and there was no recurrence of the problem.  But the main problem we 9744, whose performance steadily deteriorated.  In the end, I used the tiny Track Magic brush with a drop of IPA to lean the inside of the drivers, although there was no immediate improvement.  Then it was time for a coffee break.

After Coffee, 9744 was immeasurably better, so it must have taken a while for the IPA to work on the pickups.  80119 had another London Road Bridge episode and, also, needed a prod to start from DOWN Loop 13.  But, otherwise, everything was OK, apart from 3846, which had a mysterious tender derailment.  During the morning sessions, I came across and abandoned traction tyre, presumably the one that 45206 lost.

After that, I spent the rest of the morning pruning and tidying up at the front.  I then had to wait in for the firewood, so I was able to correct an error that I had found in the revised operating timetable and also, sort out some software problems with two of the U3A Excel workbooks.  Eventually, at afternoon cup-of-tea time, the firewood arrived.  So the rest of the afternoon was spent extracting the firewood from the crate (mounted on a pallet) and stacking it in the wood stacks.  We managed about half today, including using our seven-ton log splitter to split some of the logs that I considered too big to burn directly.

So Iím afraid that I didnít get around to any scenic work again (excuses, excuses).  Nor are there any pictures.  But, tomorrow, I should be in a better position to get to grips with the scenic work.
With kind regards
Laurence

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2000 on: February 15, 2018, 08:35:28 pm »
Lawrence, while reading this, a little lightbulb lit up in my head. I'm wondering if the various little niggles might all be related. Could it be that there is some sort of cross-talk/interference that is causing problems with the DCC signal? This might explain locos stopping when they shouldn't and chips getting reprogrammed when they shouldn't.

I have no idea whether it's technically possible for DCC equipment to behave this way, but it struck me as a possibility that might have some merit. Quite happy to be shot down in flames on this - just following the lightbulb :)
I am concious of possible problems with the DCC system.  It may be the Gaugemaster contoller that is to blame, but there is no way of telling.  I have, in the past, had instances where I have sent control signals to a loco and heard a point change.  I think some of my problems may be due to the fact that I progressed at full speed ahead to get everything running.  If I ever start again, I will be more thorough in my approach.
With kind regards
Laurence

Offline lil chris

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2001 on: February 15, 2018, 08:36:26 pm »
I agree with a lot that has been said in the previous  post, just needing a nudge and stop starting does not sound like track cleaning issues especially after cleaning the track. I have not run trains for ages, a good clean and it was all running, I have  issues with my points which are on my fiddle yard with shorting, but I think I have a answer to that. They are insulfrog points, they all have feeds to them at the toe end, in fact all my track has feeds to it. I can not help wondering if relying on fish-plates connecting each piece of track is proving not reliable enough for the dcc signal.
Lil Chris
My layout here East Lancashire Lines
http://www.ngaugeforum.co.uk/SMFN/index.php?topic=29492.0

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2002 on: February 15, 2018, 08:38:35 pm »
Iíve follwed this thread for number of months whilst contemplating whether my ďnew buildĒ house truss loft will take a railway or not, as itís the modern truss design but gives potential for about 12m x 3m space whilst having the boards in the V each side of the main space. My worry being the trusses are only about 80x30mm or so but a 7.4m span but at 60cm apart.
As much as I look forward to you regular and excellent posts Laurence, I do wonder about all the track cleaning and your issues and also wonder why. I donít want to build in my loft if I had similar issues. I carnt say I know the solution, but I do wonder as to what may be up be it more droppers for the supply or maybe cv programming (last time I had any railway was early 80s I know diddly sqat squared about dcc but will build that on my project)
I do hope you get it figured out, but Iím really not convinced itís down to track and wheel cleaning on the amount your having to do, must be something a bit more obvious with all your troubles? I just hope you get to the bottom of it all.
Look forward to future installments as your railway develops  :)
I think a big lesson learned is slowly, slowly, make sure that every thing is really sound.  The concept of DCC is really sound, but I would really like to get rid of the acceleration and deceleration elements and use a computer control for speed.
With kind regards
Laurence

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2003 on: February 16, 2018, 12:57:05 am »
I have stuck to analogue for the simple reason of economics, having 150 steam locos alone never mind the diesels and from the comments that I have read not only on this thread that those who convert to DCC seem to believe that they do not need to clean track/ as regularly as those of us using analogue, which I would say is a fallacy as despite the increased voltage, current collection still relies on the contact between rail/wheel and then wheel/collector strip. if either is not up to scratch, then troubles follow.
As one of those people who like to see locos travelling at scale speeds, I have found that the only way to achieve this is a strict regime of cleanliness performed on rails, wheels and collector strips, and I seriously doubt that those utilising DCC can ignore this.
for me, the biggest problem with DCC as it currently stands is the lack of ability to discern whether a fault lies in the mechanical or electronic areas - something that BR had much trouble with on the class 50's when the on board computers were not as reliable as todays motive power. it is my belief that DCC is still relatively in its infancy regarding reliability to be considered as simply "plug and play", relying on those who are "experienced" in handling it to get the best results.

Regards,

Alex

Alex

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2004 on: February 16, 2018, 06:54:55 am »
Thanks everyone for your advice and comments.  Just to recap, I have fifteen locos and its only the two paniers that give real trouble, with a bit of support from the 2-6-4 tank now and again.  Bit it's funny that sometimes they are troublesome and then the next time they may be fine again.  The strange thing is that 9744 sometimes just sits there until touched and then (sometimes of its own volition) it sets off immediately at full speed.  So the decoder must have been  receiving the DCC signal and building up speed through the acceleration function, but not delivering power to the motor.  Perhaps the answer may be to fit a much more reliable decoder.  Oh, for a lithium ion powered loco with Wifi control!  The track voltage could then be used to keep the battery charged.
With kind regards
Laurence

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2005 on: February 16, 2018, 07:17:59 am »
Virtually all my locos. have Lenz Silver Mini decoders fitted (by Douglas of Wickness Models). I think it's worth investing in the best decoders. I do have some locos. bought DCC-fitted, e.g. the standard Dapol ones.

Offline Innovationgame

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2006 on: February 16, 2018, 07:34:46 pm »
I had a wonderful dayís running today, with everything (well almost everything) going like clockwork (as opposed to DCC!).  We had to go out early today, but I managed two quick sub-cycles before we went.  Dear old 9744 worked perfectly, as did 80119 and 3846 trundled along at its scale 10mph all the way from the UP loops to the DOWN loops, taking about five minutes altogether between the two tunnel portals. 

Later I ran the eight remaining sub-cycles in the third full cycle and, although it wasnít 100% perfect, it was very pleasantly nearly so.  On its third trip and its 5th trip, 9744 required the very slightest of touches to start from Platform 4, but otherwise ran immaculately.  On its fourth outing, 80119 had a very slight London Road Bridge hesitation, but otherwise was also OK.  The branch goods with 6417 ran perfectly from Norton to Shipton, including a scheduled stop at Platform 4.  However, on the return run, it was reluctant to exit the Shipton loops, but then ran really well until it had a hiccup on the UP leg of the branch line.  But I thought it was a good days operating.

This afternoon began with more log transportation and splitting.  Finally, I had to dismantle the crate and make all the nails safe.  But the pallet will make good future firewood and the crate sides will be used to make kindling.

Then I was able to get back to the Train Shed and make a start on the London Road Bridge.  Hereís the mound with the bridge removed, ready for adding the Shaper Sheet plaster.



The plaster is quite easy to use and I was soon in a position to complete the work and clean up.  You can see the gap I left in the plaster for the roadway to fit.



So, by tomorrow, the plaster should have set and I will be able to start painting ready for adding grass and other items.  I am looking at buying a WWS static grass applicator, so that should be good fun.  In the meantime, I thought it would be nice to show you the current state of Marton Hinmarche.  The London Road Bridge is conspicuous by its absence.



Letís hope tomorrowís running session is as good as todayís.
With kind regards
Laurence

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2007 on: February 16, 2018, 08:12:28 pm »
Iím glad you had a much better running session today Laurence.
Letís hope things settle down now.
You wonít regret getting the WWS static grass applicator. Can I suggest getting the set with glue and layering spray plus some sample grass mixes included.
It's you railway so build it as you want and run whatever you like. The only rule is - ENJOY :
My Layouts -
Port Perran:- Trepol Bay:-

Offline Spanners70

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2008 on: February 17, 2018, 10:52:34 am »
Coming alone nicely nice to see an overall view photo showing the whole layout rather than small sections looking good

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Re: The Train Shed Project - Marton Hinmarche
« Reply #2009 on: February 17, 2018, 12:39:36 pm »
nice to see an overall view photo showing the whole layout rather than small sections looking good

Is "Shed Envy" allowed on this site - that is some railway room!! Looking great.
If it looks right, it probably is right.

 

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