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Poll

Would you buy a crowd-funded Class 116/117/118 DMU?

Yes, at least 1 Class 116
5 (5.2%)
Yes, at least 1 Class 117
13 (13.5%)
Yes, at least 1 Class 118
4 (4.2%)
Yes, at least 1 - it doesn't matter which of the three classes.
27 (28.1%)
Yes, at least 2 different classes
13 (13.5%)
Yes, at least one of each class
6 (6.3%)
No, I wouldn't want any of those.
28 (29.2%)

Total Members Voted: 94

Author Topic: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU  (Read 16957 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online dodger

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #30 on: February 06, 2015, 06:26:35 pm »

Looking a bit more closely at them, body wise the 116/117/118 DMS/DMBS are all possible from two body tools. The 116 is the Derby build and the others are contractor built all to the same basic design although with differences in the power train, but even then a good number wound up with the same power unit as other classes...some wound up with different engines on the same power car! With this potential minefield, and a pretty similar layout across the classes, I'd think a single power unit chassis would be the safest bet to cover them all. This leaves the only major differences all in the cab roof, which if done in the same way as the 121/122 makes the three classes possible from minimal tooling. With 3 body tools and one chassis you could cover the 116-118 DMS and DMBS and class 115 DMBS with its much reduced guards compartment. This does require a different set of roofs for each class, but if the groundwork is done on one set of power cars the rest should come with just a new roof being tooled. Trailers should be fairly interchangeable between them, two toolings (TS and TCL) should really cover most bases.

I'll correct myself and apologise at this point too. Re-reading my diary I noticed that our local sets were generally class 115, 116 or 117 or hybrids thereof, but the regular 4 car units were actually formed from a 116 DMS, 116 TS, 127 TSL and 115 DMBS. It was the difference between the TSL and TCL that I noted, I did think it strange at the time of posting and have referred back to the kodak slides and notes my uncle took to double check so I'll go back and change that initial post to get rid of any confusion.

The 116, 117 and 118 power trains were identical. All originally had Leyland 680 engines, but these were replaced by leyland 1585 in latter days. The differences in the underframe equipment were the battery charging systems and heater control. The 116 had axle driven dynamos and semi auto heaters, whilst the 117 & 118 had engine driven alternators and fully automatic heaters. These differences resulted in different electrical boxes along each side.

Whilst the 3 no 117's were built as 2 car units these acquired the trailers from the 118's reduced to twins. The majority of 117's were London Division units until the delivery of the Turbo's.  Two class 101 TCL were used to make 4 car units. This was always on a temporary basis and there were no permanent 4 car units. Originally the Reading and Southall Depots had their own allocation of 117's but during the early 70's all were allocated to Reading.

Dodger


Offline Portpatrick

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #31 on: February 06, 2015, 06:30:10 pm »
Thanks Stu and Only Me.  I am going to need few more of JB's boxes if all these ideas ever come to fruition.

Offline Zunnan

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #32 on: February 06, 2015, 07:02:27 pm »
Just to be a pedant, the Leyland 1585 is a 680 variant. Originally the engines were built under the BUT banner by AEC, Leyland Albion and Leyland. Some of the 117s carried AEC built BUT engines, most of the units initially had a BUT (Leyland) 680/1 which was later replaced by Leyland 680/1585 (but not all, and some went to scrap with both types fitted) and the 115s had the more powerful Albions. IIRC the 680/1 was originally air cooled and the 680/1585 was water cooled (at least the compressor was) with a slightly higher power output and the visible differences between them was around the fuel pipe mountings and the fuel pump.
Like a Phoenix from the ashes...morelike a rotten old Dog Bone


Offline Only Me

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #33 on: February 06, 2015, 09:39:33 pm »
Hi everyone,

Before speculation and suggestion regarding Kernow's laser scan of their 3 car DMU 116/117/118 goes any further, I think it's only fair to say that their cad/cam is already spoken for, for 'other parties' and other gauges than OO gauge.

I can say no more than that, sorry.

Cheers
Dave

If this is as you say Dave, can you give us a year eg 2016 or something?  Otherwise whats to stop a crowd funding venture in the same way as a Pendolino? As if people pay a deposit they surely wouldnt forefit it and buy elsewhere?

Cheers Paul



Online Ben A

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #34 on: February 06, 2015, 10:35:01 pm »

Hello all,

As with the Pendolino, the only goal is to see the models we want manufactured.

There's plenty of time; we aren't putting any options up for consideration until we have concrete progress to show on the Pendolino, which is probably a good 6 weeks away at least, and then there'd be a four month period while people are Declaring any interest.

And that is assuming a 117 is among the first tranche of announcements, which haven't been chosen yet anyway.

So there is an absolute minimum of 5-6 months before any money would be taken for this model, and quite possibly longer, giving any other manufacturer plenty of time to decide to announce it.

If not us, then best of luck to anyone who decides to go this  - there certainly seems to be interest.

cheers

Ben A.



Offline johnlambert

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #35 on: February 07, 2015, 11:23:51 am »

As with the Pendolino, the only goal is to see the models we want manufactured.


I quite agree, Ben. 

Offline StufromEGDL

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #36 on: February 07, 2015, 11:30:46 am »
Hi Gang,

I, too, would like to see some or all of the 116/117/118 family.......looking at the previous posts, we could probably limit the interest to 116/117 with the 115/118 on the periphery.

Also, without any of the major or minor players in the N Gauge world having announced the model as a project in progress, then there is nothing to stop the Revolution model of showing interest up front from going ahead and either succeeding or falling short.

Although I am not best placed to sponsor this model, it would receive my support...

Later,
Stu from EGDL.
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Offline Chetcombe

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #37 on: February 07, 2015, 04:18:13 pm »
As a West Country modeller these have always been at the top of my wish list (alongside a D600 Warship...). So I would commit to 3 or 4 in green or blue.

Imagine how fantastic these woukd look alongside a couple of Class 121s or 122s :heart2:

Offline Bob G

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2015, 03:53:43 pm »
Please make a 117 before I hack my excessive number of acquired 121 dummies into 117s.

I currently feel a lot safer hacking three 121s into a GRCW 119 with BHE sides - no one has said they want a 119 yet!!!

Bob

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #39 on: February 08, 2015, 09:51:03 pm »
 :offtopicsign:

If you want to do a 119, you be better off starting with a 122 as it has the correct Gloucester Railway Carriage and Wagon Works front end.
Well, that's just not good enough. Some fount of all knowledge you are!  :no:  ;)

Offline Bob G

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2015, 10:23:40 pm »
They are both copies of the Derby end.
The 117 / 121 should be a little more angular than the GRCW version, IMHO.
But they are both better than the old whitemetal ends  ;)

Offline Chris in Prague

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #41 on: July 12, 2015, 07:38:40 pm »
My apologies i meant the front which is the hardest part to make in CAD :).. It would be quite easy to reproduce the sides and roof in CAD... Did these ever make it as far south as Plymouth?

Plymouth Laira had allocated: Class 116, 118 'Suburban' DMUs plus Swindon Cross Country Class 120 DMUs (some 2-car, some 3-car). Plus W55XXX single cars and W56XXX trailer cars and these trailer cars should be an easy-to-produce variant of the suburban DMU cars?
« Last Edit: July 12, 2015, 07:50:07 pm by Chris in Prague, Reason: Updated. »

Offline Roy L S

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #42 on: July 12, 2015, 07:45:50 pm »
Wasn't the 116/117 Family of DMUs one of the most asked for in the most recent NGS wishlist poll?

It does seem to tick a lot of boxes in that it covers the important steam/diesel transition period and BR blue through to some of the 1980s liveries too, plus some in preservation. I don't think they changed that much externally either, upgrades being more to the interiors so not too many tooling variations?

Roy


Offline D1042 Western Princess

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #43 on: July 12, 2015, 09:15:04 pm »
'Real' (1st Generation) DMUs for the WR are very rare in model form, unless you count the bubble cars.
Anything for the WR c1970 livery would be most welcome by me, and I can't think I'm alone..
If it's not a Diesel Hydraulic then it's not a real locomotive.

Offline Chris in Prague

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Re: Suggestion for RevolutioN - Class 116/117/118 DMU
« Reply #44 on: September 06, 2015, 07:35:07 am »
With Bachmann's announcement that they are taking over Kernow's project to make an 00 Class 118 3-car DMU can a N Gauge one be coming too?

 

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